Kaiserreich: Legacy of the Weltkrieg

Gukpard

Gukpard

ZimbabweSaltCo said:
Good question, though I'd say it only really comes to down to Mosley's totalism and I guess a look into that kind of national-syndicalist element of it. Though even then I'd argue he diverges from other ones quite a bit, especially in how he views himself
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I would like to suggest something, and yes, it is a suggestion, not a question...

Going to the point: Totalism is something new, the charter is just released at the beginning of the game, and there was this other mod that played on the fact that fascism is a very disperse and diverse thing, thus you could build your flavour of fascism. My suggestion is that it would be interesting to have a large event chain to decide how totalism will work, like, if it will support national exceptionalism or internationalist cooperation, if women will be integrated, super integrated (with positive actions) or remain the same, if you are going to add X or Y or W in your manifesto, that would be very interesting.
 
Gukpard

Gukpard

Sorry for the double post, but this is about another subject.

@Worffan101 I think I know who can be worse than Moseley.

Arnold Leese. While Moseley is a fascist, Leese was so deep into nazism that he literally added a Swastika on his own fascist moviment flag. He called non antisemite fascists such as Vidkun Quisling as "kosher fascists" (according to tvtropes), I think he is the worse you can go into cursed british figures, worse than anyone on the far right and far left.
 

Twiggierjet

Worffan101 said:
Will Charter Totalism get a more detailed explanation and mechanical growth? I like the concept of it as a hyper-nationalist "red fascism" bordering on 1984 totalitarianism, but it sort of just...exists in game right now, when IMO it should sort of develop and surge in the early game as a reaction to the stresses of the mid 1930s crises and ongoing trade issues in the Internationale.

(I've mentioned upthread that if I were reworking the UoB, it would start with a good third of autdem and natpop support representing closet Royalists, that Mosley converts to his cause (thereby gaining Totalism popularity) over the first year of the game, gaining him a power base that he can then use for a takeover attempt)

Will the Autonomists be less of an obviously bad option?

I believe that I proposed something upthread with each main leader having a mechanical focus--Horner unlocks foci and decisions about prepping the Internationale for war and EXPORTING THE REVOLUTION, the Autonomists want to bring Ireland into the decentralized Union as a socialist republic, Mosley builds up the military and sidelines his political enemies to centralize power, Kenney tries to peacefully resolve conflicts and neutralize strategically significant capitalist states through peaceful negotiation, and Mann tries to keep the unstable governing coalition together--but that's a case where some leaders (Horner, Mosley, arguably Kenney) would be obviously superior to others (Mann, the autonomists). What sort of story/stories is the new setup trying to tell?
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I like most of these ideas but I'm curious as to why deeply reactionary royalists would support a radical like Mosley? I would have the royalists cause trouble but slowly fade away thanks to player action, and have Mosley steal support from the other socialist factions by radicalizing people and painting the others as "incapable of defending the revolution" or something like that.
 
Worffan101

Worffan101

Twiggierjet said:
I like most of these ideas but I'm curious as to why deeply reactionary royalists would support a radical like Mosley? I would have the royalists cause trouble but slowly fade away thanks to player action, and have Mosley steal support from the other socialist factions by radicalizing people and painting the others as "incapable of defending the revolution" or something like that.
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Mosley's supporters would be nationalistic voters, predominantly middle-aged males and some youth, who want a Strong Nation. They wouldn't be particularly attached to the royalist cause for Eddie's sake, just that they remember when Britain Was Strong, and that was when the King was in charge. Mosley promises to Make Britain Strong Again and that sucks a lot of people in.
 

xie323

Gukpard said:
Sorry for the double post, but this is about another subject.

@Worffan101 I think I know who can be worse than Moseley.

Arnold Leese. While Moseley is a fascist, Leese was so deep into nazism that he literally added a Swastika on his own fascist moviment flag. He called non antisemite fascists such as Vidkun Quisling as "kosher fascists" (according to tvtropes), I think he is the worse you can go into cursed british figures, worse than anyone on the far right and far left.
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It's been stated through that the guy worse than Mosley isn't that bad on his own OTL.
 
Vince

Vince

Monthly Donor
I always thought Totalism was just the same as OTL Communism? The Jacobin leader Deat, who's set as a Totalist in-game, is pretty much spelled out as being a Leninist.
 

Twiggierjet

Gukpard said:
I would like to suggest something, and yes, it is a suggestion, not a question...

Going to the point: Totalism is something new, the charter is just released at the beginning of the game, and there was this other mod that played on the fact that fascism is a very disperse and diverse thing, thus you could build your flavour of fascism. My suggestion is that it would be interesting to have a large event chain to decide how totalism will work, like, if it will support national exceptionalism or internationalist cooperation, if women will be integrated, super integrated (with positive actions) or remain the same, if you are going to add X or Y or W in your manifesto, that would be very interesting.
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I really like this idea, I always love these "build your own ideology kind of" moments in mods.
 

Alhistnerd

Vince said:
I always thought Totalism was just the same as OTL Communism? The Jacobin leader Deat, who's set as a Totalist in-game, is pretty much spelled out as being a Leninist.
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Its not - It's more like Nationalist form of Socialism - for example Oswald Mosley, who was a fascist OTL , is a Totalist in Britain. But you do have Communists too. It's a broad catch-all term for Authoritarians who may have some degree of Socialist Beliefs
 
Whiteshore

Whiteshore

Also, is it me or does the SPD vanish into thin air if the Syndies conquer Germany? Wouldn't it make sense for there to be some sort of RadSoc or Syndicalist-aligned SocDem collaborationist faction of the SPD led by people like Otto Grotewohl (who was literally the Premier of East Germany IOTL) in a Syndie victory scenario?
 
Whiteshore

Whiteshore

Worffan101 said:
(I've mentioned upthread that if I were reworking the UoB, it would start with a good third of autdem and natpop support representing closet Royalists, that Mosley converts to his cause (thereby gaining Totalism popularity) over the first year of the game, gaining him a power base that he can then use for a takeover attempt)
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There should be some support for the liberal (SocLib, MarLib, and SocCon) parties which Syndicalist-aligned SocDem factions could coopt as well, in that case.
 
Worffan101

Worffan101

Whiteshore said:
There should be some support for the liberal (SocLib, MarLib, and SocCon) parties which Syndicalist-aligned SocDem factions could coopt as well, in that case.
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I would advocate for the Union having rump/token elements of the Liberals hanging around, yeah, even if in name only to mess with the Canadians.
 

Landser03

Whiteshore said:
Also, is it me or does the SPD vanish into thin air if the Syndies conquer Germany? Wouldn't it make sense for there to be some sort of RadSoc or Syndicalist-aligned SocDem collaborationist faction of the SPD led by people like Otto Grotewohl (who was literally the Premier of East Germany IOTL) in a Syndie victory scenario?
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Even before Kaiserreich’s history diverged from our own, the SPD had distanced themselves from the more radical/Marxist elements of the party to the point that said elements split off to form their own parties. The USPD or the SAPD would be a better bet for a Rad Soc or Syndicalist puppet regime.
 
Whiteshore

Whiteshore

Landser03 said:
Even before Kaiserreich’s history diverged from our own, the SPD had distanced themselves from the more radical/Marxist elements of the party to the point that said elements split off to form their own parties. The USPD or the SAPD would be a better bet for a Rad Soc or Syndicalist puppet regime.
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Well, I was thinking the collaborationist faction of the SPD would be comprised of the people who set up the USPD IOTL but later rejoined the SPD and/or those SPD leaders who joined the SED.
 

Landser03

Whiteshore said:
Well, I was thinking the collaborationist faction of the SPD would be comprised of the people who set up the USPD IOTL but later rejoined the SPD and/or those SPD leaders who joined the SED.
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The thing is why would they rejoin the SPD? The SPD is a full on establishment party post-1917, and while not particularly liked by the Kaiser and conservatives they are at least seen as loyal due to voting for further credits to finance the war. At most they would be in the same position as the labor party in the UoB post-rework, but considering they have already heavily tied themselves to the Kaisers regime they could just as easily face a pretty bleak future in a TI victory. I guess what I’m saying is wouldn’t members of the USPD/SAPD want to distance themselves from the ‘traitors of the workers’?
 
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Yorel

Vince said:
I always thought Totalism was just the same as OTL Communism? The Jacobin leader Deat, who's set as a Totalist in-game, is pretty much spelled out as being a Leninist.
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It varies from place to place. Totalism is basically any form of Totalitarian Left-wing ideology in the game, ranging from things close to OTL Communism to basically Red Fascism.
Alhistnerd said:
Its not - It's more like Nationalist form of Socialism - for example Oswald Mosley, who was a fascist OTL , is a Totalist in Britain. But you do have Communists too. It's a broad catch-all term for Authoritarians who may have some degree of Socialist Beliefs
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Kaiserreich in general paints ideologies in broad strokes. Each and every group of ideologies has variations and they don't reflect the same things.

Just have a look at the opposite of the spectrum with National Populists. As this is basically Totalitarian Far-Right, you would expect this to be basically full of Nazi Expies. But while some do fill the bill, there are extreme variations: some groups are just ultra-reactionnaries for example. And while there can be similarities, you can't really say that Pelley's AUS is the same thing as Integralist Brazil or Action Française ruled National France.
 
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