Kaiserreich: Legacy of the Weltkrieg

Discussion in 'Alternate History Books and Media' started by RiverDelta, Dec 30, 2017.

  1. Alex1guy First Of His Name

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  2. AeroTheZealousOne Hey! Wait! I've got a new complaint!

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    My only main qualm with the civil war no longer being possible to avert is that I can no longer seem to get the Progressives in power as the Feds. Maybe I'm just biased in thinking that Henry Wallace would make a better President than Quentin Roosevelt given the circumstances, but if I want my fill of "far-enough-left-wing-not-to-be-a-Syndicalist" then I guess I'll just play as the PSA or elect the SocDems as Japan sometime in the '40s. Or just play as Ireland under Cathal Brugha. :p

    Oh, my headcanon? I am not entirely sure yet. I'd have to get back to you folks on that.
     
  3. 1SaBy Enlightened Radical Alt-Censtrist

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    Yeah, that one's kinda weird. Any idea why it was removed? Maybe just let them be electable if Olson was president, but still.
     
  4. LordInsane Supporter of the Alliance

    It's a bug, they forgot to change the acw_averted flag on the elect the Progressives options. One of the devs have mentioned it'll be fixed. Presumably it'll require Olson, maybe even Compromise Olson.
     
  5. akoslows Well-Known Member

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    If you don’t mind me asking, why exactly would Henry Wallace make for a better President than Quentin? Correct me if I’m wrong here, but doesn’t Quentin’s portrait description state that he’s been involved in Republican politics for quite a while? Before he became Secretary of Agriculture IOTL, Wallace had no political experience whatsoever, and that appears to still be the case in KR, as I recall the event describing Wallace being nominated by the Progressive Party saying that he was Olson’s Secretary of Agriculture.
     
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  6. AeroTheZealousOne Hey! Wait! I've got a new complaint!

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    I probably should have clarified it's more out of personal choice and idealism than anything else on my part. Realistically I think Roosevelt would be more of an effective leader, but the idea of this guy being the leader is an intriguing one, probably being able to ride off of Olson's coattails similarly (but with less effect) to Roosevelt ITTL and working to reform a country brought back from either the brink of destruction or an already destructive civil war.

    It's more of personal taste, and I really COULD argue the benefits of either or both men in office, and I do like both, but the idea of the United States taking a more progressive shift while the world is coming apart at the seams from the Entente's incessant insistence of reclaiming Europe from Totalism, all combined with the mess that Russia and Japan have the potentials to be.

    My own (slightly unrealistic and borderline progressive-wank) 2ACW-averted headcanon involved a Wallace presidency (maybe followed by Glen Taylor's, or maybe a Republican) and an America content enough to reap in the new post-Fair Deal prosperity and remain isolationist even with all the shit going down just across the world.

    My other headcanon involves a multipolar Cold War between the CSA's Fourth International, the Reichspakt, and the Co-Prosperity Sphere. I'll flesh it out later, right now I'm just looking over what I wrote and I think I look foolish.
     
  7. akoslows Well-Known Member

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    Well, I think a Wallace presidency could be plausible in the 2ACW scenario where only the AUS rises up. I imagine that in his campaign, he would include civil rights and major economic reform as a big part of his platform, which could resonate with many voters in the SPA states. Along with this, since the Progressive Party was the political party that Olson aligned with, Wallace could frame his campaign as "carrying on Olson's legacy" and this could possibly get him some votes from Olson's main supporters in his home states and elsewhere. Another thing that could help him would be support from the SPA. Since Wallace's intended policies align more with his ideology, I imagine Reed would be willing to endorse Wallace's campaign, and this support from socialists might help him since socialism is much more popular in KR's USA and the SPA has many seats in the Senate and House which could support him if no candidate gains a majority.

    Of course, Wallace will be facing very stiff competition, since Roosevelt has his own base of support all over the country, and his status as Olson's VP will likely give him a great deal of popularity throughout the country. He is undoubtedly going to campaign rigorously like in the 1936 election, and the popular image he's built up for himself during the Olson presidency will pay off.

    The Democrats are obviously fucked, since the defection of the Dixiecrats to the AUS is going to be a huge stain on their image, and their more moderate faction isn't going to have the strength to get the party to win a presidential election for a long time. So, the 1940 election is primarily going to be dominated by the Progressives and Republicans, both of which now have significant support bases throughout the country, and two popular candidates that aim for the Oval Office. And with the South obviously not taking part in this election cycle, the North, Midwest, and West Coast will be the main areas of campaigning between the two candidates (unless Wallace decides to actually campaign in the South to possibly build up a "humanitarian" image for himself or something).
     
  8. Nyvis Well-Known Member

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    Yeah any US where the progressives made a deal with the SPA should have a stronger left wing. SPA & Progressives running separately on local races but endorsing the same presidential candidate could be a path towards that.

    Maybe he should have an event chain to negotiate a continued deal with the socialists though.

    If the AUS defeat has lead to enfranchising black voters and a sort of second reconstruction, I could see them trying to compete for those votes too.
     
  9. Faeelin Lord of Ten Thousand Years

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    Plausibility, mostly. If you're getting rid of the Mongolian Khan, why is America fated to go into a civil war when none of these factions existed in OTL?
     
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  10. ETGalaxy Long live the King of America!

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    But by the start date of Kaiserreich, all of the factions for the 2nd ACW already exist. There’s still widespread support for the SPA, there’s still a Minuteman militia, and there’s still Douglas MacArthur prepared to overthrow the government. So the implausible stuff that leads to the 2nd ACW still exists, regardless of what happens next.
     
  11. Worffan101 Ain't done nothing if I ain't been called a Red

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    In all fairness, I have to admit that I miss Ungern Khan, though at least they're keeping him around in some capacity.
     
  12. Faeelin Lord of Ten Thousand Years

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    I agree that the leadup to the ACW is implausible.

    Look, it's their game, if they don't like that America is too powerful (a problem that doesn't bother most people who play WW2 games) they can make up whatever reason they want for it. But let's not pretend it's realistic to have millions of Americans take up arms to defend a radical workers movement that never came close to success in OTL, with a POD 16 years in the past.
     
  13. Worffan101 Ain't done nothing if I ain't been called a Red

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    I disagree. With a 10-year Depression even worse than OTL, no WW1 debt repayments, no New Deal (which happened after only THREE years of Depression OTL), significant changes in European politics from OTL, an implied-to-be-terrible McAdoo/Palmer administration that probably undid a lot of progressive legislation, and a reunified, radicalizing labor movement, it's IMO plausible that, with the double-dip of Black Monday AND Huey's Senagovernator antics casting further doubt on the stability of the political system, a civil war might break out after further failures by the government to solve anything.

    Hell, Hitler got power in significant part because Hindenburg was senile! I think that "the USA is too stable to collapse 16 years after the PoD" is kinda historically deterministic, given that this is a TL where FDR is dead, the progressive movement is beaten and shearing apart at the edges, the government has spent a DECADE failing to respond to what is by '36 a double-dip recession of historic proportions, and the President is even less popular than James Buchanan and barely more effective.
     
  14. ETGalaxy Long live the King of America!

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    It might be implausible, but what I’m saying is that the implausible aspects of the 2nd ACW have already happened. The political parties of the US don’t just spontaneously decide to rise up, this has been building up for years prior to the start date. This means that even if the 2nd ACW is avoided, the implausible instability and internal factionalism in the United States has already happened.
     
  15. 1SaBy Enlightened Radical Alt-Censtrist

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    So... for whatever reason, someone just sent me this on reddit: https://imgur.com/a/pbqL02N.

    It's an album of supposed leaks of a future Spain rework. No idea how true it is, I just scrolled through, but there seems be a lot of information. So even if it's not true, it might be a look at someone's in-depth wishlist.
     
  16. GDIS Pathe Well-Known Member

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    Except McAdoo was In OTL a very efficient treasury secretary who probably would've done much to mitigate the effects of a Stock Market crash in wake of the British collapse up to and including closing the NYSE and likely beginning a mass seizure of British financial assets. Nor does KR make much sense with Black Monday affecting the US so seriously considering if the Wall Street Crash is basically rerunning 1929 than the United States would have likely insulated itself from much of the global economy and the most especially the German Sphere thus limiting the effect of BM.
     
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  17. Worffan101 Ain't done nothing if I ain't been called a Red

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    At the same time, though, there would be limited British royalist financial assets still in the country after the mess of the Weltkrieg, that hadn't already been claimed as collateral for loan defaults anyway. Even then, the US in the '20s and '30s was an unstable and unregulated financial Wild West in dire need of Keynesian economics, and that holds true here; simply closing the stock exchange isn't going to do much to ameliorate the collapse of a house of cards, and a still-demilitarized United States with no WW1 buildup is going to have to deal with an angry, hypermilitarized Canada that will not respond favorably to a seizure of British assets thanks to the new royalist regime in Ottawa.

    I think it's more plausible than people claim, basically.
     
  18. GDIS Pathe Well-Known Member

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    Seems in line with what the Spanish dev team has planned and what we know of the reworked SCW, however, Unless the leaker did this with the approval of the KR team it seems rather unethical

    Ofc the thing is the US government has not extended any official unsecured government loans to the Entente powers until it entered the war in 1917 and with the KR PoD being what is that doesn't happen. All of Britains war debt is secured with collateral in the form of British assets, assets that Britain couldn't sell off at the beginning of the war because of McAdoo's shut down of the NYSE. There is also the matter of the bubble not being as big in 25 as it is in 29 which probably has some major implications on how the Depression runs its course.

    Also Worffan you are the last person I would think to suggest a Canadian military response to the US seizure of British assets. The Canadian Army even it followed the recommendations of the Otter Commission would be ill-suited to conduct a campaign across the vastness of the United States let alone when the nation is taking in British refugees and trying to hold together what's left of the empire.
     
  19. Worffan101 Ain't done nothing if I ain't been called a Red

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    I was under the impression (please correct me if I'm wrong) that the '25 KR Canadian military was massively expanded by British loyalists in the Army and Navy who came over with the King and His Fecklessness. That might give the royalist leaders the confidence to take a stab at seizing NYC in an attempt to repeat 1812 and force the US to comply with their demands. Might. Especially since the US hasn't TTL undergone the naval and army buildups and reforms of OTL's late '10s and early '20s.

    It would probably be a disaster for Canada in practice but I can see the US "playing nice" and releasing the collateral in an attempt to avoid a crisis.

    It's a long shot for sure but crazier things have happened IRL.
     
  20. 1SaBy Enlightened Radical Alt-Censtrist

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    Well, depends on what kind of "leak" it is. People keep calling stuff that gets posted on the discord (which I don't use) and not to reddit as a "leak". But considering how this was directly posted only to r/hoi4 and r/KRCJ, but not r/Kaiserreich, it's probably not the case.
     
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