JFK's reputation if he had lived

samcster94

Banned
How would JFK be viewed in a universe where he served two terms and lived at least until the late 70's???? For simplicity, he also passes LBJ's legislation(or something like it) and the Vietnam War is largely unchanged with a GOP win in 1968. I am talking about the "Camelot" image, his wife, and all that stuff that only was constructed after he died.
 
How would JFK be viewed in a universe where he served two terms and lived at least until the late 70's???? For simplicity, he also passes LBJ's legislation(or something like it) and the Vietnam War is largely unchanged with a GOP win in 1968. I am talking about the "Camelot" image, his wife, and all that stuff that only was constructed after he died.

In this specific scenario, little differently from LBJ. He passed civil rights but lead the country into a failed war. The one caveat would be that he was the first Catholic President, so his reputation would be somewhat greater than Johnson based on that accomplishment alone. But he would be controversial and his legacy would be rather mixed. You wouldn't see Democratic politicians cite Kennedy as an inspiration since he is tainted by Vietnam.
 

samcster94

Banned
In this specific scenario, little differently from LBJ. He passed civil rights but lead the country into a failed war. The one caveat would be that he was the first Catholic President, so his reputation would be somewhat greater than Johnson based on that accomplishment alone. But he would be controversial and his legacy would be rather mixed. You wouldn't see Democratic politicians cite Kennedy as an inspiration since he is tainted by Vietnam.
Right. This Kennedy would definitely be a more complicated figure. I wonder how that universe's late 10's(if it had a #me too equivalent) would handle his attitudes towards women(or even how he'd viewed in their 90's for that matter).
 

DougM

Donor
The “American Royalty “ trope would not exist and he would not be viewed as almost a saint like he is currently in some circles.

And if he followed the path into Nam he would be viewed very badly indeed by many
 
I wonder how long it'd take until his womanizing to be exposed. Given the volume, I think he's going to get caught during the presidency. If it happens around the re-election, the Republican might edge out a win if they have a better candidate. If it happens in the second term, we could see the morality of the candidate being an issue in the 1968 election. Heck, that might even give George Romney a shot
 
What about the economy? LBJ pushed the Great Society programs despite the war spending which hurt the US over time. Does JFK avoid that level of social spending until a drawdown in hostilities?
 
This thread got pushed in a singular direction by insisting that JFK screw the pooch in Vietnam. Making the only debate possible is whether his womanizing would catch up to him? (In short: by '68, no!)

But why not give him a chance with his own ATL where he makes his own decisions on the 'great society' and VN? - I think JFK would have been more business friendly and less friendly to social welfare programs; I wonder if we would have gone as far environmentally under JFK as we did with LBJ? Tax increases would never have resin to the rates they did. Etc.

And WI a successful JFK, brings us to 1968 with a growing economy and detente (no Vietnam,) does he open the door for a 16 year Kennedy dynasty?

The Vietnam War destroys any presidency, never mind Kennedy, its failure would have brought down even Eisenhower, (just differently.)
 
Vietnam still gets escalated, not to the extent that it was under LBJ in OTL, but escalated none the less and for many of the same reasons Johnson escalated it. The Civil Rights Act still happens but Kennedy spends all of his political capitol to get it passed, so he's a lame duck for all of his second term domestically and Vietnam would dominate foreign policy. He'd be remembered as a Mediocre President overall (which is how I view him OTL). Also, while I think Kennedy wins '64 decisively, I doubt it's a landslide like LBJ's, and thus I doubt the Democrats get a Supermajority in Congress, so 1966 might see the GOP retake one or both houses of Congress if it's as bad for the Democrats as it was OTL.
 
And WI a successful JFK, brings us to 1968 with a growing economy and detente (no Vietnam,) does he open the door for a 16 year Kennedy dynasty?

RFK won't be elected President in 1968, instead it's more likely to be JFK's VP - whether that be Johnson or Terry Sanford - or George Romney. RFK's first real chance would be in 1976 or 1980 depending on who wins in '68.
 
I could still see Nixon winning in 1968 TTL given that a living Kennedy's Presidency would likely damage the Democrats as much as Johnson's did OTL, plus Nixon is still the only one that could bridge the divide between Rockefeller Republicans and Goldwater/Reaganite Conservatives.
 

samcster94

Banned
I could still see Nixon winning in 1968 TTL given that a living Kennedy's Presidency would likely damage the Democrats as much as Johnson's did OTL, plus Nixon is still the only one that could bridge the divide between Rockefeller Republicans and Goldwater/Reaganite Conservatives.
I always found it odd in OTL how he won eight years after losing.
 
If he lives, he’s probably a lot like Obama today - remembered as a divisive figure with both strengths and weaknesses, accomplishments and shortcomings, the first Catholic president who probably riles up a LOT of religious hatred. I wouldn’t be surprised if there’s a big anti-Catholic backlash in the 1968 election and someone rides that to, if not the White House, a powerful position.

His inevitable death will be a massive determining factor in his legacy - if he dies during his second term, he’s all of the above plus somewhat tragic. If he lives to the end of his second term and expires soon after, he’s remembered more for his policies and divisive legacy.
 
Forget the womanizing - what about his pillpopping?

This was the guy who was incapacitated on pills during half the Cuban Missile Crisis.
There was hidden word (not revealed until later) that his back pain was getting so bad that he might have been confined to a wheel chair by the 1964 campaign. While the influence of drugs on his judgment while in office was questionable, it would soon get to the point where he is impaired. At some point in 1966, he may resign, making LBJ the heir apparent in 1968 and eliminating a Dem campaign. LBJ might run on a platform of "fixing" the Vietnam mistake and distancing himself from JFK's decision to escalate.
 
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