Is this the end of the French Revolution?

Valdemar II

Banned
A major reason for the British to oppose a French southern Netherlands, was to avoid a French control of the Flemish coast. A solution would be to give significant parts of those coast to another country. So maybe giving Antwerp and the Flemish coast up to lets say Ostend to the Dutch republic could make this acceptable for the British.

I must admit I find the trade unlikely, while Austria wanted to trade the Austrian Netherlands for a closer territorium, Parma wasn't/aren't worth Belgium. It's simply too much to trade for too little and I can't especially not see it happening, while the Habsburgs are holding up the Bourbon regime.
Parma had in 1770 400 000 inhabitants that's less than a seventh of what the Austrian Netherlands had (in 1790 the Austrian Netherlands had 3 million inhabitants). While Parma are rich and rather well developed, it aren't more developed or richer per capita than the Austria Netherlands are. If we want to find a Habsburg enclave of similar size Breisgau are more or less the same population size.
 
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archaeogeek

Banned
A major reason for the British to oppose a French southern Netherlands, was to avoid a French control of the Flemish coast. A solution would be to give significant parts of those coast to another country. So maybe giving Antwerp and the Flemish coast up to lets say Ostend to the Dutch republic could make this acceptable for the British.

Isn't Antwerp in the duchy of Brabant?
Also I admit I didn't do the numbers (admittedly Parma vs Belgium is a shitty deal for the Habsburgs) and I seem to recall the last time it was brought up being about Bavaria.
 
IIRC, a precedent was Lorraine in exchange for Tuscany, where the Habsburgs were also involved. The two territories were much more comparable, though.
 

Thande

Donor
Yeah, Great Britain would definitely go to war to prevent a Bourbon Flanders, even with Pitt as PM and his aversion to expensive wars.

Also I reject the idea that Great Britain was 'isolationist' at this point; the Pitt government was heavily involved in issues like mediation over the Russo-Turkish War of 1787-92 and the Prussian suppression of the Dutch Patriots in 1785.
 
Also I reject the idea that Great Britain was 'isolationist' at this point; the Pitt government was heavily involved in issues like mediation over the Russo-Turkish War of 1787-92 and the Prussian suppression of the Dutch Patriots in 1785.

And almost going to war with Spain over the Pacific Northwest.
 
An idea occured to me: If the reaction against the Revolution goes too far, might Pasquale Paoli try to break Corsica away from France with British aid?
 

Thande

Donor
An idea occured to me: If the reaction against the Revolution goes too far, might Pasquale Paoli try to break Corsica away from France with British aid?

Perhaps; if I understand the OP correctly, this is before Louis XVI's OTL execution which was the point at which Paoli went over to the royalists. The Corsicans thus would be seen as fellow travellers of the revolution (perhaps even its inspiration) and subject to punishment...one suspects they would be eager to get away from France by any means. The European allies might demand an end to the Republic, and Britain could set something up whereby Corsica is technically returned to Genoa, while in practice Paoli continues as leader of a de facto independent Corsican republic.
 
Perhaps; if I understand the OP correctly, this is before Louis XVI's OTL execution which was the point at which Paoli went over to the royalists. The Corsicans thus would be seen as fellow travellers of the revolution (perhaps even its inspiration) and subject to punishment...one suspects they would be eager to get away from France by any means. The European allies might demand an end to the Republic, and Britain could set something up whereby Corsica is technically returned to Genoa, while in practice Paoli continues as leader of a de facto independent Corsican republic.

also because it might be an interesting place where to locate a naval base in the Mediterranean?
 

Thande

Donor
also because it might be an interesting place where to locate a naval base in the Mediterranean?

Particularly since we'd lost Menorca and in TTL Malta will remain independent due to no Napoleonic Egyptian expedition.

Come to think of it, what happens to Napoleon in TTL?
 
Particularly since we'd lost Menorca and in TTL Malta will remain independent due to no Napoleonic Egyptian expedition.

Come to think of it, what happens to Napoleon in TTL?

Killed in the defense of Paris, emigre to Constantinople to develop the Ottoman artillery or turncoat against the revolution, shelling the Assembly.
Or maybe is part of the migration to USA. Choose your pick.
 

Thande

Donor
Obviously Aaron Burr and Napoleon team up and liberate Mexico.
Presumably Boney gives them a whiff of grapeshot and then Burr goes around shooting any survivors in the back of the head accompanied by action-movie one-liners.

More seriously, what happens to Spanish America in this scenario is an interesting question.
 

Valdemar II

Banned
Napoleon would likely emigrate to Corsica or stay in the French army. In the former case he will likely do well (no one doubt his competances), in the later he likely just end up as less than a footnote in history (he will likely not end up in command, in a royal French army, and just be a another captain in the French army). Beside that for a French career soldier there was also the oppotunity to seek employment in foreign armies, the greater ecclessial states and Bavaria especially used Frenchmen and Italians in their armies. So we could see a commandant, major or lt. colonel Napoleon in Bavarian army in the 2nd War of Bavarian Succession in 1799.
 
Yeah, Great Britain would definitely go to war to prevent a Bourbon Flanders, even with Pitt as PM and his aversion to expensive wars.

Also I reject the idea that Great Britain was 'isolationist' at this point; the Pitt government was heavily involved in issues like mediation over the Russo-Turkish War of 1787-92 and the Prussian suppression of the Dutch Patriots in 1785.

Is this universally understood at the time, though? One of the obvious dissonances in 1815 was that Great Britain felt it had rendered an extraordinary service and deserved to be recognized and compensated for it, while Bourbon France felt Britain had simply done its duty as a civilized Christian nation. That latter tendency is going to be all the greater if the revolution only lasts 3 years.

Can we not see a Bourbon Flanders, whereupon Britain decides it's been stabbed in the back and takes another look at the revolutionary chaps? Or to put it another way, don't worry, a Bourbon monarch can still screw this up good?
 
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