Industrialized African Nation of Liberia: Lincoln emigrates the freed slaves.

There has been a couple of recent threads about forming an Industrial African nation. The biggest problem with any post 1900 POD is the lack of education/technology in any african society. A possible fix is a POD in the 1850's that eventually leads to massive emigration of freed slaves to Liberia.

In OTL, the American Colonization Society was forced to proclaim Liberia an independant nation in 1847 to prevent British annexation, with approximately 10K freed black settlers in the entire country (in addition to native tribesmen). The POD will be at this point, with several prominent members of American society taking a seperate diplomatic mission to London to halt any military actions against the Liberian colony. In the decade leading to the ACW, the Underground Railroad shifts it's focus from moving escaped slaves to the northern states and Canada to various ports, either in Philidelphia or southern Florida, and transporting the slaves to Liberia. Further, the free black community becomes more interested in emegration due to racism and lack of oppurtunity for jobs in the North.

By the start of the ACW, approximately 50,000 free and escaped slaves had been emigrated to Liberia. The ACW goes forward as in OTL. Lincoln survives the assassination attempt, and his resolve to emigrate the newly freed blacks is increased, as he sees the presence of the blacks as a blockage to healing the nation that is so divided.

By 1872, as Lincoln hands off the Presidency to Grant, over 1,000,000 free blacks have been emigrated to Liberia. By 1880, as Grant finally dies from his alcoholism, almost 2,000,000 free blacks have been emigrated. The government program of emigration ends at this point, but the US continues to provide military and financial aide to their colony. More importantly, American industry invests in the country, taking advantage of the local mineral and Iron deposits.

Liberia becomes an independant nation in 1905, with a beaming Teddy Roosevelt signing a treaty in Modovia, a city with a mixture of trade, industry, and agriculture, that could have easily been located in Missouri as Africa.

This could go on with Liberia absorbing the Ivory Coast, Sierra Lione, and other territory as their imperial masters become inattentive. By post WWII, Liberia could be a large, developed, industrial nation that rivals some first world nation in infrastructure and education.

The obvious issue, as it was in OTL, was the financial cost of such an emigraion, and the overwhelming majority of freed blacks did not want to go back to Africa.
 

Straha

Banned
Imagine the effects on US culture with latins and asians being the biggest minorities. Since both groups in OTL tend to intermarry and assimilate into the population the US in TTL would look both whiter and more beige. Perhaps in this TL with a bit less racism in the US we opt to keep the phillipines and cuba permanently after the spanish-american war?
 
"This could go on with Liberia absorbing the Ivory Coast, Sierra Lione, and other territory as their imperial masters become inattentive. By post WWII, Liberia could be a large, developed, industrial nation that rivals some first world nation in infrastructure and education."

No. Not unless Liberia wants to find its foreign trade interdicted. On the whole the surrounding territories will be better off than Liberia. This is a bit of a too rosey ATL. If the climate and terrain would permit an agricultural basis similar to Missouri is questionable.
 

Straha

Banned
David S Poepoe said:
"This could go on with Liberia absorbing the Ivory Coast, Sierra Lione, and other territory as their imperial masters become inattentive. By post WWII, Liberia could be a large, developed, industrial nation that rivals some first world nation in infrastructure and education."

No. Not unless Liberia wants to find its foreign trade interdicted. On the whole the surrounding territories will be better off than Liberia. This is a bit of a too rosey ATL. If the climate and terrain would permit an agricultural basis similar to Missouri is questionable.
you're right. The climate and terrain would prevent that. It would be tropical so instead of things like wheat or cotton they'd grow bananas.
 
Sierra Leone would be better for this.
It was the British equivalent of Liberia and contains far better land and resources. Also having active British help is better then passive American.
 

Straha

Banned
Leej said:
Sierra Leone would be better for this.
It was the British equivalent of Liberia and contains far better land and resources. Also having active British help is better then passive American.
Why not make the colonization thing be a joint US/UK project from the 1820's on?
 
The Missouri comment was meant to be a metaphor about the development of the city of Modovia at the time of independence, not anything about climate or natural resources.

The key is an influx of colonists with the level of education that could allow for the development of a western style society, that would be able to attract investment and develop industry. Even freed blacks fresh off a southern plantation would have knowledge of advanced farming techniques, maybe some blacksmithing ability, and how to tend for livestock.

Any Anglo colonization would probably result in a few hundred elite whites controlling the masses, leading to eventual overthrow and economic ruin that happened in OTL in most African colonies. Further, any "active" British help would only create the kind of colonization that occured in OTL...which is extraction of natural resources with no economic development for the people left behind. This case of massive colonization of people capable of self development of an economy is unique.

Straha, I think your first post was very interesting. If 2 million blacks were emegrated by 1880, the US would have approximately 60% of its freed black population (2.4 million) remaining at that time (4 million freed blacks at 1865, with some population growth), with significantly fewer blacks in the Carolinas and Georgia. The impact of that demographic shift would be very interesting as time went on.
 

Straha

Banned
Yes it would it would cause several things to happen

1 without cheap black labor expect labor gangs to fan out across latin america and the carribean. This will cause 2 results: a substantially larger latin population and a good chunk of the black population being afro-carribean instead of afro-american.

2 Puerto rico(and cuba if we opt to keep it) is likely mostly depopulated with the puerto ricans all ending up in the mainland US and being assimilated.

3 Hispanics are the biggest minority substantially earlier but since they've tended to assimilate it would just be an extension of OTL trends earlier. With the labor gangs, high birthrates for 19th century immigrants and OTL's immigration trends for hispanics being earleir the US anywhere from 1/4 to 1/3 hispanic by now(this will be OTL in a few decades but due to the high rates of assimilation it probably won't be noticed. The only reason that theres the concerns about spanish-speakers displacing everyone else is that theres ALOT of immigration which even with the assimilation makes for a decent sized unassimilated population).

4 When the 1920's great migration happens and the US's remaining black population goes north there will be less black communities so we could see a good chunk of them assimilating into either the white majority or the large latin minority.
 
There have been similar WI concerning Liberia posted before so nothing proposed here is new. There seems to be no indication of what status the existing native population will hold. I very much lean towards the idea that statehood would be best. The idea of forced migration to Liberia I have always consider very unfair to the recently free blacks. If they are considered to be equal with whites they wouldn't be asked to emigrate.

"Lincoln survives the assassination attempt, and his resolve to emigrate the newly freed blacks is increased, as he sees the presence of the blacks as a blockage to healing the nation that is so divided." Such a decision is not emigration but exile. The blacks are being treated as poorly as the indians.
 
I'm a realist: There is no way the African native population would be fully integrated into the society. The only way this works is sufficient numbers of colonists that could repel any native actions.

One of the initial statements I made was the free black community would have to embrase the concept of emegration in order for this to work (and the only practical way I could see this happening is Racism). This isn't a scene with Lincoln ordering the US Army to round up entire communities of blacks and marching them onto boats. However, it feel it is realistic that the motives of the government can be partially racist. This effort would be a major economic drain to the US government, and there would have to be some sort of perceived reward. My statement about Lincoln's resolve was directed towards his efforts for obtaining funding and political support for the program.

Anyway, this has gone well away from my original intent, which was creating a situation that could lead to a modern, industrial nation in Africa with a primary black population. Probably my own fault for focusing too much on getting the freed blacks to Liberia, versus how they develop their nation.
 
Straha said:
Imagine the effects on US culture with latins and asians being the biggest minorities. Since both groups in OTL tend to intermarry and assimilate into the population the US in TTL would look both whiter and more beige. Perhaps in this TL with a bit less racism in the US we opt to keep the phillipines and cuba permanently after the spanish-american war?
I think if we were going to keep Philippines, we would have to get it sooner...
 
I've looked at Liberian history and it is very interesting but also very sad. Dumping a larger population on its shores in the mid 19th century does not magically create industrialization. It is more likely to result in tragedy for the climate is not particularly healthy and the resources very limited. In OTL it was a bizarre entity with the freed American slaves lording it over the local tribes. My favorite descritption is that it was Gone with the Wind with an all black cast.

Just before the Great War the Germans of all people decide that rubber was Liberia's big asset and were starting to help them develop it that wasn't too exploitive. WWI ruined that and afterwards Firestone dad a similar deal (whether it was a little better or a little worse than the German deal is a lengthy topic).

Marcus Garvey in the 1920's fantasized abot sending a stream of UNIA emigrants to Liberia but was told 'Hey Marcus it's not such a great place to live."

Industrialization is going to require ready access to coal and that is going to be a major problem in much of Africa. South Africa is really the only major source I know of (there are some small fields elsewhere).

Tom
 

corourke

Donor
Any industrial nation in West Africa would be swamped with immigrants. If alt-Liberia is to avoid this, the whole nature of West Africa needs to be changed as well.
 
I suppose a main obstacle is climate. One reason why most of the European efforts there failed was that the heat makes it difficult to achieve similar things as in Europe at similar speeds - the colonial "masters" had to resort to very tough means to get as much done as was expected of them, and exhausted themselves and their subjects this way.

Slightly different circumstances might lead to more emmigration to Liberia though - even without any pressure. But it would take more than plantation workers to get going there. Some of the factory workers (mostly of the northern states) would have to go, too, if there was supposed to be a realistic chance for industrialization.

The people would have to understand somehow that things cannot be done the same way as in cooler climates - which would be the most difficult part, considering the attitudes of that time. It might work if we created a second pod to make the newcomers to Liberia try all kinds of approaches to organizing the economy and quickly accept the best results even if they were bad in comparison to what was usual in the US.

If that actually works, and immigrants from all over Africa start to arrive, that would usually be an advantage - Liberia would have a big supply of workers then, keeping the land competitive, while some food has to be imported from surrounding countries every once in a while. Some of the immigrants would later return to their home countries and distribute their knowledge around black Africa.

There should be enough excuses for a little expansion into neighbouring territories in the next 150 years.
 
Au contraire

NapoleonXIV said:
Japan has neither coal nor oil that I know of. They've managed to industrialize a little:rolleyes:

Oh yes they did. They were a net exporter during the Meiji Restoration.

Try knowing a little more before you post.

Tom
 
I can't believe someone beat me to the Gone with the Wind line. Darn.

I agree that the society would be very much like the South. My concept was the introduction of the freed slaves with some US investment could lead to the eventual progression towards a modern type economy, because they probably would be able to establish a significant, efficient agricultural economy, and have the resources available to industrialize, after the European and US economies have completed their transformations.

So, practically speaking, it is unlikely that any African nation short of South Africa would be able to industrialize before WWII without ASB dropping a bunch of coal in their laps, or some huge POD concerning power generation.
 
Madagascar

Has some coal. Enough for a first phase of industrialization and I think Mozambique nearby has some as well. The island's internal politics was very convoluted but there was some ruler (a queen I think) who was very antiforeign and spawned a series of very disruptive civil wars.

A better ruler at this juncture may have united and modernized. If you want something really unusual maybe the next ruler (be warned they tend to have really long names LOL) might make it known to Lincoln it would accept former US slaves to form a craftsman class. This might lead to US interests in Madagascar which would could prevent the French protectorate.

Tom
 
The Madagascar plan, but a 100 years earlier.

Back in the early 1700's there was a significant american pirate population on the island, with one man, Plaintain, actually conquoring the isle and basically enslaving the native population for about a decade (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Madagascar).

How about a POD with the "American Pirate" government maintaining control over some of the coastal area, including several port towns, well into the 19th century. Instead of a native leader reaching out, the white government makes overtures for to the US for immigrants to expand their busting shipping and import/export business, and to expand the agricultural development of the island. With natural resources at hand, an expansion into some industry around 1900 could be feasible. While the emigration numbers of the freed blacks would probably be smaller (lets say 100K volunteer to go, with the same support proposed earlier for Liberia), their skills and education would create a middle class capable of creating an industrialized society.

Good call Tom.
 
This has some promise. Go with it.

You might make Zanzibar to the north an important trading partner. Zanzibar is another interesting wild card in Africa.

Tom
 
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