Indo Iranian ATL Indian subcontinent with a surviving Indus valley civilization and culture

Should buddhism or a another religion with the same idea but under a different name emerge in atl

  • Yes

    Votes: 13 52.0%
  • No

    Votes: 12 48.0%

  • Total voters
    25
  • Poll closed .
No, abut them abandons the river plains and moving into the foot hills, due to the changes in the weather patterns. They may also have a link to the haplogroup data.
I always suspected that, you know in all ice ages that humanity faced we survived hiding in the mountains so it's likely and logical that humans would move to mountain valleys thanks for the info helps me lot

Anyway I think the neolithic farmers from Iranian plateau who were quite diverse in genetics ( we may have people who were pale as Caucasian whites to people who had olive skin) were the majority in the ratio of 65:35 with a significant minority of ancient ancestral south Indians these original inhabitants were located in eastern Punjab and in Gujarat in some number but mostly the cities were dominated by the decendents of these immigrants, besides there is a controversial hypothesis that AASI were bottom of social hierarchy as they usually died of communicable diseases in the dying days of civilization

I am getting side tracked here I think by identifying non Indo Iranian tribes in Kashmir valley may be I can just say they were the dominant group of Indus valley civilization
 
One month has elapsed since your last post. Are you abandoning the thread?
One of the main reason why this thread is going slow is because of research that it entails apart from lack of time and the major new information that i found out .The Indus valley civilization collapsed because of a 900 year drought which lasted from 2400 bc to 1500 bc this has in a way changed a lot of what we knew of this ancient civilization which we suspected to have peaked around 2600 bc is actually the time from which it stated to decline putting the matured harappen phase some where around 3200-2600 bc , this means during those 900 years the civilization was in a state of decline as it began to loses much of its culture and language and people began mirgrating to the east of the subcontinent where they began to mingle with AASI and many settled along the western coast of India , which partly why north indian and west coast Indians look different from inhabitants of Deccan plateau .

Now the issue here is I am supposed to think of advances that IVC could have made in those 1000 years , would they have developed advanced irrigation system or would they progress to iron age or what are the other advances that they could do .

The other issue is how the IVC survives in OTL the south western monssoon became very weak especially the Arabian sea branch during the final days of the civilization but during the peak of IVC the monssoon reached modern day Iran and was stronger in its intensity all over the subcontinent the main reason for the monssoon weakening was climate change which was due to fall in global temperature which inturn caused changes in El nino and the cold winds blowing from the Arctic into the Atlantic Ocean which caused the Atlantic Ocean jet stream to go hay wire , that is the probable cause I am emphasizing probable cause plus lower northern hemisphere temperature means weak monsson .Now why on earth did arabian sea branch of the monsson that too the saurashtra sub branch went weak no one knows, why not the bay of Bengal branch like it did in 182 bc or during the times of bengal famine of 18 the century no one knows .

Now I cannot do away with the weakening of the monssoon as then the time line is ASB , what I can do is make the Bengal branch weak and the Saurashtra branch of the monssoon stronger than in OTL so that civilization survives p!us monssoon will reach Iran as it did some 5000 years ago but the rain is not so intense as in the subcontinent but Iranian plateau in this time line will be a grassland rather than dry plateau , the 900 year drought will take place in the rest of the subcontinent not the IVC
Hope this doesn't sound too much of a ASB
 
Well I am back after a break and I'll try to post contents on a weekly basis

Now coming to the elephant in the room which I have not addressed till now is how will India look like in this time line . Will Indians or south Asians in this time line have white people with blonde hair and blue eyes , the answer is a big no . Its not possible because of the climate and the migration routes . The south Asians will look similar to Iranians ,pashtuns and Tajiks especially in the north of the subcontinent ,while the northern and central portion of deccan plateau will have people who look like present day north Indians a bit dark skin complexion which will gradually become more whiter because of the influx of people from the north but still will be a bit darker than their northern counter part as for the people in the far south well they will look like present day south Indians but gradually become whiter and resemble modern day north Indians so yes in this time line Indians will be light skinned but not light skinned as Europeans and this is a very important difference that I'd like to emphasize on.

Now the next elephant in the room , who are the inhabitants of the indus valley civilization in my opinion they are Iranian Neolithic farmers who migrated in waves from the zargoz mountains into the Indus valley as the climate changed and what is to be noted is that these people did not suffer from population bottlenecks meaning the bulk of that population moved into the Indus valley and further it is to be noted is the fact that these people were part of the larger group of people of the fertile crescent who invented agriculture but at the same time these farmers are different from the farmers of the Anatolian plateau in terms of genetics and appearance while the Iranian Neolithic farmers were brown haired and light skinned with a tan due to the sun there were by no means dark skin complexion and were not Dravidian in culture or in "appearance" now a lot will point out the DNA testing done on a skeleton done in Rakhigrahi which suggested that the person was a mix of Iranian Neolithic farmer and ancient ancestral south Indian which makes him ASI to them I will also point out a fact which they conveniently forget is also a new evidence that by Indian institute of technology at kharagpur which shows that the civilization began to collapse around 2600-2350 BC not 1900 BCE which was the date accepted till now and by 1900 bce and not 1500 bce all cities and settlement of the Indus valley civilization were abandoned so the Rakhigrahi person was a product of migration of Indus valley civilization settler into eastern lands and the AASI my point is the inhabitants of Indus valley civilization at its peak was different from the inhabitants of the civilization of the later stage while the former was more of a mix of migrants from the west and a minority were AASI during the later stage there was more intermixtures with AASI as the ivc people and AASI began to intermix in around 2600bc and by 1500 BC you have indo Aryans coming into the picture which is around 400 years after the total collapse of Indus valley civilization and they began to intermix which gave rise to ANI by this time the Indus valley civilization inhabitants have migrated beyond the Ganges into the deccan plateau and inter mix with the AASI hunter gatherers and after 1200 bce till 500 Ad there was intense mixing between the ASI AND ANI the result was modern day Indians . Now in this time line none of this intermixing takes place because the monsson weakness not around the ivc but in the gangetic river valley and in the deccan so the civilization survives plus there is no incentive for migration as the lands beyond the yamuna was considered dry and unsuitable for habitation so the indo Aryans intermix with Iranian neolithic farmers descentants who have some AASI admixture but the extent of admixture of is not like the ASI since there is also intermixtures with other migrants and indo Aryans including vedic Aryans are different in genetic composition as they too have intermixed with other groups in the Iranian plateau which saw migration from the Anatolian plateau during the early bronze age collapse and the vedic Aryan confederation extend into most of modern day iran but not the western parts and Afghanistan and after some time also include lands of Fergana valley and Oxus river details of which will be posted later on

With two main issues addressed I trust the controversy is put to rest for this time line
 

Albert.Nik

Banned
So I've decided a tentative timeline after a few discussions with @Freedom2018. Indo-Iranians establish a large Empire in the core region of which westernmost is Zargos and Easternmost is Sogdia. Northernmost is Samarkand and Southernmost is Haryana/Delhi region initially.
IVC people are colloborated with and eventually form a good chunk of the Empire and Indo-Iranians and IVC are almost like one united peoples. Even the Pre-Iranian peoples in Iran like Gutians,Elamites,Caucasians join as they did OTL with Iranian peoples.
Now this Empire resembles Roman Empire as a multi ethnic and universalist empire. Religion is a combination of Indo-Iranian Paganism/Historical Vedic religion,Zoroastrnism,IVC 2.0 religion.
Now slowly Anatolians,Hurrians,Urartians,Armenians and Greeks start to get influenced and start influencing this empire and they will form a large population in the Western regions.
Tocharians also come in and form a good percent on the Eastern regions. Northern regions is mainly Scythian and Sogdian dominated with the ruling classes initially of people of Western Iranian and Indo-Aryan origin who would be closer in this timeline. Eventually Scythians are taken in like how Gauls and other peoples were taken in by the expanding Roman Empire.
Central and South India OTL will be a Unity in Diversity with many extra languages,ethnicities,religions living there initially.
Eventually a decentralised and a different type of Hybrid Christianity like religion is born which probably evolves from the Anatolian society rather in the Hebrew society in the Roman Empire. So you will have two types of Christianities in this timeline. The Western and the Eastern regions are European with Anatolians/Caucasians/Galatians and the Tocharians respectively and so will be the Northernmost regions with Sogdians and Scythians. The regions middle looks as you said,like Iranians,Pashtuns,Tajiks,Kurds,etc. The region beyond Maharashtra will be diverse with all these people living in different proportions and along with AASI peoples,Mixed Ethnicities and even European immigrants who are of all European,Iranian,IVC,Caucasians,Tibetian/Asian,Finnic and Ugric,AASI peoples,Dravidians,Anatolian,Semitic and Egyptian Ethnicities as it would be a fairly empty land initially and the Empires would bring them to settle as did Roman Empire. Though populated by all these peoples,the largest part would be like OTL North and Central Indians as far as this region is concerned. Europe of the Antiquity and Medieval eras would be quite different. Islam probably wouldn't rise and instead,the Arabs settle inside and join this Empire. Tibet too would look different and diverse. All follow the version of Hybrid Christianity like religion this Empire founded from the Anatolian society.
Rome and Greece have been deeply influenced during their evolution and before they expanding from these peoples and hence a closer relation is shared between Graeco-Roman and this empire. Both have been deeply influenced by each other for centuries during their rise.
All these peoples languages would survive making it the most diverse,expansive and the powerful country in Asia and one of the in the World. All Colors of peoples,all languages speakers would be united under a banner of a Roman equivalent Empire.
Further timeline will be continued after a feedback. We will discuss the religions part in detail.
 
The problem is that Ralph th Griffith did not translate the Rigveda properly. This unfortunately a wrong notion of the Vedas was constructed based on taking at face value the words written in rgvedam for example and for not understanding the nuances of the Sanskrit language. While aryansmay not have been indigenous to India the first post in this thread of a conquest by bharathas of non aryans is wrong. The aryans prayed to the sun they were worshipped of the 12 phases of the sun and of the waters lakes and rivers. The harappan culture was predominelty a culture that worshipped the different forms of devi.

Thus it is most appropriate to say that the rgvedam is actually something that was written by both info aryans and local harrapans.

This is a fact most people ignore and also misunderstand of Vedic religion. They believe it to be same as Greek religion or Iranian but honestly it is not.

That is because Vedic religion revolves around the worship of an Unmanifest principle know Nirguna Brahman worshipped in As various saguna forms and worshipped as both the divine masculine and feminine. Thus the rgvedam having elements of saguna and Nirguna worships and worship of both the divine feminine and masculine is wholly indigenous to India and its though wholly original to the subcontinent. The composers at least some of them one can tell may not have been indigenous and probably Sanskrit itself was not indigenous to the Continent but the worship of the divine and the way to worship god through the use of elaborate rituals and yoga and rites based on specific structuring of the metre of the Sanskrit characters is the Vedic religion. Now if harappan survived thanthe relationship would be same as always one not of warring or conflict but rather one of cooperation and intermixing. Also the use of terms like mongoloid and austealeod is very racist come on we aren’t living in the 1900s at the time of the eugenics movement now. Color of skin is based on alleles and melanin determined by environmental factors and I assure you aryans even original aryans were not light skinned rather light referred to qualities of an individual light being associated with fire and sun and brightness. Thus the relationship between Indo aryans and harrapans would be the same as otl even if harrapans does survive somehow with the difference being probably Shaivism and worship of Durga/devi worship would be more prominent and their would less of a caste system as rigid as we know it.

But warfare would not happen between aryans and harrapans because both by 1200 b.c became intertwined with each other. Conflict was between kingdoms and chiefdoms not ethnic groups unfortunately.

Also dasas refers not to black people or Iranian people but those who did not have qualities of goodness and were ignorant. Once I finish my PhD I. Economics stay tuned because I am going to challenge these academic institutions that have been teaching the Vedic studies in the wrong way and installing in students wrong ideas about Vedic cultures and society. Of course being an economist I am sure my anthropology colleagues would not be open to debate given the history of rivalry and differences in opinion among anthropologists and economists.
 

Albert.Nik

Banned
@Gustavus Adolphus Your post is not much relevant to what we are discussing here. We are discussing more alternate patterns here as the title says. The subject you posted about already has a separate thread. Please delete your post here and copy/paste it to move it there for further discussion as I think you won't find much discussion happening here about that subject anyway.
 
The problem is that Ralph th Griffith did not translate the Rigveda properly. This unfortunately a wrong notion of the Vedas was constructed based on taking at face value the words written in rgvedam for example and for not understanding the nuances of the Sanskrit language. While aryansmay not have been indigenous to India the first post in this thread of a conquest by bharathas of non aryans is wrong. The aryans prayed to the sun they were worshipped of the 12 phases of the sun and of the waters lakes and rivers. The harappan culture was predominelty a culture that worshipped the different forms of devi.

Thus it is most appropriate to say that the rgvedam is actually something that was written by both info aryans and local harrapans.

This is a fact most people ignore and also misunderstand of Vedic religion. They believe it to be same as Greek religion or Iranian but honestly it is not.

That is because Vedic religion revolves around the worship of an Unmanifest principle know Nirguna Brahman worshipped in As various saguna forms and worshipped as both the divine masculine and feminine. Thus the rgvedam having elements of saguna and Nirguna worships and worship of both the divine feminine and masculine is wholly indigenous to India and its though wholly original to the subcontinent. The composers at least some of them one can tell may not have been indigenous and probably Sanskrit itself was not indigenous to the Continent but the worship of the divine and the way to worship god through the use of elaborate rituals and yoga and rites based on specific structuring of the metre of the Sanskrit characters is the Vedic religion. Now if harappan survived thanthe relationship would be same as always one not of warring or conflict but rather one of cooperation and intermixing. Also the use of terms like mongoloid and austealeod is very racist come on we aren’t living in the 1900s at the time of the eugenics movement now. Color of skin is based on alleles and melanin determined by environmental factors and I assure you aryans even original aryans were not light skinned rather light referred to qualities of an individual light being associated with fire and sun and brightness. Thus the relationship between Indo aryans and harrapans would be the same as otl even if harrapans does survive somehow with the difference being probably Shaivism and worship of Durga/devi worship would be more prominent and their would less of a caste system as rigid as we know it.

But warfare would not happen between aryans and harrapans because both by 1200 b.c became intertwined with each other. Conflict was between kingdoms and chiefdoms not ethnic groups unfortunately.

Also dasas refers not to black people or Iranian people but those who did not have qualities of goodness and were ignorant. Once I finish my PhD I. Economics stay tuned because I am going to challenge these academic institutions that have been teaching the Vedic studies in the wrong way and installing in students wrong ideas about Vedic cultures and society. Of course being an economist I am sure my anthropology colleagues would not be open to debate given the history of rivalry and differences in opinion among anthropologists and economists.
If you read my thread and other posts of this thread you will find some reference to your argument but not the philosophical or metaphysical aspects, I am not qualified to speak on that I am a legal historian by tranning and my knowledge of religion is very bad so I am avoiding all reference to relegious aspects .

You see the Indo Aryans and the much Broader people group that is Indo iranian were initially influenced by oxus river valley civilization which was inturn influenced by Indus and Mesopotamian lands . The Indo Aryans crossed the pamir mountains and settled down in the Helmand valley and later to swat and later to Punjab then the Vedas etc , there wasn't much warfare between the Aryans and the people in the Indus valley civilization as I stated what happened in otl was that you had client patron relationship and the Indo Aryans recruited new members into their fold . Now if the Indus valley civilization survived do you think the Aryans would have migrated so easily into the Indus valley which had most probably city states and kingdoms like Mahajanapadas ? I doubt it . The Indo Aryans were no more than 500,000 strong when they stepped foot into India do you really think it's possible for such a small group of disunited people to conquer 6 million people? The idea itself is laughable at best . If there was a Indus valley civilization surviving the Indo Aryans would have gone into modern day Iran and and continued their nomadic life rather than enter India . And the influence on Indo Aryans will be different than in otl they would have been influenced by other Indo iranian religion and the religion of people residing in iranian plateau with minimal influence of Indus valley and dare I say the influence of elamite and Babylonian would be more considering the proximity to them as well . Hence the entire idea of peaceful intermixing between Indo Aryans and Indus valley civilization is not possible . The idea that Indus valley civilization were magnanimous peoope who invited everyone into their fold is wrong , for that I'll ask you to read research paper on graves of ivc , the discrimination was something a fact of life for the people and the degree of discrimination was different from place to place suggesting a similar social oder with regional differentiation . More elaborate graves had less injury, less diseaes , better nutrition etc less elaborate graves had the exact opposite suggesting that there was differences in access to resources. Even if a person had tuberculosis or leprosy they had elaborate graves suggesting that status of the person was more important. All these evidence suggest that there must have been a rigid social oder, there is one hypothesis that this discrimination was based on lineage but it's a hypothesis not a fact but if proved then it would turn everything upside down as the origin of caste system was in Indus valley civilization but that's a story for another day my point is Indus valley civilization inhabitants were not magnanimous people, they were proficient in the art of warfare based upon weapons found in the ruins ,although you will not find evidence of warfare in painting or art but tell me this which Indian king boasts his conquest by showing killing and enslavement of people ?very few Kings did that . So war between Indo Aryans, who if they have not moved into India would have assimilated different people than in otl and have a different identity and the Indus valley civilization is entirely possible, there wasn't any war in otl because ivc had gone defunct to a large extent for a period of 400 years according to new research. Yeah the idea of Aryan invasion is as real as Earth being the center of universe .

In this time line I am trying to construct a senario of actual aryan invasion, what should have happen diffrently for the invasion to have actually happened and yeah this time line is a refutal to Aryan invasion theory because I am explaining how different things should be for that theory to be true . First of all survival of ivc is needed , secondly Indo Aryans who in this time line are simply Aryans since they have assimilated iranian people and other Indo European people plus a lot of people in the iranian plateau should develop a distinct identity based upon the influence of different people they encounter and finally the mega drought which occoured in and around 1600-1400 bc which also occurred in otl and was the major catalyst for Indo Aryans movement into punjab .

So peaceful co existance is not possible between Indo iranian and people of ivc
 
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Thus it is most appropriate to say that the rgvedam is actually something that was written by both info aryans and local harrapans.
I actually said this in this thread and everywhere this topic arose , that's why you have difference between ghatas and other avestan texts and the Vedas even though the language sounds similar but mind you similar doesn't mean Identical
 

Albert.Nik

Banned
@Freedom2018 Please note that the Indo-Iranians came into contact in the Waning days of the IVC if at all they came in contact with a live IVC at all in the first place. In this situation,it could be possible for Indo-Iranians to establish themselves with the IVC firmly though not friendly initially as you said. A Waxing IVC would look wholly different beyond the scope of thread. That would make a whole different type of Scenarios.
 
This is a fact most people ignore and also misunderstand of Vedic religion. They believe it to be same as Greek religion or Iranian but honestly it is not.
I said this as well and I have decicated one or two paragraphs as to why in this time line it is similar to iranian religion and I even wrote that Shakti and shavite movement latter on will cause trouble to the vedic clergy
 
Now if harappan survived thanthe relationship would be same as always one not of warring or conflict but rather one of cooperation and intermixing.
How ??? On what evidence do you say this ? That any intermixing will be peaceful? You are talking of warrior culture of Indo Aryans and the organized army of ivc city states and kingdoms will not have conflict ? Yeah the enite relationship between them will not be one of conflict but one of co operation and conflict and I said why quite clealy
 
Also dasas refers not to black people or Iranian people but those who did not have qualities of goodness and were ignorant.
Again read my thread Indo Aryans considered anyone who did not follow or adhere to their code or way of life as dasa , dasa doesn't mean slave , rig vedic Aryans entered into alliance with tribes that they considered as dasa , and I know Aryan dravidan is a British construct since dravida is a place not a race
 
Color of skin is based on alleles and melanin determined by environmental factors and I assure you aryans even original aryans were not light skinned rather light referred to qualities of an individual light being associated with fire and sun and brightness. Thus the relationship between Indo aryans and harrapans would be the same as otl even if harrapans does survive somehow with the difference being probably Shaivism and worship of Durga/devi worship would be more prominent and their would less of a caste system as rigid as we know it.
I know the color of the skin is dependent of sun , and if you read my lastest post you will see my response to this criticism that I am trying to construct a white India , I made this clear time and Time again the people of this time line will look different but the subcontinent will not have a billion blondes with blue eyes , Indians in this time line will look more like iranian people, pashtun and tajiks especially in the north and allow me to explain

The IVc was started by Neolithic farmers of zargos mountains, this group of people are related to kavkaz Hunter gatherers although the relationship was a distant one , they aquired the skill of agriculture from the people in the fertile crecent and they moved eastwards as the climate changed and began to settle down in the Indus valley eventually. There were some doubts if these people actually founded the civilization , but now the mystery has been solved to some extent since dna tests conducted on the graves of the ivc trade outposts show that all of them have this ancestry plus dna tests conducted on the remains found in India also how iranian neolithic farmers ancestry so for now although not conclusive the iranian neolithic farmers were the founders of this civilization. There is also evidence to show that this group did not suffer significant population bottleneck on its migration to India suggesting the number of people who migrated were quite large , large enough to leave it's genetic foot print in India , the iranian neolithic farmers had haplogroup Lm and certain sub clad of haplogroup J and they had SCL24A5 which makes them fair skinned and they usually had brown to black hair , with brown eyes . Since this population had a stable and large demographic it's unlikely that they mixed with Hunter gatheres of India ie AASI initially but later on they did intermix with AASI giving us ASI but this does not mean everyone intermixed with AASI during the hey days of the civilization, as DNA testing conducted on the remains found in the teadint outposts show that majority still didn't intermix as most of them still retained their ancestry. Now in 2500bc the Eastward shift of ivc began the monsoon began to weaken slowly , now the civilization was not based on the river Indus but was actually based on the river Ghagar Hakar which was a rain fed river and as monsoon began to weaken the rain fed river began to dry up earlier than usual. The people didn't settled down of Indus valley because of the floods which made it unreliable. So as the monsoon became unreliable most of the people went east and the rest went north while the later suffered a population bottleneck the former group mixed with the AASI their decendants still living among us . The remaining stayed put and mixed with the Indo Aryans who arrived in 1600 bc

Now as for the Indo Aryans well , they are fair skinned , there is no escaping that , well if change the definition of the term Indo Aryans then yeah you can say that they weren't fair skinned as Indo Aryans until their settlement in Afghanistan we're fair skinned. Now when I say they are fair skinned it doesn't mean they look like Nordic people, now this what causes a lot of controversy but Indo iranian in general and Indo Aryans in particular were a unique group of people with their own genetic history, culture, ethics and values much like the Indian , Iranian people of today . They are not related to any of the modern day population except the R haplogroup that you find in Iran and in the Indian subcontinent apart from that you have nothing in common with them . And how did they look like you might ask ? Well they looked like modern day tajik people and do tajiks look like say Nordic people the answer is obviously no and I have to say tajiks are a very bad proxy but the best we got .

Now what will happen in this time line? Well first of all there is no eastern shift of ivc inhabitants since they stayed put and adopted to new circumstances say they moved to the Indus valley which by now was not pronned to flooding and begin to grow wheat , barley and millets and give up growing rice and they do other innovation which they could have done in otl but for some reason they just didn't may be war and famine killed most of the talented workers . Now if the Aryans who have assimilated a lot of people group mix with Indus valley inhabitants you'd get a group of people looking like iranian, pashtun and tajiks, as for AASI well their population will not see a huge increase since the art of agriculture doesn't spread across the subcontinent as the ivc stayed put however some AASI People will develop advance agriculture, but population of AASI will suffer serious decline with the bond event which would wipe away their main source of food ie primitive agriculture and hunting as without the ivc inhabitants giving their knowledge and know how these tribes do not stand a chance.

This is the consequences of a surviving ivc
 
Now coming to 4.2 kilo year event and its impact on Indus valley civilization, many people including me have time and Time again emphasize it's role in it's demise and we were quite right in our belief that it was the reason. Further research paper published last year showed that civilization depended upon the rain fed Ghagar Hakar river , which stopped being a glacier fed river 10,000 years before the rise of ivc and it was the weakening of the monsson that caused this river to dry up not the reduction in glacier water outflow which was thought up until now . Now the question that arises is why not it's inhabitants go to plan B? That is shift to Indus valley, Indus now has become much more manageable, less monsson, less glacier water meltoff so less flood . The answer to this question lies in the political climate of the ivc it is hypotheszed that on the decline of the monsoon the authorities holding power in ivc effectively collapsed and there was a civil war , wars etc which disrupted the trade in goods and movement of grain and agriculture produce from the village to the cities , so you have a stituation where cities are abandoned because they are targets of parties to the war and lack of services provided by them and what you get is the process of de urbanization.

Now in this climate of economic and political collapse there are few who could command men and resources to rebuild a civilization on the Indus BUT it's not impossible for the Indus valley to rebuild it's civilization on the banks of the Indus and in the Punjab , say Assyrians did it in Mesopotamian lands and the politics would not have been so different in the Indus valley so what Indus valley lacked was a strong central authority to take control of a rapidly deteriorating situation. Though we can see evidence of people moving away from the Ghagar Hakar into the Punjab and Gujarat but it appears that the efforts were not Co ordinated .

The troubles of the Harappans did not end there they could have rebuild the civilization insipte of war , famine and loss of their cities and way of life . What caused the people to abandon their lands was leprosy and tuberculosis. The evidence of rebuilding of the glory of the past by Harappans is found all over , they tried to adjust with the changing times , in Gujarat they began to grow millets , in Punjab they stopped growing rice since it was water intensive , settlement were being rebuilt but these diseases put an end to it . The Harappans died in their millions due to wars , famines, flood , drought, diseases and million or so left the lands which by now they were convinced that they are cursed and what remains was a shadow of it's former glory and this is what the Indo Aryans encountered when they set foot into India .

What happened to the Harappans you ask ?
Well a lot of them left the lands over a period of time say from 2300 bc the eastward shift began the gradual abandonment of the lands and they began to mix with the AASI , they carried with them some of their knowledge but not all .
Some stayed put and later on when the Aryans came in they mixed with these Indo Aryans to create the Vedas etc . One of the effect of abandoning of ivc by it's inhabitants is the rise in the population further east and the decrease in the population further west . The AASI who didn't even number in a million saw a sudden expansion in their population as more advance technique of agriculture was introduced and their was better moblization and better use of resources



In this time line the ivc adjusts to the changes in climate and there is no war , no diseases they remain in their lands while handful migrate Eastward . They are conquored by the Aryans and later there is peaceful mixing with some minor to medium scale cinflucon in between
 
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