In this country , it is good to kill an admiral from time to time
- Thread starter Antony444
- Start date
I think this is the moment where the UPNG finally realizes that it is not as strong as it thinks.
Well, this is getting out of hand for everyone, so yes, France will have to intervene, though it's fun to see all your enemies shoot each other without lifting a finger...
They realised that before; the naval conference was in great part the realisation they couldn't fight China, and they couldn't limit their rearmament on their own.
Preventing the escalation (The Last Floridian-Carolinian War 1914)
The Floridian propaganda, never bothering too much with little things known as reality, of course announced the moment the naval battle of Jamaica was won that the reconquest of Floridian territories was at hand and the fate of war had turned. The entry of the Mexican Empire into the war and the surprise sabotage operation were obviously additional evidence of that.
In reality, the new declarations of war and the sea fighting were the beginning of the end. Though for once Andrew III Jackson wasn’t at fault, there were high risks the limited Carolinian-Floridian conflict was about to erupt into something larger and far worse. The True New Spanish troops, which had been preparing to assault Cuba, were mustered on the New Mexican northern border. The UPNG was forced to mobilise and send reinforcements to its ‘sister republic’, the polite term to describe what was for all intent and purpose a puppet regime. There were battleships and cruisers arriving from the Pacific at Panama. California was recalling some of its half-pay reservists. Brazilian veterans were waving their sabres, although the identity of their targets remained in the air.
Even Madrid, capital of the Holy Empire of Spain, was beginning to have ideas: the New Virginians had not sent their whole army overseas, but the regiments which had departed were now either lying in swallow graves or eaten by fishes under the waves. What was left in the Consulate’s barracks wouldn’t be able to put up much resistance, even if they inflicted one-on-one kills to the forces of the Holy Empress.
This was not a second edition of the Great War, but it had the potential of being a far, far nastier struggle than a Carolinian-Floridian conflict could be, and it had the potential to spread far and wide. Even in the scenario where it stopped with the principal suspects, however, it would still be a war with battlefronts on North, Central, and South America.
This time, Empress Charlotte of France intervened directly. While a large majority of diplomats and Generals had been content to let Carolina and Florida weakening each other, this was a stance which could be accepted only if the actions of a few didn’t spread the flames of war on every continent. If nothing was done, soon the Entente and the UPNG would be in a state of hostilities, and though France should be able to win, it was going to cost a lot of blood and money for an affair which ultimately did not concern Paris.
Thus on July 2, French diplomats delivered messages to the main parties which were preparing to thrown their fortunes and their military forces into the war. The last Floridian envoys still on French territory were asked to take their bags and vacate their embassies. Their messages were backed by the steel fist of approximately one hundred thousand soldiers, which were busy assaulting the western border of Florida and putting down any possibility of a Floridian salvation from this province. On July 4, the French Caribbean Fleet found the damaged Floridian fleet and destroyed it. At three battleships against one, the formers being far faster and more sea-worthy than the latter, it wasn’t even a contest.
The effects were immediate in the Mexican Empire. The population and most of the leadership had not been in support of this ill-conceived war, and as the crowds massed to scream that they didn’t want a repeat of the previous military disasters, the Floridian ‘advisors’ and their friends tried to escape, only to realise most of their troops loyalties’ had already changed of sides. The old regime, which had been enjoying the delicacies of the Mexican prison system, was freed and returned to power, while the usurpers met firing squads. The declaration of war against the New Merica Aristocratic Republic was naturally null and void, and the violent border skirmishes supposed to prelude far more important offensives stopped.
Meanwhile, secret talks somewhere in Delaware were taking fruit. The Carolinian government, which had by now a good idea of the Floridian economy’s disastrous state, decided to comply with the ‘concerns’ of the French envoys. Columbia would annex a large area, mainly what had been Georgia, while France seized back the lands on the west the Directorate had incorporated during the Great War and expel the ‘illegal trespassers’. As for the rest of Florida, it would be demilitarised and forced to comply under strict pacifist policies. Slavery and ‘forced labour’ were to be banned forever, and a lot of Floridian officers would be transferred to Carolinian custody for an eventual war crimes’ tribunal. No agreement could be found in such a short amount of time on the system of government the new Florida would have, but it wouldn’t be a Directorate.
When France and Carolina announced it officially on July 10, the reaction from Havana – or New Jacksonville depending upon your allegiances – was extremely volcanic. Without surprise, the ‘Eternal Leader of the Floridian People’ reiterated he would never accept the terms dictated by the loathsome carrion birds of Columbia and Paris, and vowed (once more) to fight to the end, to fight to the last bullet, and to never surrender. The fact French Marines were landing unopposed on Jamaican shores and that revolts agitated the hinterlands of Cuba failed to register on the dictator’s mind.
Unfortunately for Andrew III Jackson, most of his senior subordinates were aware of how desperate their situation was, and they didn’t want to fall on their swords like him. What didn’t help the Director’s case was the previous abandonment of his own capital when he had sworn on his ancestor’s souls he would do nothing of the sort.
On July 12, the Floridian High Command arrested Andrew III Jackson and the replacement of Damian Jackson, Marshal Frederick Bush, was elected ‘Protector of Cuba and Florida’ before asking Carolina and France for terms. To their great shame, the UPNG-led block wasn’t even consulted...
The Floridian propaganda, never bothering too much with little things known as reality, of course announced the moment the naval battle of Jamaica was won that the reconquest of Floridian territories was at hand and the fate of war had turned. The entry of the Mexican Empire into the war and the surprise sabotage operation were obviously additional evidence of that.
In reality, the new declarations of war and the sea fighting were the beginning of the end. Though for once Andrew III Jackson wasn’t at fault, there were high risks the limited Carolinian-Floridian conflict was about to erupt into something larger and far worse. The True New Spanish troops, which had been preparing to assault Cuba, were mustered on the New Mexican northern border. The UPNG was forced to mobilise and send reinforcements to its ‘sister republic’, the polite term to describe what was for all intent and purpose a puppet regime. There were battleships and cruisers arriving from the Pacific at Panama. California was recalling some of its half-pay reservists. Brazilian veterans were waving their sabres, although the identity of their targets remained in the air.
Even Madrid, capital of the Holy Empire of Spain, was beginning to have ideas: the New Virginians had not sent their whole army overseas, but the regiments which had departed were now either lying in swallow graves or eaten by fishes under the waves. What was left in the Consulate’s barracks wouldn’t be able to put up much resistance, even if they inflicted one-on-one kills to the forces of the Holy Empress.
This was not a second edition of the Great War, but it had the potential of being a far, far nastier struggle than a Carolinian-Floridian conflict could be, and it had the potential to spread far and wide. Even in the scenario where it stopped with the principal suspects, however, it would still be a war with battlefronts on North, Central, and South America.
This time, Empress Charlotte of France intervened directly. While a large majority of diplomats and Generals had been content to let Carolina and Florida weakening each other, this was a stance which could be accepted only if the actions of a few didn’t spread the flames of war on every continent. If nothing was done, soon the Entente and the UPNG would be in a state of hostilities, and though France should be able to win, it was going to cost a lot of blood and money for an affair which ultimately did not concern Paris.
Thus on July 2, French diplomats delivered messages to the main parties which were preparing to thrown their fortunes and their military forces into the war. The last Floridian envoys still on French territory were asked to take their bags and vacate their embassies. Their messages were backed by the steel fist of approximately one hundred thousand soldiers, which were busy assaulting the western border of Florida and putting down any possibility of a Floridian salvation from this province. On July 4, the French Caribbean Fleet found the damaged Floridian fleet and destroyed it. At three battleships against one, the formers being far faster and more sea-worthy than the latter, it wasn’t even a contest.
The effects were immediate in the Mexican Empire. The population and most of the leadership had not been in support of this ill-conceived war, and as the crowds massed to scream that they didn’t want a repeat of the previous military disasters, the Floridian ‘advisors’ and their friends tried to escape, only to realise most of their troops loyalties’ had already changed of sides. The old regime, which had been enjoying the delicacies of the Mexican prison system, was freed and returned to power, while the usurpers met firing squads. The declaration of war against the New Merica Aristocratic Republic was naturally null and void, and the violent border skirmishes supposed to prelude far more important offensives stopped.
Meanwhile, secret talks somewhere in Delaware were taking fruit. The Carolinian government, which had by now a good idea of the Floridian economy’s disastrous state, decided to comply with the ‘concerns’ of the French envoys. Columbia would annex a large area, mainly what had been Georgia, while France seized back the lands on the west the Directorate had incorporated during the Great War and expel the ‘illegal trespassers’. As for the rest of Florida, it would be demilitarised and forced to comply under strict pacifist policies. Slavery and ‘forced labour’ were to be banned forever, and a lot of Floridian officers would be transferred to Carolinian custody for an eventual war crimes’ tribunal. No agreement could be found in such a short amount of time on the system of government the new Florida would have, but it wouldn’t be a Directorate.
When France and Carolina announced it officially on July 10, the reaction from Havana – or New Jacksonville depending upon your allegiances – was extremely volcanic. Without surprise, the ‘Eternal Leader of the Floridian People’ reiterated he would never accept the terms dictated by the loathsome carrion birds of Columbia and Paris, and vowed (once more) to fight to the end, to fight to the last bullet, and to never surrender. The fact French Marines were landing unopposed on Jamaican shores and that revolts agitated the hinterlands of Cuba failed to register on the dictator’s mind.
Unfortunately for Andrew III Jackson, most of his senior subordinates were aware of how desperate their situation was, and they didn’t want to fall on their swords like him. What didn’t help the Director’s case was the previous abandonment of his own capital when he had sworn on his ancestor’s souls he would do nothing of the sort.
On July 12, the Floridian High Command arrested Andrew III Jackson and the replacement of Damian Jackson, Marshal Frederick Bush, was elected ‘Protector of Cuba and Florida’ before asking Carolina and France for terms. To their great shame, the UPNG-led block wasn’t even consulted...
🤣 What a pity, I don't know who is the worst? The UPNG and the lost of credibility (again... the members of the Central Alliance are probably rethinhking why they still are member) or the Director and its end, not with a BOOM but with a pitiful sigh. (Btw, I vote for the creation of an elective monarchy with a strong assembly, a little like Poland, it should be agreed upon by both France and Carolinas, no?)
Still, it shows how bad the situation is for the UPNG people, propaganda can't save the government. I mean a dying power manage to humiliate them for the world to see, oh the shame must burn hard.
Does it mean international alliances will move after this fiasco? The political situation is very different from before the last Chinese War. Is it time to ready for round two of the Great War?
Still, it shows how bad the situation is for the UPNG people, propaganda can't save the government. I mean a dying power manage to humiliate them for the world to see, oh the shame must burn hard.
Does it mean international alliances will move after this fiasco? The political situation is very different from before the last Chinese War. Is it time to ready for round two of the Great War?
Certainly what some officers (if not the outright majority) have in mind, yes. It helps that they have Cuba as an enormous bargain piece (and that they can't defend it adequately anymore with their last naval forces gone).
Certainly the UPNG; people tend to forget, but OTL WW2 is an anomaly in the regard that in general, if the leadership of a country is sane, fighting will end long before the enemy troops are marching in your capital.
There certainly are going to be...err...punishing elections somewhere in South America. And the legacy of the last years is going to haunt them for a long time to come.
For the moment, no one is really ready for a second edition of the Great War, it has been merely twelve years, and a lot of economies are still scarred by its consequences...not to mention a lot of families are mourning the loss of their children. It would need something very, very radical to begin something like the second act of the Great War...but then again, the incompetence of certain politicians made it a close act in this war.
Interesting! For once, instead of someone pouring oil over the fire, we have people acting in a reasonable fashion and avoiding a new global conflict (or at the very least an American one).
Althought I've got the feeling that, sooner rather than later, there's going to be a new free-for-all between the three Mexicos. Perhaps they will become two? It wouldn't be the first country (nor the last) divided into North and South, at this point it would almost be like a tradition.
On the other hand, it doesn't seem like those peace terms would apply to New Virginia, and the Holy Empress has certain ambitions... I'm looking at the map in post 2,537 (page 127). Spain could launch a land attack from New Palma, maybe even with some help from French Cote d'Ivoire.
The New Virginian soldiers committed all manners of attrocities against the Carolinians, so I doubt anyone would bat an eye in the case of a joint French-Spanish invasion and partition of New Virginia.
However, knowing the history of "successes" of the Spanish armies in this timeline (and in OTL too), I'm almost sure that it would backfire somehow. Such a conflict could teach them important lessons for the next Big One, but they would have to pay the price in tears and blood. Again.
Althought I've got the feeling that, sooner rather than later, there's going to be a new free-for-all between the three Mexicos. Perhaps they will become two? It wouldn't be the first country (nor the last) divided into North and South, at this point it would almost be like a tradition.
On the other hand, it doesn't seem like those peace terms would apply to New Virginia, and the Holy Empress has certain ambitions... I'm looking at the map in post 2,537 (page 127). Spain could launch a land attack from New Palma, maybe even with some help from French Cote d'Ivoire.
The New Virginian soldiers committed all manners of attrocities against the Carolinians, so I doubt anyone would bat an eye in the case of a joint French-Spanish invasion and partition of New Virginia.
However, knowing the history of "successes" of the Spanish armies in this timeline (and in OTL too), I'm almost sure that it would backfire somehow. Such a conflict could teach them important lessons for the next Big One, but they would have to pay the price in tears and blood. Again.
Finally, the war ends! It is a shame that Spain didn’t invade New Virginia, though.
I can’t wait for the next major war!
I can’t wait for the next major war!
I smell a isolationist movement in the UPNG gaining ground after such fiasco, and many politicians career would end some would be lucky to be mayor of their own city by the end of this.
There were precedents. Napoleonic wars saw a few capitals attacked. 1870 also comes to mind (not directly in, but not far ...). There are also older examples...
Pragmatic Decisions (The Last Floridian-Carolinian War and the Congress of Baltimore 1914)
On July 14 1914, the UPNG government fell. Its credibility had been torn to shreds, and it was clear that, if the Granadans wanted to participate to a peace conference, they would need to present new interlocutors to the French and the Carolinians. The acting-Minister of Foreign Affairs Juan Lopez, who until a few days ago had been a minor figure of the opposition, was charged to conduct negotiations with the victorious Powers while the Granadan institutions debated when the next elections would take place.
Needless to say, it was a thankless task. The UPNG had not lost much truth to tell in terms of military capabilities: defeats like the one suffered off the Jamaica coast were more embarrassing on the field of public opinion that they truly hurt the total military capabilities of the Republic. But this was indeed the big problem: the loss of face in the newspapers and among the common people was massive. Some key members of the Central Alliance had begun to suffer from the propaganda of foreign countries, mainly sponsored by China, that their help in the ‘fight for liberty’ was always more costly than promised. Often these voices full of loathing affirmed, the insurrectionists found themselves replacing one master with another.
The Granadans of course had counterattacked with carefully prepared propaganda campaigns of their own; the newly reunited Chinese Empire of Empress Ren was hardly a place of tolerance for former Red Banners’ troops who refused to bow before their new sovereign. Tens of thousands of Northern Chinese were killed after the final surrender was done, and more would disappear on trains headed west as purges continued.
Unfortunately, China was far, far from Europe, and the anti-foreigners policies had made sure there weren’t tens of thousands settlers who sent messages to other continents to reveal how mistreated they were. The acts of the UPNG military arm, however, were done in front of a worldly audience. That the hasty declaration war had resulted in a defeat mere days after it was made, and that no territorial gain whatsoever could be reported was extremely embarrassing.
Consequently, their Acting-Minister was already walking on eggs before arriving at Baltimore, where the Congress had been decided by a common accord between the French and the Carolinians. The New Merica Aristocratic Republic was unhappy at having spent a lot of gold and blood for nothing. The Californians worried about their positions in Asia, and thought the entire ‘adventure’ had been ill-advised and stupid.
In these circumstances, the two most powerful blocks had the road wide opened to make their view a reality, and they didn’t fail to exploit it. The territorial gains Paris and Columbia had agreed upon beforehand were ratified.
The lands which had been the Directorate of Florida on the American continent would be utterly demilitarised; the Carolinian President and his government being saluted by a thunder of applause when he proclaimed that never again would Florida have the opportunity to wage another war against their northern neighbour.
As for the system of government the Floridians would govern themselves, it was to be a Republic. A strange Republic, it had to be mentioned. As the die-hard supporters of the regime fled for Cuba and the labour classes crossed the Straits in the other direction, all laws proposed which tended to influence a regime with a strong central power were shot down with fury and steely determination. The common Floridian had seen what ‘paradise’ men like Andrew III Jackson could give them, and they wanted none of it. The final result was thus more of a confederacy of towns, an extremely loose one, with little industry and technology to be proud of.
Of course, this course of action was done with incomplete information. From October to December as the congress was taking place, many Floridians had believed the island Cuba would be allowed to remain part of their nation.
It wasn’t going to happen. The Carolinians knew the core of the surviving military forces had taken refuge on Cuba, and past the occasional General they wanted to judge for war crimes, the inhabitants of Columbia wanted the ex-supporters of the Director to stay where they were; Cuba had not the capacity to rebuild anything more dangerous than a shadow of the pre-1914 army and fleet which had threatened them and caused them so much trouble. The Generals and other Jackson fanatics could stay where they were, and die of heart attack there as far as they were concerned. Anyone who wanted to leave Cuba had to be given the opportunity to do so – and the Floridians bowed to the unavoidable on this. But Cuba would not be part of the Floridian Republic; instead it was to become the Cuban Dominion, the remnant of a dictatorial junta on a tropical island, giving birth to all sort of clichés and parodies which still exist today in movies and games.
And obviously, France established the Kingdom of Jamaica, placing a former Colonel who had participated in the victory against the UPNG as monarch, and forcing the people of the island to adopt a constitutional monarchy as their political system. The ex-Floridian territory was now a French puppet, and Québec didn’t make any secret of it.
Otherwise in Central America, the status quo returned, with a lot of teeth gritting. It satisfied few people in True New Spain and the Merica Republic, but the population of the Mexican Empire was ecstatic; they had avoided a two-front war they had every chance to lose. The good points of eliminating their Floridian ‘advisors’ were not to be disdained too. On the downside, it also left them without a powerful patron on the world stage.
Peace was not completely returned. New Virginia refused to consider the most generous peace offers sent over the Atlantic, but with their ships and submarines all sunk and their expeditionary forces dead or missing in action, they had no choice to accept a tacit end of hostilities, especially as the Spanish on their frontier began to be more threatening than ever.
1914 ended thus with the world mostly at peace. But no one would forget anytime soon that how narrowly a general conflagration had been averted...
On July 14 1914, the UPNG government fell. Its credibility had been torn to shreds, and it was clear that, if the Granadans wanted to participate to a peace conference, they would need to present new interlocutors to the French and the Carolinians. The acting-Minister of Foreign Affairs Juan Lopez, who until a few days ago had been a minor figure of the opposition, was charged to conduct negotiations with the victorious Powers while the Granadan institutions debated when the next elections would take place.
Needless to say, it was a thankless task. The UPNG had not lost much truth to tell in terms of military capabilities: defeats like the one suffered off the Jamaica coast were more embarrassing on the field of public opinion that they truly hurt the total military capabilities of the Republic. But this was indeed the big problem: the loss of face in the newspapers and among the common people was massive. Some key members of the Central Alliance had begun to suffer from the propaganda of foreign countries, mainly sponsored by China, that their help in the ‘fight for liberty’ was always more costly than promised. Often these voices full of loathing affirmed, the insurrectionists found themselves replacing one master with another.
The Granadans of course had counterattacked with carefully prepared propaganda campaigns of their own; the newly reunited Chinese Empire of Empress Ren was hardly a place of tolerance for former Red Banners’ troops who refused to bow before their new sovereign. Tens of thousands of Northern Chinese were killed after the final surrender was done, and more would disappear on trains headed west as purges continued.
Unfortunately, China was far, far from Europe, and the anti-foreigners policies had made sure there weren’t tens of thousands settlers who sent messages to other continents to reveal how mistreated they were. The acts of the UPNG military arm, however, were done in front of a worldly audience. That the hasty declaration war had resulted in a defeat mere days after it was made, and that no territorial gain whatsoever could be reported was extremely embarrassing.
Consequently, their Acting-Minister was already walking on eggs before arriving at Baltimore, where the Congress had been decided by a common accord between the French and the Carolinians. The New Merica Aristocratic Republic was unhappy at having spent a lot of gold and blood for nothing. The Californians worried about their positions in Asia, and thought the entire ‘adventure’ had been ill-advised and stupid.
In these circumstances, the two most powerful blocks had the road wide opened to make their view a reality, and they didn’t fail to exploit it. The territorial gains Paris and Columbia had agreed upon beforehand were ratified.
The lands which had been the Directorate of Florida on the American continent would be utterly demilitarised; the Carolinian President and his government being saluted by a thunder of applause when he proclaimed that never again would Florida have the opportunity to wage another war against their northern neighbour.
As for the system of government the Floridians would govern themselves, it was to be a Republic. A strange Republic, it had to be mentioned. As the die-hard supporters of the regime fled for Cuba and the labour classes crossed the Straits in the other direction, all laws proposed which tended to influence a regime with a strong central power were shot down with fury and steely determination. The common Floridian had seen what ‘paradise’ men like Andrew III Jackson could give them, and they wanted none of it. The final result was thus more of a confederacy of towns, an extremely loose one, with little industry and technology to be proud of.
Of course, this course of action was done with incomplete information. From October to December as the congress was taking place, many Floridians had believed the island Cuba would be allowed to remain part of their nation.
It wasn’t going to happen. The Carolinians knew the core of the surviving military forces had taken refuge on Cuba, and past the occasional General they wanted to judge for war crimes, the inhabitants of Columbia wanted the ex-supporters of the Director to stay where they were; Cuba had not the capacity to rebuild anything more dangerous than a shadow of the pre-1914 army and fleet which had threatened them and caused them so much trouble. The Generals and other Jackson fanatics could stay where they were, and die of heart attack there as far as they were concerned. Anyone who wanted to leave Cuba had to be given the opportunity to do so – and the Floridians bowed to the unavoidable on this. But Cuba would not be part of the Floridian Republic; instead it was to become the Cuban Dominion, the remnant of a dictatorial junta on a tropical island, giving birth to all sort of clichés and parodies which still exist today in movies and games.
And obviously, France established the Kingdom of Jamaica, placing a former Colonel who had participated in the victory against the UPNG as monarch, and forcing the people of the island to adopt a constitutional monarchy as their political system. The ex-Floridian territory was now a French puppet, and Québec didn’t make any secret of it.
Otherwise in Central America, the status quo returned, with a lot of teeth gritting. It satisfied few people in True New Spain and the Merica Republic, but the population of the Mexican Empire was ecstatic; they had avoided a two-front war they had every chance to lose. The good points of eliminating their Floridian ‘advisors’ were not to be disdained too. On the downside, it also left them without a powerful patron on the world stage.
Peace was not completely returned. New Virginia refused to consider the most generous peace offers sent over the Atlantic, but with their ships and submarines all sunk and their expeditionary forces dead or missing in action, they had no choice to accept a tacit end of hostilities, especially as the Spanish on their frontier began to be more threatening than ever.
1914 ended thus with the world mostly at peace. But no one would forget anytime soon that how narrowly a general conflagration had been averted...
I can’t wait to see the new Carolina on the world map, now that they’ve taken Georgia!
Also, I hope Spain invades New Virginia and wipes out every single slaver.
Also, I hope Spain invades New Virginia and wipes out every single slaver.
Thanks, I will likely update the new map for 1914 next week.
As for New Virginia...well, Spain has decided to do like a lot of people and avoid the escalation. Though the invasion's plans are still available, of course.
I mean it kinda is at this point. Sure France could spank them in any future war, but they are now the unchallenged American power excluding France, with a modern army and navy to boot. Besides, they have 10 million people now, giving them a larger population than other minor Great powers.
Ten million peoples is nowhere near a great power level. Now if it was around 40 to 60 millions with a potent economy i'd say yes.
California only has 3.5 million people, Ireland has 8 million including colonies, the UPNG has 18.5 million, they are all minor Great powers.
Heh. Some things never change, regardless of the timeline. Nice chapter!
The question is: for how long? Dun dun duuun.
I’ve got the feeling that someone, somewhere, is playing with matches while surrounded by tinder.
I would dispute the term great power with such low population. They are all minor power except the UPNG who is a regional power. I still stand by my earlier statement.