"Images of 1984" - Stories from Oceania

Considering the fact that up until the 1970s, Asian characters were portrayed by Caucasians in Hollywood lends credence to the idea that Oceania just uses make-up to disguise the prisoners. One example is David Carradine who played a Chinese man in the series Kung Fu.

There is a whole wikipedia article on it:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yellowface
 
Or the Brits could have used the Asian population that already existed and breeded them for this purpose. For a massively screwed up state that Oceania is, it shouldn't take that much of a stretch to have that sort of program.

One thing that I wonder about is how the 2-way tv works in this world. Obviously such technology is impossible to put in almost every Inner and Upper party home in the tech level of 1984. So do you plan on removing this aspect of the story, or is tech somehow more forward in this time line.
 
Or the Brits could have used the Asian population that already existed and breeded them for this purpose. For a massively screwed up state that Oceania is, it shouldn't take that much of a stretch to have that sort of program.

One thing that I wonder about is how the 2-way tv works in this world. Obviously such technology is impossible to put in almost every Inner and Upper party home in the tech level of 1984. So do you plan on removing this aspect of the story, or is tech somehow more forward in this time line.

Both good points... there doesn't necessarily *have* to be someone watching each individual screen, all the time. Remember, Winston isn't constantly being talked to by actual individuals - that I remember, there are only two instances in th entire novel when someone speks directly to him through one.

It could be random surveillance. You know, like city-centre cameras in the UK today.

Orwell must be, to quote a random Discworld book, "revolving at generating speed." :-(
 
So is Oceania an isolated England, or it is as it is in the books?

I could do either, but I would have some ideas over what could happen in a radiation infested United States...
 
With regard to the degree of individual surveillance undertaken by the Thought Police I'm sure that Winston comments somewhere in the book that although they couldn't watch everyone all the time, you had to behave as though this was the case.

Remember also that it is only Igsoc Party members who are subject to this monitoring, not the proles. How many Outer Party members were there anyway? 1-2million?. Not impossible to watch them all.
 
Good points, doublethink and make-up seem pretty reasonable...

But mongolian fisherboats in the North Sea?:D

Yep, not very likely. But, given that the party was so powerfull, it could probably have convinced its subjetcts that Taiwanese, Malay or Peruvian sailors are indeed "Mongolian". Remember that by 1984, given the life expentacy in the country, most of the inhabitants would be under 40 years old, and wouldn't have had any contact with the outside world except through the party. They wouldn't have known anything except what the party wanted them to "know". If somebody looks a bit different than the averege British citizen, and the Party says its Eurasian, then it IS Eurasian.
 
Mongoloid was what the book said... which is a name for someone with Downs Syndrome... maybe IngSoc used the mentally challenged for the shows...
 
1942-45
The war continued to thrive and expand throughout Europe, and increasingly, throughout the Empire as the Japanese moved to expand their influence.

In the east of Europe the Soviet Union was resurgent following poor leadership from Hitler and his armies in the east. The winter of 1942-3 put pay to any real German threat in the Soviet Union, and turned the tide of war in favour of Stalin.

By 1944, with various successes in north Africa and the Med. the western allies recognised the growing threat from the Soviet Union, and particularly, if the Soviets were to reach central and western Europe in the event of probable German collapse.

The Tehran Conference of the winter of 1943 put in place the foundations for post-war Europe, and from the Anglo-American perspective put a cautious limit on the amount of Russian influence after the war.

On June 5th 1944, due to poor weather over the English Channel, the allies decided to postpone the imminent invasion of Normandy until 2nd July, causing all manner of logistical problems in the south of England and also impacting upon relations with the Free French and the resistance, who were keen to see the invasion occur.

July 2nd came and successful landings were established throughout Normandy [1], and although fighting was harsh, it looked as though the allies would succeed.

The loss of life was high, and Churchill took the brunt of criticism, particularly from Mosley. From there onwards their relationship based on mutual admiration across political differences suffered, with the quagmire of war in northern France once again being seen by Mosley. In the east the Soviets continued to move forwards towards Berlin, leaving them in a strong bargaining position, despite the outcomes of the Tehran Conference.

At the end of 1944 the western allies had secured Paris, but fighting in the Ardennes and northern France in light of a German counter attack meant that the winter saw very little movement from the allies.

It was clear to all - particularly Stalin - that the allies had failed in their objective of a succesful invasion that would see them reach the German hinterland by the end of 1944.

The Soviets pushed on, capturing Berlin in mid-May as the German war machine moved west into the Ruhr, surrounded by the allies on all sides.

On August 2nd 1945 at 8.00am a new weapon was leashed onto the world. The city of Hamburg was the victim of the first Atomic weapon to be used in anger.

The immediate reaction, certainly from the Russians, was to halt their advance. Russian forces were just sixty miles from Hamburg, and it caused Stalin to reconsider his continued quest for territory in the west.

On 6th August 1945 the Germany government unconditionally surrendered to the western allies, with Hitler having been captured and executed one day previously by a small group of German army generals around twenty miles north of the German-Swiss border after a small battle with loyal SS forces.

The war, at least in Europe, was over, and in Britain it was time to go to the polls.

[1] The landings were certainly not as successful as in OTL, causing many politicians to consider them a failure in achieving their objectives with minimal loss of life, particularly Mosley. The use of an atomic weapon on Germany was seen as not only breaking the resolve of the Germans in the west, but also as putting a very blunt halt on Soviet ambitions in western Germany. Churchill was the most shaken by the loss of life in the west, with Mosley most critical - especially as the October 1945 General Election occurred.
 
Having read the thread, a few questions I wonder about:

Does Oceania Britain have any relations with other nations? What about relations with countries similar to itself - such as North Korea, Iraq etc .? How does it interact officially with the rest of the world?

Is it a member of the United Nations - and, if so, is it still one of the "big players"? Member of the Security Council etc? Is it aligned with the US or the Soviets - or maybe a member of the Non-aligned movement?

I note the thread-starter has said that the offical name for Oceania-Britain is "the United Republic of England". What's become of Wales and Scotland? Are they no longer part of what was once the UK? This intrigues me as the ruling party in 1984 is described as being called "The Ingsoc Party" - or English Socialist. Do Scotland and Wales (and what about Northern Ireland?) form part of a sort of "mini-soviet union" under England with their own puppet "autonomous" regimes, perhaps?

I'm really looking forward to the rest of this thread! :)
 
I note the thread-starter has said that the offical name for Oceania-Britain is "the United Republic of England". What's become of Wales and Scotland? Are they no longer part of what was once the UK? This intrigues me as the ruling party in 1984 is described as being called "The Ingsoc Party" - or English Socialist. Do Scotland and Wales (and what about Northern Ireland?) form part of a sort of "mini-soviet union" under England with their own puppet "autonomous" regimes, perhaps?

I was curious about this too. Possibly Wales gets counted with England, but Scotland is an interesting question.

*chants* United Ireland! United Ireland! United Ireland! :D
 
With regard to the degree of individual surveillance undertaken by the Thought Police I'm sure that Winston comments somewhere in the book that although they couldn't watch everyone all the time, you had to behave as though this was the case.
Damn! I meant to mention that... yes, of course you have to assume that.
Remember also that it is only Ingsoc Party members who are subject to this monitoring, not the proles. How many Outer Party members were there anyway? 1-2million?. Not impossible to watch them all.
But watch them with who? The proles wouldn't know what they were watching for, due to their lack of 'correct' political education. The Outer Party can't all be watching each other... and the Inner Party is much smaller, and (supposedly) busy with the business of government.
 
Damn! I meant to mention that... yes, of course you have to assume that.

But watch them with who? The proles wouldn't know what they were watching for, due to their lack of 'correct' political education. The Outer Party can't all be watching each other... and the Inner Party is much smaller, and (supposedly) busy with the business of government.

Don't forget about the children. Remember that Winston's neighbor was reported by his own kids.
 
The Thought Police are the third leg of the power structure in Oceania:

Inner Party
Armed Forces
Thought Police

They are the watchers. It was the same in the old Soviet Union Troika:

CPSU
KGB
Army

The State itself was a constant balancing act between the three factions, with the Party appointing the heads of the Army and KGB. In turn the Party needed either the Army or KGB to maintain itself in power, so allied with each of these organs as convenient. That's how occasionally the KGB and Party purged the Army as in 1937 when Tukhachevsky and the others were liquidated, and the KGB itself purged by the Army on Stalin's death in 1952, when the Army under Zhukhov allied with the Party under Khruschev to liquidate Beria and other KGB magnates.

Orwell modelled Oceania on Stalinist USSR completely. Even BB was modelled on Stalin, and Goldstein on Trotsky though he had BB living forever.

As an Outer Party member, Smith would be largely unaware of the true dynamics of the Troika running Oceania, merely noting changes in leadership below BB (The Party) when either Thought Police or Army gained a temporary ascendancy.
 
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