Donald Reaver
Donor
And some decent food aboard the ships, a good curry with a lager, the advantages of a world wide cultural food diffusion.
If they will not meet us on the open sea (a Trent TL)
- Thread starter Saphroneth
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Saphroneth
Banned
Pretty much.
Next time - back to Mexico, probably the USA, and I might also do something in China - the Taipeng Rebellion is largely burning out, but there's a young Emperor (very young, as in seven) on the throne, and China also is in need of military and technological reforms.
Next time - back to Mexico, probably the USA, and I might also do something in China - the Taipeng Rebellion is largely burning out, but there's a young Emperor (very young, as in seven) on the throne, and China also is in need of military and technological reforms.
I wondered what the hell I was reading - had to check the title and actually chuckled - "Saphroneth's cocked this one up" ha ha!Bugger, the jokes on me
Love it - complete with stealth Honor Harrington references, unless I'm very much mistaken. I'm not sure OTL British SF would have been quite so comfortable with imperialism and gunboat diplomacy by the good guys in 1968; is this a hint the British Empire is a considerably healthier and happier outfit from 1863 onwards than in OTL?
Saphroneth
Banned
Think of the attitude which produced Blake's 7, perhaps, or indeed Battlestar Galactica - the protagonists aren't good, they're just the better option. (Those Surface-Space missiles are provided by the villains, who want to destabilize the place and then move in themselves!)
And yes, Tankersley is a Honorverse reference.
11-18 November 1863
Saphroneth
Banned
11 November
Death of Frederick VII of Denmark, around one week before the planned signing into law of the (as yet not quite finalized) November Constitution.
Causing particular problems is that the Holstein parliament has signalled that it is not willing to accept the current form of the constitution - creating a particular problem as the Union Constitution that had previously controlled the whole Danish Union has been in abeyance for five years after an act of the German Confederation, and Holstein as such technically does not have a constitution at this point.
13 November
The Ever Victorious Army under Ward achieves another remarkable victory in the service of the Qing dynasty, making heavy use of the Napoleonic "artillery charge" supported by light infantry sharpshooters to defeat the enemy main body - an odd reversal of the normal means of fighting with infantry supported by artillery.
By now close to 7,500 strong, the Ever Victorious Army is creating a corps of trained Chinese officers with a record of success and with experience in thinking "outside the box" - the artillery charge itself is not the brainchild of Ward but of one of his Chinese battalion officers.
14 November
Christian IX of Denmark (the Glücksburg heir, now crowned but without having had a full coronation as yet) is presented with the draft of the November Constitution.
Placed in a difficult position, he feels he has no choice but to sign.
Also on this date, one of the outlying bastions of the Warsaw citadel is assaulted by 5,000 Polish troops spearheaded by two regiments of Grenadierzy. The broken and damaged walls form a substantial scaling obstacle, but one which the defenders also cannot make use of for the normal means of defence, and the bastion is in Polish hands by the evening. (This is greatly helped by the fire of the Krupp rifle Wladislaw destroying the casemates that would be used to direct artillery fire from the main fortress).
Huszaria riflemen move into the bastion over the evening, and begin sniping at any Russian soldiers visible on the near fort face.
16 November
After over a week of soul-searching, Ortega writes a long letter and sends it to Maximilien.
Touched by the sincerity and clear pain in the words, Maximilien agrees to the suggestions and terms of the missive on his own (theoretically absolute) authority.
Holstein formally rejects the November Constitution.
17 November
Frederick III of Prussia formally requests assurances from the King of Denmark (Christian IX) that he does not plan to violate the London Protocol, specifically that section which requests that there be no closer constitutional affiliation between Denmark and Schleswig than between Denmark and Holstein.
As it happens, both men are aware that this is essentially a done deal - the London Protocol has already been violated, and it was probably always going to be violated given the situation of the time. As such, Frederick III also sends messages to his mother-in-law and her parliament (requesting that this be considered a German-Danish affair, a matter for the German Confederation and the Danish Crown, at least in terms of ensuring compliance to the London Protocol), to the Prussian Reichstag (requesting approval for possible military action) and to the German Confederation (also requesting approval for possible military action).
Frederick III feels strongly about the issues as they affect Holstein, but he also wishes this to be done properly.
Ortega takes the amnesty offered by Maximilien, swearing allegiance to the new Mexican Emperor. His oath is conditional, however, and predicated on the establishment within two years of a consultative assembly drawn by election from "as much of Mexico as is practical"; Maximilien also gives assurances that this will be carried out.
The price of a parliament allows Ortega to feel that he has done as much as is realistic to secure the continuation of the values of the Mexican Republic now that the form appears crippled, and Maximilien is taken with the idea on a personal level (as - as far as he is concerned - he has nothing to fear from the will of the Mexican people, who he loves and who did after all choose him by plebiscite).
Napoleon III will be a little less happy when he learns of this, but consider that "Mexico is worth a mass election".
18 November
The reaction to Ortega's announcement is immediate, mixed, and confusing.
As the man who should (if not captured) be leading the Republic, some people take this as an outright and legitimate surrender. Others treat it as a shocking betrayal and vow to fight on, while still others considered Ortega a 'pretender' anyway and are not much moved. The practical upshot to this is an erosion in Republican morale, in both military and civil terms.
One of the most important factors is that it reduces tensions in areas already controlled by Imperialists. Even the people who dislike Maximilien agree that he has been forthright in his dealings with the Mexican people (his ban on child labour being one example) and as such there is a fair amount of faith that the promised parliament will materialize in the fullness of time.
Death of Frederick VII of Denmark, around one week before the planned signing into law of the (as yet not quite finalized) November Constitution.
Causing particular problems is that the Holstein parliament has signalled that it is not willing to accept the current form of the constitution - creating a particular problem as the Union Constitution that had previously controlled the whole Danish Union has been in abeyance for five years after an act of the German Confederation, and Holstein as such technically does not have a constitution at this point.
13 November
The Ever Victorious Army under Ward achieves another remarkable victory in the service of the Qing dynasty, making heavy use of the Napoleonic "artillery charge" supported by light infantry sharpshooters to defeat the enemy main body - an odd reversal of the normal means of fighting with infantry supported by artillery.
By now close to 7,500 strong, the Ever Victorious Army is creating a corps of trained Chinese officers with a record of success and with experience in thinking "outside the box" - the artillery charge itself is not the brainchild of Ward but of one of his Chinese battalion officers.
14 November
Christian IX of Denmark (the Glücksburg heir, now crowned but without having had a full coronation as yet) is presented with the draft of the November Constitution.
Placed in a difficult position, he feels he has no choice but to sign.
Also on this date, one of the outlying bastions of the Warsaw citadel is assaulted by 5,000 Polish troops spearheaded by two regiments of Grenadierzy. The broken and damaged walls form a substantial scaling obstacle, but one which the defenders also cannot make use of for the normal means of defence, and the bastion is in Polish hands by the evening. (This is greatly helped by the fire of the Krupp rifle Wladislaw destroying the casemates that would be used to direct artillery fire from the main fortress).
Huszaria riflemen move into the bastion over the evening, and begin sniping at any Russian soldiers visible on the near fort face.
16 November
After over a week of soul-searching, Ortega writes a long letter and sends it to Maximilien.
Touched by the sincerity and clear pain in the words, Maximilien agrees to the suggestions and terms of the missive on his own (theoretically absolute) authority.
Holstein formally rejects the November Constitution.
17 November
Frederick III of Prussia formally requests assurances from the King of Denmark (Christian IX) that he does not plan to violate the London Protocol, specifically that section which requests that there be no closer constitutional affiliation between Denmark and Schleswig than between Denmark and Holstein.
As it happens, both men are aware that this is essentially a done deal - the London Protocol has already been violated, and it was probably always going to be violated given the situation of the time. As such, Frederick III also sends messages to his mother-in-law and her parliament (requesting that this be considered a German-Danish affair, a matter for the German Confederation and the Danish Crown, at least in terms of ensuring compliance to the London Protocol), to the Prussian Reichstag (requesting approval for possible military action) and to the German Confederation (also requesting approval for possible military action).
Frederick III feels strongly about the issues as they affect Holstein, but he also wishes this to be done properly.
Ortega takes the amnesty offered by Maximilien, swearing allegiance to the new Mexican Emperor. His oath is conditional, however, and predicated on the establishment within two years of a consultative assembly drawn by election from "as much of Mexico as is practical"; Maximilien also gives assurances that this will be carried out.
The price of a parliament allows Ortega to feel that he has done as much as is realistic to secure the continuation of the values of the Mexican Republic now that the form appears crippled, and Maximilien is taken with the idea on a personal level (as - as far as he is concerned - he has nothing to fear from the will of the Mexican people, who he loves and who did after all choose him by plebiscite).
Napoleon III will be a little less happy when he learns of this, but consider that "Mexico is worth a mass election".
18 November
The reaction to Ortega's announcement is immediate, mixed, and confusing.
As the man who should (if not captured) be leading the Republic, some people take this as an outright and legitimate surrender. Others treat it as a shocking betrayal and vow to fight on, while still others considered Ortega a 'pretender' anyway and are not much moved. The practical upshot to this is an erosion in Republican morale, in both military and civil terms.
One of the most important factors is that it reduces tensions in areas already controlled by Imperialists. Even the people who dislike Maximilien agree that he has been forthright in his dealings with the Mexican people (his ban on child labour being one example) and as such there is a fair amount of faith that the promised parliament will materialize in the fullness of time.
Saphroneth
Banned
Plans.
My planned resolution to Schleswig-Holstein is essentially to split the two. Holstein becomes part of the German Confederation under Duke Frederick VIII, and Schleswig (with the London Protocol no longer in force) remains part of the Danish Union.
This of course means fight'n will take place, and be the first outing of the New Prussian Army. (Less good than OTL man-for-man, but a lot better than anyone was expecting!)
I'm toying with open Austrian support for Russia in trying to put down the Polish uprising, though frankly by this point they've left it too late.
The Chinese reforms are going far better than OTL simply because the E-V Army is not being slowly reduced by attrition and lack of recruitment. That's also likely to continue.
The American rifle is another tricky one. I'm considering the idea that (driven by their legal requirement to be as modern as possible) they might adopt a cartridge design where the trigger being pulled all the way back ejects the expended cartridge (not sure what the OTL equivalent of that was), and that this will prove to be somewhat unreliable in usage if mass production is needed but will work quite well for their standing army of ~80k once enough are manufactured. (That's a lot larger of a standing army than OTL, indeed larger than the Confederate army sans militia). State militia may be expected to procure their own rifles, and some will make do with muzzle loaders.
This of course means fight'n will take place, and be the first outing of the New Prussian Army. (Less good than OTL man-for-man, but a lot better than anyone was expecting!)
I'm toying with open Austrian support for Russia in trying to put down the Polish uprising, though frankly by this point they've left it too late.
The Chinese reforms are going far better than OTL simply because the E-V Army is not being slowly reduced by attrition and lack of recruitment. That's also likely to continue.
The American rifle is another tricky one. I'm considering the idea that (driven by their legal requirement to be as modern as possible) they might adopt a cartridge design where the trigger being pulled all the way back ejects the expended cartridge (not sure what the OTL equivalent of that was), and that this will prove to be somewhat unreliable in usage if mass production is needed but will work quite well for their standing army of ~80k once enough are manufactured. (That's a lot larger of a standing army than OTL, indeed larger than the Confederate army sans militia). State militia may be expected to procure their own rifles, and some will make do with muzzle loaders.
Saphroneth
Banned
He was in Paris when he said it, too.
The reference is deliberate, though I'm not sure if the pun works in French - he did know English, though, so may have said it in that language to make the joke work.
I guess some addition to a lever-action might do it, but it'll have a few more parts to go wrong - which would indeed lead to problems if mass-production involved lower quality control standards (as it often did).
Saphroneth
Banned
That's a long way off, this is actually before anyone but the Prussians (of the great powers) had adopted a breech-loader as their primary OTL. Indeed, it's only about now OTL that the Army of the Potomac finally managed to ensure it was all-rifle - they were carrying about 10% smoothbores at Gettysburg.
AFAICT production quality is what killed the Maynard Tape.
Not that the Prussian one is that great. IIRC its sealing is so bad you have to fire it from the hip.
Saphroneth
Banned
Yes, the sealing is pretty bad - though I understand a fair part of the reforms of this period OTL may have either been to abrogate that or just to condition troops to not care, as the principal effect was to make the Prussian regulars excellent shots (they regularly trained with, and hit, targets between 200-400 m away with the range not made clear to the shooter except through his own ability to estimate it). TTL with the emphasis on the landwehr instead of the regulars that will be amplified - the majority of the mobilized Prussian army will be good shots and not particularly well drilled, there's simply no time for full square-bashing and so the militia formations will be punchy but not very steady or tactically adept, while the regulars themselves will essentially be as good as OTL.
The interesting about this is that it leads to a natural tendency to use the militia components as the "firebase" and the regular components as the "manoeuvre element".
Saphroneth
Banned
Not a formal TL post, but I just found a reference to another British smoothbore AP gun - the guns fitted to Royal Sovereign (second RN turret ship). She had an armament of five 12-ton 10.5" 150 pounder smoothbores.
http://hansard.millbanksystems.com/commons/1864/may/20/navy-the-guns-of-the-royal-sovereign
The performance of these weapons is hard to find, but if the powder charge scaled with the weight of the shot compared to the 100-lber Somerset gun it'd be something like 48 lbs powder - which is enormous - and would quite possibly go through contemporary US ships the long way. What it certainly seems like is that the RN identified a problem with the future development and use of their current weapons in 1860 or so (the poor armour penetration of the Armstrong gun) and by 1864 they had all sorts of remedies - the Somerset gun, the Armstrong RML guns, the Palliser shell - before the actual armour performance of their stopgap 68-lber 95 cwt had become obsolete.
http://hansard.millbanksystems.com/commons/1864/may/20/navy-the-guns-of-the-royal-sovereign
The performance of these weapons is hard to find, but if the powder charge scaled with the weight of the shot compared to the 100-lber Somerset gun it'd be something like 48 lbs powder - which is enormous - and would quite possibly go through contemporary US ships the long way. What it certainly seems like is that the RN identified a problem with the future development and use of their current weapons in 1860 or so (the poor armour penetration of the Armstrong gun) and by 1864 they had all sorts of remedies - the Somerset gun, the Armstrong RML guns, the Palliser shell - before the actual armour performance of their stopgap 68-lber 95 cwt had become obsolete.
Saphroneth
Banned
Not much has changed, map wise - well, there's Poland, but that's about the only change of map outside America compared to OTL at this time.
I might put one together after the Danish Thing is sorted out.
19-23 November 1863
Saphroneth
Banned
19 November
PGT Beauregard and his staff produce "Plan 64".
The first of the yearly numbered plans produced by the Confederate States war department, and later retroactively labelled "Plan 64-Blue" when the colour system comes in, this plan outlines how the Confederate armed forces should proceed if a war with the US was to develop in 1864 along with changes to be made to make this plan work better or fix vulnerabilities.
It divides the confrontation line into five sectors - "Pacific","Mississippi","Ohio River","Coast" and "Atlantic". The level of development of these plans varies - for example, the "Pacific" section describes in detail how a single powerful armoured unit should be pre-positioned at San Diego in order to cut off gold shipments to the Union, while the "Mississippi" section covering land warfare largely consists of the instruction "Leave it to the Indians".
Also of note is the plan to cut the neck of the Delmarva peninsula and occupy it, which (coupled with an attack on New York by heavy vessels) would replicate the Royal Naval blockade of the late war to an extent, by closing all major rivers of the Union. (Such is the plan, anyway - the 'heavy vessels' described are not available given what the plan requires elsewhere).
As of now there is only a plan for dealing with the Union, as this is considered the most likely enemy to need a plan; the Mexicans are seen by Beauregard as a relative pushover and both Britain and France unstoppable naval juggernauts, so the unspoken assumption is that the plan for dealing with a British declaration of war is to promptly apologize and give them what they want!
22 November
A preliminary mobilization order goes out in Prussia, standing up four divisions of the army to form III. Corps. As per previous planning, the regular brigades will incorporate three brigades of landwehr (those currently training with them and the two cohorts who had their refresher course most recently) to form their divisions - though the organizational structure of the divisions varies, specifically in what level the regular infantry brigades are broken down to before being mixed with the landwehr. In one case this is at brigade level - i.e. no breakup - while in the other extreme companies have a mix of regular and landwehr platoons.
(The general view in the Prussian military is that this campaign will not be especially taxing, but that there may be important lessons learned.)
23 November
Ushidoshi Maru and her tow stop off at the Cape for resupply and recoaling.
While there, several of the locals come aboard - interested in looking at a Zodiac, even if it is not one which fought the Union or the Confederacy.
PGT Beauregard and his staff produce "Plan 64".
The first of the yearly numbered plans produced by the Confederate States war department, and later retroactively labelled "Plan 64-Blue" when the colour system comes in, this plan outlines how the Confederate armed forces should proceed if a war with the US was to develop in 1864 along with changes to be made to make this plan work better or fix vulnerabilities.
It divides the confrontation line into five sectors - "Pacific","Mississippi","Ohio River","Coast" and "Atlantic". The level of development of these plans varies - for example, the "Pacific" section describes in detail how a single powerful armoured unit should be pre-positioned at San Diego in order to cut off gold shipments to the Union, while the "Mississippi" section covering land warfare largely consists of the instruction "Leave it to the Indians".
Also of note is the plan to cut the neck of the Delmarva peninsula and occupy it, which (coupled with an attack on New York by heavy vessels) would replicate the Royal Naval blockade of the late war to an extent, by closing all major rivers of the Union. (Such is the plan, anyway - the 'heavy vessels' described are not available given what the plan requires elsewhere).
As of now there is only a plan for dealing with the Union, as this is considered the most likely enemy to need a plan; the Mexicans are seen by Beauregard as a relative pushover and both Britain and France unstoppable naval juggernauts, so the unspoken assumption is that the plan for dealing with a British declaration of war is to promptly apologize and give them what they want!
22 November
A preliminary mobilization order goes out in Prussia, standing up four divisions of the army to form III. Corps. As per previous planning, the regular brigades will incorporate three brigades of landwehr (those currently training with them and the two cohorts who had their refresher course most recently) to form their divisions - though the organizational structure of the divisions varies, specifically in what level the regular infantry brigades are broken down to before being mixed with the landwehr. In one case this is at brigade level - i.e. no breakup - while in the other extreme companies have a mix of regular and landwehr platoons.
(The general view in the Prussian military is that this campaign will not be especially taxing, but that there may be important lessons learned.)
23 November
Ushidoshi Maru and her tow stop off at the Cape for resupply and recoaling.
While there, several of the locals come aboard - interested in looking at a Zodiac, even if it is not one which fought the Union or the Confederacy.
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1st Corps had its headquarters at Konigsburg in East Prussia, its nearest "Supports" were in West Prussia and Posen in the major fortresses of Graudenz and Thorun (from memory) it was a very strong Corps and contained some of Prussias elite infantry and Cavalry units. Even the Landwehr were well drilled.
Are we to see an incursion across the River Niemen into the Russian Lithuanian states?
Denmark would see 2nd Corps from Pomerania backed by Third Corps and the Guards in Brandenburg
Are we to see an incursion across the River Niemen into the Russian Lithuanian states?
Denmark would see 2nd Corps from Pomerania backed by Third Corps and the Guards in Brandenburg
Saphroneth
Banned
Any idea how long that had been the case? And if more than a few years, which corps is most apt to the Danish war?