If They Want It Then They Can Have It.

nezza

Andrew Marr 2007

"Wilson thought that by evacuating all mainland Britons from the province and asking the UN to help he could 'reset' the province. In terms of historical faux pas this is one of the greatest or worst depending on your viewpoint.

It wasn't a case of 'starting again'. It was a case of the UK admitting 'this is something we need to deal with' "
 

Dathi THorfinnsson

To be fair, NI was a serious CF, and there was no military or imposable political solution.
It really wasn't until a grassroots peace movement arose and gained traction that there was any viable way forward.
It HAD to have been tempting for Westminster to pull out, an FORCE the locals come come up with a solution.
Disastrous, but tempting.
 

nezza

Dathi THorfinnsson said:
To be fair, NI was a serious CF, and there was no military or imposable political solution.
It really wasn't until a grassroots peace movement arose and gained traction that there was any viable way forward.
It HAD to have been tempting for Westminster to pull out, an FORCE the locals come come up with a solution.
Disastrous, but tempting.
Click to expand...

According to Tony Benn's diaries after the executive collapsed the Labour Cabinet discussed in secret plans for a total withdrawal. According to this documentary the end of the power sharing experiment was actually preferred:

 

nezza

Mr Wilson is a coward, he is a hypocrite. He abandons the people of Ulster to the fenian scum of the Republic and then he and the devil's spawn Cosgrave demand we talk?
NEVER, NEVER, NEVER!!!!

Ian Paisley 7th August 1974
 

nezza

8th August 1974

"We the Irish Republican Army do hereby give notice that the City of Newry is now under our jurisdiction. Our ASU's have closed all roads from the North of the city and have placed the people of Newry under our control. We do this in the name of the people of Newry who have suffered the victimisation and inhumanity of the Loyalists and their British allies. We ask the people of the Irish Republic to assist us in our crusade to reunite our land"
 

nezza

Tony Benn's Diary 9th August 1974

"Ulster is in chaos. Cosgrave has declined the IRA's 'request' for help. I have written to the Speaker, Selwyn Lloyd asking him to recall parliament so we can have an emergency debate. This has to dealt with by the Commons and not by a bunch of thugs"

 

nezza

Andrew Marr 2007

"The Battle Of Newry. A noble attempt to protect the Irish people or a European Tet Offensive? It's up to individuals to decide on that but the facts are clear.

At 6 am on the 11th of August approximately 300 heavily armed loyalists entered the city and engaged in a bloody pitched battle with the IRA. Both in turn with attacked by Danish peacekeepers. Bystanders said that it was it "was as if hell itself had risen"

Much has been made of the bloodshed and chaos but what isn't spoke about is the sheer courage and humanity of both the residents and peacekeepers who along with the Irish government on their side of the border saved over 500 people. An action which later led to the first Nobel peace price to be awarded to both Ireland and Denmark

By the time that the UN had restored calm 117 people were dead, over 1000 injured and millions of pounds of damaged had been caused.

Many regarded this as the last straw.

 

nezza

Tony Benn's Diary 12th August 1974

"A quite incredible day. There have been demonstrations in both Belfast and Dublin. Protestant and Catholic, Loyalists and Nationalists saying 'enough is enough'. From what Gerry Fitt told me before the emergency debate in the Commons began UU were backing off in the face of the uprising.

Wilson spoke quietly and firmly. His face was pale and his mood was solemn. He admitted that the pullout before the UN went in was a huge mistake and he expressed sorrow for those who had died and had been hurt.

He maintained the offer of talks was still open.

I looked up at the gallery and saw Cosgrave. I was astounded.

Heath spoke in response. He defended the executive but also admitted that the focus on the Council of Ireland was wrong for the time.

Today has been one of those days where a massing of forces, the people of Ireland, North and South have asserted their humanity and said to those who seek to control and threaten would not succeed"
 

nezza

BBC News 13th August 1974

"Good Evening. In an historic day in Northern Ireland both the British and Irish Prime Ministers have visited the province. Mr Wilson and Mr Cosgrave first visited Newry to see the damage of the battle 2 days ago and to thank the Danish peacekeepers...
 

nezza

"What has happened has shamed the United Kingdom. The decision to leave was a fundamental mistake based on pure emotion. As Prime Minister I take full responsibility for that decision and for that I am truly sorry

What must now happen is that we, British and Irish, Loyalist and Republican, Unionist and Nationalist must leave the hatred and religious persecution behind and treat each other as human beings. Nothing else will suffice.

Harold Wilson outside Belfast City Hall 13th August 1974
 
FriendlyGhost

FriendlyGhost

Just found this and am very impressed; I particularly like the style you've chosen to write the TL - little vignettes which manage to tell the story very well without being too long. Thank you.
 

nezza

Andrew Marr 2007

"The age-old problem of identity was never going to go away. Wilson and Cosgrave knew that and it was that identity as well as the religious and cultural attitudes that had to be dealt with. Wilson restated that Northern Ireland was not going to be re-integrated into the Republic unless the majority wished it and after the events of that bloody summer that possibility was near impossible.

Likewise Cosgrave realised that to 'have Ulster back' in its current state was out of the question.

Both sides knew that the divided people would fight to the death to keep they loyalties. What was need was some kind of 'halfway house' where the loyalists would feel British and the nationalists would feel Irish and yet at the same time have a shared identity...."
 

nezza

United_Saint_Patrick's_flag_for_Northern_Ireland.svg.png
 

nezza

Hmm, yes under the circumstances it would be appropriate to choose something more balanced although it isn't a unification flag:

EzlyIxr.png
 

Gladsome

Wolf of Badenoch said:
Sorry, the crown is anathema to the Nationalist community - personally I'd drop the Red hand and crown and lead it with the stripes
Click to expand...
It is supposed to be a compromise flag, no? I imagine the republican colours are equally unsatisfactory to unionists.

And under the arrangement that seems to be coming closer to establishment thus far ITTL, Northern Ireland is still a part of the United Kingdom.
 
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