If the US had annexed Cuba in the Spanish-American war would it have been a state by now?

There is white and there is white. To most of the USA, especially the south, the vast majority of the "white" Cubans would not qualify as such in the USA.
 
There is white and there is white. To most of the USA, especially the south, the vast majority of the "white" Cubans would not qualify as such in the USA.

Did Americans of the 1950's protest seeing Desi Arnez in a relationship with Lucille Ball? No, is the obvious answer.

I am far from the expert on this but I believe Cuban society kept the castas a little more rigid than other latin american countries. There was not a huge mestizo group like in mexico at least. There were blacks and mulattoes but they were kept separate from the white elite. I believe Cuba was actually closer to the US in segregation than other Latin American countries.

Also Cuba staying in the Spanish Empire much longer received migration directly from Spain right until the end of the 19th century.
 
There is white and there is white. To most of the USA, especially the south, the vast majority of the "white" Cubans would not qualify as such in the USA.

People used to say that about Italians and Jews. Racial definitions have changed over time in America. Once the white majority needs to expand to feel secure, it incorporates more people.
 
The issue is not would the "Cubans" be considered "white" in 2018, but in 1898 would they have been considered "white". As noted, one of the reasons the USA was not interested in annexing Cuba (not the only reason), was that the USA did not want not acquire a large population of folks who were not a "fit" (Catholic, Spanish speaking, and off-white to black). Even immigrants straight from Spain would be considered marginal, catholic "dusky" Latins like the Italians. IMHO had Cuba been annexed, it would have eventually become a state and the political folks in the USA at the time of the Spanish-American War realized that, and did not want that.

Until Castro took over Cuba, the American influence in Cuba was adequate to keep Cuba toeing the American line without having the sort of influence it would have as a US state.
 
IF (big IF) Cuba were to become part of the USA than, with a possibility of it becoming permanent, I could see some form of official language act being passed, making English the official language of the USA. That would be intended to "preserve American culture," and "Prevent business from having to carry the burden of dealing with the complications of multiple languages," and "To aid out newest citizens in integrating into the USA."
 

Lusitania

Donor
IF (big IF) Cuba were to become part of the USA than, with a possibility of it becoming permanent, I could see some form of official language act being passed, making English the official language of the USA. That would be intended to "preserve American culture," and "Prevent business from having to carry the burden of dealing with the complications of multiple languages," and "To aid out newest citizens in integrating into the USA."

Yes take for example Louisiana, when it became a statecsith large French population there was no official language and documents were in either or both. Legislators could speak in either. Then when the English speaking population grew sufficiently they changed the constitution and put in it that all documents and government business be conducted in the language the American constitution was written. So today Louisiana has the distinction of being only state that has an official language.
 
It would have become a State after 1910.If Cuba hadn't become a stay by 1932s FDR would have support it and becoming a state just for the extra tax revenue.
Originally it would be ruled by a white minority, but eventually minorities would get the vote
 
It would have become a State after 1910.If Cuba hadn't become a stay by 1932s FDR would have support it and becoming a state just for the extra tax revenue.
Originally it would be ruled by a white minority, but eventually minorities would get the vote



If Cuba hasen't issued a petition for an enabling act to Congress by the 1930's, that's a pretty clear sign they have no desire to ascend to Statehood. If there's a clear-cut desire on the part of Cubans to become a state, on the other hand, I don't see how politically Congress is going to be keep it delayed overly long; its just hard to find a justifable legal arguement to reject it. Puerto Rico has more than enough ambiguity in the desires of the population and the fact that its not financially self-sufficent to allow the question to continue; Cuba was far more populous, economically vibrant, infrastructural developed ect. and would be increasingly akward to ignore if they were vocally requesting the right to at least draft a Constitution.

IF (big IF) Cuba were to become part of the USA than, with a possibility of it becoming permanent, I could see some form of official language act being passed, making English the official language of the USA. That would be intended to "preserve American culture," and "Prevent business from having to carry the burden of dealing with the complications of multiple languages," and "To aid out newest citizens in integrating into the USA."

... now, once that draft takes place they can, like the debate over the Mormons, drag out Statehood discussions based on specifics like this. Then we have to figure out just what terms Congress is going to insist on Cuba accepting in exchange for statehood (At the very least, a gurantee of education taking place in English is probably going to be insisted upon if nothing else). Having a broader assimilationist movement taking place with, for example, the AmerIndian boarding schools and influx of Eastern European immigrants to urban areas just when you have the rise of the mass public schooling, could easily combined with Progressive ideology to bring the "Using Schools to make Citizens" philosphy to its logical conclusion by placing earlier Federal requirements on states for language, civics education, ect. to make 2nd Generations at least Americans in thought and tounge.
 

Lusitania

Donor
If Cuba hasen't issued a petition for an enabling act to Congress by the 1930's, that's a pretty clear sign they have no desire to ascend to Statehood. If there's a clear-cut desire on the part of Cubans to become a state, on the other hand, I don't see how politically Congress is going to be keep it delayed overly long; its just hard to find a justifable legal arguement to reject it. Puerto Rico has more than enough ambiguity in the desires of the population and the fact that its not financially self-sufficent to allow the question to continue; Cuba was far more populous, economically vibrant, infrastructural developed ect. and would be increasingly akward to ignore if they were vocally requesting the right to at least draft a Constitution.



... now, once that draft takes place they can, like the debate over the Mormons, drag out Statehood discussions based on specifics like this. Then we have to figure out just what terms Congress is going to insist on Cuba accepting in exchange for statehood (At the very least, a gurantee of education taking place in English is probably going to be insisted upon if nothing else). Having a broader assimilationist movement taking place with, for example, the AmerIndian boarding schools and influx of Eastern European immigrants to urban areas just when you have the rise of the mass public schooling, could easily combined with Progressive ideology to bring the "Using Schools to make Citizens" philosphy to its logical conclusion by placing earlier Federal requirements on states for language, civics education, ect. to make 2nd Generations at least Americans in thought and tounge.
I understand your arguments but find them hard to understand. When Louisiana was admitted as US state half the people were French and French Language schools were normal. Since the US did not have an official language act, how could it ask or demand that Cuba only educate its people in English? We need a much more radical US for that to happen. While Utah admission was held up due to polygamy that was a different matter being that marriage per non-Mormon bible was between 1 man and 1 woman. I do not see where in the US constitution or bible its says you have to speak English and only educate your kids in English to be American. Heck prior to WW1 tens of thousands of kids in the Midwest were being educated in German still. So maybe a radical US that wanted to stop Cuba from being a US state would pass some sort of Amendmant stating all education needed to be in English (with only English fluent speaking students allowed to learn another language in school. At same time there be a whole bunch of added "American" and anti-immigrant language in that amendment.
 
I understand your arguments but find them hard to understand. When Louisiana was admitted as US state half the people were French and French Language schools were normal. Since the US did not have an official language act, how could it ask or demand that Cuba only educate its people in English? We need a much more radical US for that to happen. While Utah admission was held up due to polygamy that was a different matter being that marriage per non-Mormon bible was between 1 man and 1 woman. I do not see where in the US constitution or bible its says you have to speak English and only educate your kids in English to be American. Heck prior to WW1 tens of thousands of kids in the Midwest were being educated in German still. So maybe a radical US that wanted to stop Cuba from being a US state would pass some sort of Amendmant stating all education needed to be in English (with only English fluent speaking students allowed to learn another language in school. At same time there be a whole bunch of added "American" and anti-immigrant language in that amendment.

I've got to get better at framing my positions... I keep burying the lead in the late-end of things.

The move to push for pure English education (rather than, I suppose, the more likely option that all localities have to provide courses in English so the children learn it and can interact with the rest of American society, even if the main education is in Spainish and it remains the primary language of the state). The key difference here is that the addmission of Cuba as a state in the 1900-1910s would be taking place during the Progressive Era, and the "Gospel of Progressivism" does provide the broader cultural zeitgeist towards greater systematization/standardization of education, unification/integration of society, ect that could (if the Cuban debate is added to the fire, especially if we're also looking at it in the context of the anti-German backlash of the Great War) towards a big assimilationist push. Granted, that's only one possability, but one adding a Cuban Statehood/ can we accept state that's more or less permantly established as Non-WASP factor to American society makes more likely that IOTL rather than less since it puts real political power on the line.
 

Lusitania

Donor
I've got to get better at framing my positions... I keep burying the lead in the late-end of things.

The move to push for pure English education (rather than, I suppose, the more likely option that all localities have to provide courses in English so the children learn it and can interact with the rest of American society, even if the main education is in Spainish and it remains the primary language of the state). The key difference here is that the addmission of Cuba as a state in the 1900-1910s would be taking place during the Progressive Era, and the "Gospel of Progressivism" does provide the broader cultural zeitgeist towards greater systematization/standardization of education, unification/integration of society, ect that could (if the Cuban debate is added to the fire, especially if we're also looking at it in the context of the anti-German backlash of the Great War) towards a big assimilationist push. Granted, that's only one possability, but one adding a Cuban Statehood/ can we accept state that's more or less permantly established as Non-WASP factor to American society makes more likely that IOTL rather than less since it puts real political power on the line.
But no other state at that time had that requirement and as I mentioned before WW1 tens of thousands of kids primary education and language was German in the Midwest. If congress were to pass that law then some liberal would of fought in court. If US had annexed Cuba it would already be part of the US and its people regardless of their language be US citizens.
 
But no other state at that time had that requirement and as I mentioned before WW1 tens of thousands of kids primary education and language was German in the Midwest. If congress were to pass that law then some liberal would of fought in court. If US had annexed Cuba it would already be part of the US and its people regardless of their language be US citizens.

I realize that: hence the use of the word "could" to reflect that it's a POSSIBLE cultural shift that results from a reaction/pushback from the increasing desire to remove the "otherness" in American society as a broader result of the American Progressive movement adopting that plank. In an environment that things like Prohabition diden't pass in the heady days of those major societal reforms, we'd say that it and many of the other big 1900's reforms were unlikely. Hell, without the S-A War gains we'd probably thought it was next to impossible the Continental-focused US would every seriously pursue an overseas Empire policy.
 
If Cuba has all official documents, proceedings of the legislature etc in English and Spanish, this will work. Adequate skill in English will be a key for advancement, as advanced education (graduate studies and some professional studies) will only be available on the mainland and that means in English. Working for a company that has interests off the island will also require this ability. Of course mainlanders who work in Cuba will need some capability in Spanish to do well.
 

Lusitania

Donor
If Cuba has all official documents, proceedings of the legislature etc in English and Spanish, this will work. Adequate skill in English will be a key for advancement, as advanced education (graduate studies and some professional studies) will only be available on the mainland and that means in English. Working for a company that has interests off the island will also require this ability. Of course mainlanders who work in Cuba will need some capability in Spanish to do well.
Basically the current system in Puerto Rico. As long as state is bilingual and provides service in both languages would hopefully satisfy all parties.
 
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