If Pearl Harbor was not just bombed...........

invasion of hawaii

I'm pretty sure that the sole purpose of attacking Pearl Harbor was to destroy the American fleet so they could have their way all over the Pacific. They did not have any intention of invading Hawaii that early in the game. I still have to wonder what would have happened if the radar and early warning system had been working like they should have been and we were prepared, what would have happened. Or if the officer who assumed that the japanese planes on the radar were the flight of USAAF B-17s that were supposed to be flying in would have got on the radio and tried to contact the B-17s, what would have happened? I think if that guy was still alive Bill Engvall would give him his sign.
 

Markus

Banned
Lastly, while Marcus has already provided the U.S. Army TOE it also needs to be pointed out that there were two complete Marine Defense Battalions (3rd and 4th) as well as part of the 1st (which was scheduled to be moved to Wake, but never got the chance) in place or (in the case of the rump 1st) available for deployment. ...

Speaking of which, there might be a lot more. Marines were also detached on ships: 100 an a BB, 80 on a CA and 45 on a CL. Present at PH were:

8 BB, minus 2 makes 600 Marines
2 CA and 6 CL makes: 430 Marines

If each of the ships had a USMC detachment, 600 to 1,000 trained infantrymen can be added to the US OOB. IIRC one of the Army´s infantry regiments was stationed on another island but as one can see there was a regiment of combat engineers, the Marines could form another, bringing the total to seven. And they all have copious amounts of artillery, not counting independant units like my personal favourite: the 41st Harbour Defence regiment(8" railroad guns).
 
The entire Japanese plan was astonishingly successful in the first months and completely worthless as the sole plan for dealing with the inevitable response by the US was apparently that Japan would somehow win every battle and with acceptable losses until the US got tired and called for peace.

Only months into the war the defeat at Midway and then the extended effort at Guadalcanal showed the Japanese had literally no idea how to turn things around or even force a stalemate. Reading about the efforts Japanese Army commanders had to go to to convince the IJN that it would be a great help if the Americans weren't the only ones with artillery and perhaps even armor is just painful.
 
Speaking of which, there might be a lot more. Marines were also detached on ships: 100 an a BB, 80 on a CA and 45 on a CL. Present at PH were:

8 BB, minus 2 makes 600 Marines
2 CA and 6 CL makes: 430 Marines

If each of the ships had a USMC detachment, 600 to 1,000 trained infantrymen can be added to the US OOB. IIRC one of the Army´s infantry regiments was stationed on another island but as one can see there was a regiment of combat engineers, the Marines could form another, bringing the total to seven. And they all have copious amounts of artillery, not counting independant units like my personal favourite: the 41st Harbour Defence regiment(8" railroad guns).

I'm not sure about the USN, but in the RN the Gunnery branch are also trained for backup assault duties - thats another couple of batallions, probably...
 

CalBear

Moderator
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Monthly Donor
I'm not sure about the USN, but in the RN the Gunnery branch are also trained for backup assault duties - thats another couple of batallions, probably...

One of the interesting things is that several of the "sunken" ships were actually still able to conduct some operations despite their overall condition.

Specifically:

California: Main batteries undamaged, secondary 5" batteries undamaged. Ship engineering plant disabled due to fuel contamination. Dependent on power from dockside. 8 degree port list and ship in low in the water.

Maryland: One 5" mount disabled due to shell splinter damage to rammer mechanism. Barrel of one .50 cal machine gun burned out.

Nevada: Main Battery undamaged. Damage to several 5" mounts due to shell splinters. Starboard AAA batteries disabled due to loss of air for rammers. Boilers intact but likely salted up due to use of seawater after contamination of fresh water feeds.

Tennessee: Turret III disabled due to bomb hit that penetrated turret roof but did not explode. Center Gun on Turret II disabled by different bomb hit. (Note: This left Tennessee with two completely undamaged turrets with a total of six 14" guns and two other guns in Turret II. I have not found any definitive information regarding the readiness of the undamaged tubes in this turret). Boilers undamaged but unable to sail due to being wedged into quayside by West Virginia.

West Virginia: All main batteries undamaged. Considerable splinter and fire damage to upper works with some damage to AAA batteries. Ship low in the water but being pumped out, four boilers in aft fireroom undamaged, in full operation, and providing light and power to ship.

Using the After Action reports it is clear that four, perhaps five (depending on how one counts California), of the BBs in Pearl Harbor were capable of being used as de facto shore batteries. Ammunition was available both in the undamaged/unflooded magazines aboard ship and in great quantities ashore.

As was noted earlier by another poster, 20 miles from an unfriendly BB, especially one that can not be sunk any further, is not a healthy place to be.

Regarding the possibility of shipboard naval personnel being used ashore, the gunnery departments would have been immediately useful in assisting on the other, undamaged ships and in assisting the shore batteries (the Marine shore battery anti-ship guns were all ex-secondary battery guns from decommissioned BB & cruisers). Many other departments had men with battle stations as loaders or as a-gunners for the .50 cal mounts. Many of the other personnel would be familiar with small arms, especially rifles, through civilian usage.
 
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