If Neville Chamberlain had not declared war on Hitler because of the Invasion of Poland,this could change something?
He'd be lynched in the streets and the next government would find an excuse to do so.If Neville Chamberlain had not declared war on Hitler because of the Invasion of Poland,this could change something?
He'd be lynched in the streets and the next government would find an excuse to do so.
I think that the British at the time does not care that much about Poland
The public was just unwilling to accept any more expansion of Germany without a fight, Chamberlain didn't want to fight, the public and his party did.I think that the British at the time does not care that much about Poland
If they cared about Poland they'd have done something to protect Poland. Was the BEF sent to Poland? Did Britain protest when the USSR invaded Poland? Did Britain demand as a condition of assistance or at Yalta that Poland be restored after the war? Did Britain shelter the Polish government in exile? No, no... Britain didn't give a fig for Poland beyond serving as a convenient line in the sand they'd hoped Hitler would have the sense not to cross. Now, imagine after Munich in 1938, Hitler's reaction had a combined British-French battlefleet arrived at Poland to with a hundred thousand or more troops, tanks, aircraft, etc. Of course the British and French would be insane to do so, since if the Germans (and Russians) do attack, there is no Dunkirk to run to. Which is exactly why Britain didn't help Poland, because it wasn't worth the risk.Yeah, that's why they issued an ultimatum and declared war on Germany when it was ignored. Because they didn't care about Poland.
Hey, they gotta ensure that they continue to have a fresh supply of Polish kielbasa!Yeah, that's why they issued an ultimatum and declared war on Germany when it was ignored. Because they didn't care about Poland.
Yeah, I also get the impression that Chamberlain was a reluctant warrior in 1939-1940 who only fought because diplomacy with Hitler ultimately failed in spite of his extremely massive efforts.The public was just unwilling to accept any more expansion of Germany without a fight, Chamberlain didn't want to fight, the public and his party did.
Even if Poland has already fallen to the Nazis by that point in time?He'd be lynched in the streets and the next government would find an excuse to do so.
According to Richard Overy's "Goering" Chamberlain was trying to negotiate via Goering to effectively give Germany backdoor control over Poland to avoid war (getting Poland to give up Danzig, which Germany could leverage to control the Polish economy), but Hitler was obsessed with just taking it and thought Chamberlain wouldn't do anything if he did so subterfuge wasn't necessary.Yeah, I also get the impression that Chamberlain was a reluctant warrior in 1939-1940 who only fought because diplomacy with Hitler ultimately failed in spite of his extremely massive efforts.
I think so.Even if Poland has already fallen to the Nazis by that point in time?
In the unlikely event that Chamberlain's political career survives this, Hitler will probably invade the Soviet Union in 1940 in this TL. In turn, this will be the final straw for Britain and France, who will proceed to impose a blockade on Nazi Germany as well as to declare war on it. With most German troops busy in the East, Hitler doesn't have enough troops to successfully implement the Manstein Plan; then, once the Soviet Union survives the initial Nazi punch/invasion, it joins forces with Britain and France (who have already entered this war by that point in time) to push Nazi Germany back. Eventually the noose on Nazi Germany tightens so much that it is either destroyed or is overthrown from within--with an unconditional surrender of Germany to Britain, France, and the Soviet Union to follow in any case.If Neville Chamberlain had not declared war on Hitler because of the Invasion of Poland,this could change something?
Wasn't Poland less dependent on Danzig in 1939 than it was back in 1921 due to the existence of Gdynia, though?According to Richard Overy's "Goering" Chamberlain was trying to negotiate via Goering to effectively give Germany backdoor control over Poland to avoid war (getting Poland to give up Danzig, which Germany could leverage to control the Polish economy), but Hitler was obsessed with just taking it and thought Chamberlain wouldn't do anything if he did so subterfuge wasn't necessary.
Yeah, I also get the impression that Chamberlain was a reluctant warrior in 1939-1940 who only fought because diplomacy with Hitler ultimately failed in spite of his extremely massive efforts.
Somewhat, but Danzig sat on the mouth of the Vistula, which led directly to the Polish capital and was their primary economic highway, Gdynia (sp?) was only able to replace part of Danzig and wouldn't have been able to handle the burden of the entire national export economy.Wasn't Poland less dependent on Danzig in 1939 than it was back in 1921 due to the existence of Gdynia, though?
Somewhat, but Danzig sat on the mouth of the Volga, which led directly to the Polish capital and was their primary economic highway,
Gdynia (sp?) was only able to replace part of Danzig and wouldn't have been able to handle the burden of the entire national export economy.
You got it.You mean Vistula; the Volga is in Russia.![]()
That was the plan in the deal, but you think the Nazis would honor that?OK; understood.
However, what about giving Danzig to Germany but giving Poland special economic rights there?
They aren't peaceniks, they are isolationists; they have no problem fighting over specific American interests, they just don't want to fight Facists in their backyard for issues that they consider not American. Also I frankly think they are Fascist-favorable and want them to fight the Communists so America can stand back and profit off of war trade.Well Pat Buchanan and the rest of idiot fringe peacenik America seem to think that he should have.
From what I gather the plan was to leverage Polish trade via Danzig to economically subordinate them or use the resulting unrest from the economic downturn to overthrow the Polish government or use the instability to puppetize them like Czechoslovakia.So what will likely happen is Hitler will have more demands and they will escalate until war actually does break out. He will demand Danzig, and then Upper Silesia, and then maybe after that, Riga and other areas of the Baltics that once had a lot of Germans (he already took Memel at this point), or maybe just split Poland with USSR anyways. War with the west was a distraction for his real objective.