Ideas found in Multiple Alternate Histories

Zoidberg12

Okay, inspired by this article on the Turtedove wiki, this thread is an attempt to collect the similarities between a number of works of AH. Timelines on this site, books, movies, video games etc etc. Any one can contribute of course.

I got one already to start this thread off.

Bonapartist Louisiana

In American King: Take Two by Napoleon53 and Rooster Cogburn, the Bonaparte Family emigrated from Corsica to an Independent Louisiana Republic in 1788. From their Napoleon gains fame fighting the Indians, and becomes President of Louisiana in 1802. He then fights Andrew Jackson, Chancellor of the American Republic during the Second Seven Years War (TTL's analouge to the Napoleonic Wars), but later allies himself to Jackson in an analgoue to the Treaty of Tilsit, thus both winning the war. Louisiana gains a alrge amoutn of former Canadian land for her victory. Napoleon then turns Louisiana into an Oligarchic Republic, remaining its President until his death in 1845.

In Disaster at Luethen by Direwolf22, Louisiana becomes an Independent republic after rebelling against France in the 1790's. After losing a war against the Confederacy of American States (Independent Southern America which rebelled against Britain after an earlier abolition of slavery) in the mid 1810's, the nation is taken over in a coup in 1819, led by Jerome Bonaparte, an ATL son of Napoleon Bonaparte, named after Napoleons OTL brother. IITL Napoleon is a general in the Sardinian army, and moves to the Louisiana Republic after the Revolutionary Wars to assist with their military, which turns out to be in vain. After Jerome's coup, war begins again between the CAS and Louisiana, with the latter victorious, gaining land lost in the previous conflict, and a "Freedmen's Republic" is declared. The Empire of Louisiana is then declared. Yet another war between the two begins in the early 1820's, with Louisiana victorious once again, gaining more land, with the CAS now is tatters. By 1830, the Empire of Louisiana is the dominant power in North America.

Also like in AKII, Louisiana goes to battle against an American state/Andrew Jackson. ITTL, Jackson is a general in the CAS army, who dies in 1819 during the Second Louisiana-CAS War.

There's more I got for later, but lets see what we can come up with! :D
 
Baconheimer

Baconheimer

Well in the Silent Map Games, the Angles (or alt-angles) always show up in weird places.


  • In Ancient World-1300 BC they are in the Baltics.
  • In Fall of Rome-476 AD they go to Spain and there is an Anglo-Hispanian Kingdom there.
 

Kaiser K

Communist America



Found in


"Reverse Cold War" (By MissWhatsittoya)
Reds!!!!!!!!!! (By Jello Biafra)
Paradox 1945 (By TheTimeRanger)
 

Codae

The Kingdom of the Three Sicilies

3rd Countries of an Alternate World Thread (Eigenwelt): Charles II doesn't permanently lose Sicily in the Revolt of the Sicilian Vespers, and his eighteenth-century successors seize a chunk of Algeria, naming it "South Sicily".

(Industrialization in) a different Europe (Kabraloth): The Kingdom of the Two Sicilies gains Tunisia at the 1820 Congress of Frankfurt resolving the disintegration of victorious Napoleonic France.

Map by Hapsburg (Hapsburg): The King of the Two Sicilies conquers and incorporates Albania during the Napoleonic Wars.

Look to the West (Thande): The King of the Two Sicilies liberates eastern Spain from revolutionary France and crowns himself King of Aragon. Later all but Catalonia is lost.

And a criticism of the meme, by Maharajah.
 

jmberry

Pop Culture Referances

Usually tongue-in-cheeck, a character or characters will either be named after or give a quote by a figure from 20th century pop culture. Examples:

For whatever reason, this seemed to be the big thing in SHWI's heyday. Decades of Darkness has Homer Simpson and Luke Skywalker as viewpoint characters and referances to Cthulhu, The Simpsons (again), and maybe a few others I can't remember. Prince of Peace (Faelin's medieval TL) has Robin Hood quote Aragorn, Frederick II quote Vader, and Juliet Capulet (!) as some sort of medieval guerilla commando (!!!). The most (in)famous TL with this, though, was Drowned Baby. Off the top of my head, I can remember the Brady Bunch, Thirteen Days in October, Gilligan's Island, Casablanca, Gilligan's Island (again), and I want to say Terminator but I'm not sure.
 
Aelita

Aelita

jmberry said:
Pop Culture Referances

Usually tongue-in-cheeck, a character or characters will either be named after or give a quote by a figure from 20th century pop culture. Examples:

For whatever reason, this seemed to be the big thing in SHWI's heyday. Decades of Darkness has Homer Simpson and Luke Skywalker as viewpoint characters and referances to Cthulhu, The Simpsons (again), and maybe a few others I can't remember. Prince of Peace (Faelin's medieval TL) has Robin Hood quote Aragorn, Frederick II quote Vader, and Juliet Capulet (!) as some sort of medieval guerilla commando (!!!). The most (in)famous TL with this, though, was Drowned Baby. Off the top of my head, I can remember the Brady Bunch, Thirteen Days in October, Gilligan's Island, Casablanca, Gilligan's Island (again), and I want to say Terminator but I'm not sure.
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This was also used by Eugene Byrne and Kim Newman in their Back in the USSA short story anthology. For example, John Rambo going to Indochina to train and support communist guerillas, English comic characters being conscripted to go fight in said country, Tom Joad being a real legendary figure (and a man ends up becoming the legend), Charles Foster Kane as the last president of the old United States (yes, that Kane).
 
oshron

oshron

jmberry said:
Pop Culture Referances

Usually tongue-in-cheeck, a character or characters will either be named after or give a quote by a figure from 20th century pop culture. Examples:

For whatever reason, this seemed to be the big thing in SHWI's heyday. Decades of Darkness has Homer Simpson and Luke Skywalker as viewpoint characters and referances to Cthulhu, The Simpsons (again), and maybe a few others I can't remember. Prince of Peace (Faelin's medieval TL) has Robin Hood quote Aragorn, Frederick II quote Vader, and Juliet Capulet (!) as some sort of medieval guerilla commando (!!!). The most (in)famous TL with this, though, was Drowned Baby. Off the top of my head, I can remember the Brady Bunch, Thirteen Days in October, Gilligan's Island, Casablanca, Gilligan's Island (again), and I want to say Terminator but I'm not sure.
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Captain Nemo is a historical character in my ASB ATL, pivotal in earlier Indian independence from *Britain ;)
 

Zoidberg12

Britain becomes undergoes Revolution after war, becomes dictatorship

In Fight and be Right by Edt, Great Britain, with an alternate British Empire joins her allies Russia and Japan in an alternate Great War in 1932 against the German Emprie. When war ends in 1936, Britain gains much of Germany's former colonies. Despite this, political instability at home, combined with the continuing leftist shirt in British politics, result in a Civil War in 1937, between the "Blues" and the "Reds." The Reds win by 1939, forming the Federation of Worker's Republics, a multinational Radical Syndicalist State/Soviet Union analog. Meanwhile, the British Royal Family flees to South Africa.

In American King: Take Two, Britain is forced to surrender after France invades London in the "Day of Misery". This humiliating loss in the SSYW, along with their earlier loss in the Great Revolution, hurts the nation in more ways than one. Over the next decade Britain is overtaken by poverty, famine, and political instability. As a result, the Duke of Wellington, Prime Minister of Great Britain, overthrows the monarchy and arrests all in parliament not loyal to him in the "October Revolution" of 1817, with the help of a group known as the "New Cromwellians". As a result, the Commonwealth of Great Britain, a Fascist Dictatorship party modeled on Cromwell's original Commonwealth, is born. Meanwhile, the British Royal Family flees to the URAS.

In American King I by Napoleon53, a similar event as above occurs. Britain sides with the Alexandrian rebels during the War of America Succession in the late 1860's, though only supports them. This leads Britain into war with France supporting the Royalists. As a result France successfully wages war against Britain on several front, culminating with the invasion and annexation of Ireland in 1871. At the end of the war in 1874, Britain is forced to give up allot of territory to pay huge reparations (Germany after WWI analog). In 1901, Britain undergoes a Fascist revolution led by Neville Chamberlain, culminating in the execution of Queen Victoria. The Federated Republic of England and Scotland is born. In 1940, when tensions heat up between the monarchies and fascists states, an Evil, neo-Cromwellian Winston Churchill and Oswald Mosley start TTL's WWI (WWII analog) by invading French Ireland and committing Holocaust-esque atrocities against Irish Catholics.

In Our Revolution, an ASB Alternate history scenario on the Alternate History Wikia and deviant-art by deviant-art member Ynot1989, Great Britain, along with Spain and Russia lose the Great North American War, thus ending the Napoleonic War and establishing Napoleon's France and the United States as the world's major powers, with the USA encompassing the entirety of the America's/Western Hemisphere. Britain is humiliated. In 1885, a Lincolnist (Marxist) Owenist movement takes hold in Britain, thus the Syndicalist British Workers Republics, based on Edt's scenario is born, with much mre autonomy given to its colonies. Many other nations become Syndicalist. After the World War of the 1910's, Britain is once again humiliated, losing all her colonies and then balkanizing. Britain becomes reunited in 1944 under a Pro-Democratic Oswald Mosley, thus forming the Commonwealth of Great Britain. The Commonwealth is a British Republic, which as of the 1950s is making a comeback on the world stage.
 

Zoidberg12

Alien Invasion of Earth during Historical Time Period.

In the Worldwar series by Harry Turtledove, a reptilian alien race known as "The Race" invades Earth in 1942, smack dab in the middle of WWII. The Race colonizes much of the Southern Hemisphere, and is forced to co-exist with Earth's superpowers.

In Send in the Elvises by Napoleon53, Elvis Presley is abducted by Martians on August 16th 1977, who mistake him for "the King" of Earth. Elvis is then killed by Martian interrogation drugs, but while the Martains prepare for an invasion of Earth, a strand of Elvis' hair gets mixed in the Clonning vats. Utter hilarity ensues! :D You have to read it to see what I mean. Giving things away would ruin the fun.

The War of Martian Aggression by rvbomally is another example. I haven't read it yet, but I plan to soon. I do know though that Martians invade Earth in the 19th century though.
 

Zoidberg12

No other takers? Fine then. :rolleyes: :p

Persia jointly invaded by England and Russia

IOTL, during the Anglo-Soviet Invasion of Iran

In American King II, the Russian Empire and Commonwealth of Great Britain, two uneasy allies, both invade and occupy Persia in 1850 during the Great War between the Nations.


The U.S.A. fights France in World War analog

In The Union Forever by Mac Macgregor, the United States joins the Coalition of Russia, Prussia and Britain in 1909, and declares war on the Entente, led by Second French Empire under Napoleon IV. This is the result of French convoy raiding against American ships, and the leaking of a Zimmerman note-eqsue letter's describing Napoleon IV's megalomaniac aspirations.

In Timeline 191 by Harry Turtledove, the USA joins the Central Powers, while the CSA joins the Entente threw here longtime allies of Britain and France. Thus the USA is at war with France in the first Great War, though their main focus is the CSA. This is also the case during the Second Great War, when France in under the Far-right Action Fraincaise. It should also be noted that France also fought against the American's during the Second Mexican War in 1881, though was a minor participant.
 

Zoidberg12

Here's another one! :cool:

France portrayed negatively and/or France-screw

OTL; France gaining so much during the Wars of Louis XIV than losing it all, losing the SYW, gaining so much during the French Revoultuonary/Napoleonic wars then anticlimactically losing it all after 1812, Franco-Prussian War, collaboration during WWII, etc.

In The Union Forever, the Second French Empire survives. However lose the intervention in Mexico to due to more US involvement as the result of an earlier ending to the ACW. Nevertheless under Napoleon III and his Austrian ally Maximilian I, Prussian unification is nipped in the bud, allowing the Empire to survive. France expands immensely under Napoleon IV, annexing Tripoli, Egypt, much of North Africa (a little more than OTL), and the Philippines. They also build the Panama Canal in 1903. However just as anticlimactically as Napoleon I, and even more ironic ITTL considering it happens to both Napoleons, most everything built territory-wise by Napoleon IV during his 30 plus year reign comes tumbling down after the Great War. Frances loses the war, and is forced to give up all of its overseas colonies, save for Algeria. However, after the war, France is able to keep both the far left and far right in line, thus remaining a stable democracy.

In Decades of Darkness, France completely and utterly balkanizes after losing the Great War to Germany.

In Disaster at Luethen, France wins the Seven Years War, but loses Louisiana in the early 1790's during the Age of Revolutions.

In The Anglo-American Nazi War by Calbear, France is viewed much more negatively for their collaboration with the Nazis than IOTL. Parts of France are even annexed to the UK, creating the United Kingdom of Great Britain, Northern Ireland, Brittany, Normandy, and Calais-Picardy.

And of course, from the Turtledove wiki....

Vile France

Turtledove has portrayed France negatively on any number of occasions.

In Atlantis, France is defeated and stripped of its Atlantean colonies. It is however later instrumental in achieving victory in the Atlantean War of Independence. In the very first chapter of "New Hastings," François Kersauzon indicates his willingness to share a meal with Edward Radcliffe by saying that he'd rather sit with an Englishman than a Frenchman. In "The Scarlet Band," Athelstan Helms and James Walton continue to make miscellaneous disparaging remarks directed at the French.

In "Before the Beginning ", France is described as turning out some of the best second-raters in the world.

In Curious Notions, France is dealt repeated military defeats by Germany, permanently losing its influence in European and world affairs.

In Every Inch a King, the fantastic kingdom Narbonensis is based on France. Narbonensis is the hereditary enemy of Schlepsig, the homeland of Otto of Schlepsig, the book's only POV. Thus, in the narration, Narbonensis is repeatedly derided.

In In High Places, France is the home of a primitive backwater civilization.

In In the Presence of Mine Enemies, France is annexed to Germany.

In The Man With the Iron Heart, France comes across as barely capable of administering its occupation zone. French officers are so touchy that they would rather compromise security efforts against the German Freedom Front than admit their dependence on the stronger Allied Forces members, though they do indeed rely on military and economic support from the Allies. They are also seen as treacherous, willing to play the United States and Soviet Union off against each other. Meanwhile, while some German characters acknowledge that the US, USSR, and UK are entitled to attempt to occupy Germany by right of conquest, all are disgusted and outraged at being subjected to occupation by France, which Germany had defeated.

In Ruled Britannia, France is in a very difficult geopolitical situation, as its Hapsburg enemies have encircled its territory.

In "Someone is Stealing the Great Throne Rooms of the Galaxy," France is described as "a second-rate power on a third-rate continent on the most insignificant planet in the galaxy with a glorious future behind it," and the French are generally portrayed as a craven, contemptible people.

In Southern Victory, France begins by supporting the Confederate States for opportunistic purposes, and during the Second Mexican War is generally perceived by the Confederates as a freeloading ally, demanding political influence in Richmond and spoils of war but doing little to attack the US militarily. During the Great War France is the first of the Western members of the Entente to bow out when discipline in the ranks breaks down and the army mutinies. Quebecois reflect that they feel no ties to their ancestral homeland because its government and society have become hopelessly corrupted in the century and half since the Seven Years' War. Characters in Occupied Canada remark that the Quebecois "act french", in that they indulge in sexual harassment. In the interwar years France eagerly embraces political authoritarianism and revanchism. In the Second Great War France is soon exposed as militarily impotent but diplomatically arrogant, with its foreign minister making obscene comments on the public record. Finally, France is attacked with atomic bombs and apparently begs for mercy immediately thereafter, suggesting a failing of national courage. At the end of the series the possibility of a French ascendancy in the foreseeable future is slim to nil, nor is this seen as undesirable.

In The Two Georges, France is a leading ally in the Holy Alliance, a distasteful federation to say the least.

In "Uncle Alf," even Adolf Hitler reflects on how disgustingly degraded the French are

In the Videssos series, the lone French (well, Gaul) character, Viridovix, while portrayed as a protagonist, has several qualities which could be viewed as distasteful, such as a willingness to side with the Roman soldiers of Marcus Scaurus to save his own life, and a rather overactive libido. These are consistent with traits which Turtledove uses to show French decadence in other works.

In Worldwar, the French begin the story occupied by and collaborating with the Nazis. As the Race makes inroads into France, the French collaborate with them as well, to the point that Leslie Groves fears they will offer to help the Lizards make chemical weapons to use against human soldiers. In the Colonization trilogy, France appears equally willing to kiss the Germans' asses and, after the Race-German War of 1965, the Lizards' talestumps, unlike most other occupied people shown in the series, who are nationalistic first and foremost even if they are willing to accommodate occupiers for their own purposes. Meanwhile, Free France is seen as something of a joke of a country which exists on international sufferance. And nearly all French characters are portrayed as bombastic, cowardly, touchy, and/or immoral, especially the male characters.

It should be noted, however, that France is portrayed in a perfectly inoffensive if not complimentary light in The War That Came Early, The
Disunited States of America, and "Les Mortes d'Arthur."

Who Needs Vichy?

After Germany conquered France in 1940, it directly occupied broad swaths along the northern and western coasts to its empire, but left about a third of France's territory in the southeastern corner in the hands of Vichy France, a puppet regime made up of Frenchmen who either held Fascist sympathies or were just opportunists. In both Worldwar and In the Presence of Mine Enemies, in which Germany continues to rule France after World War II ends, the Germans eventually dispense with the collaborationist regime, annexing the whole of the country outright in the former.

This might or might not be in keeping with Turtledove's Francophobia, as documented in the entry above this. It is possible that the Germans found working with Frenchmen as nominal equals, even Frenchmen who were on their side, too exasperating to be worthwhile.
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Umbric Man

Umbric Man

Southern rebellion after Britain abolishes slavery in 1834:

In the Dominion of Southern America, many British provinces that remain in North America south of 36'30'' revolt and establish a 'Confederacy of Southern America', which is crushed. A 'Scarlet League' analogous to the KKK is stamped out by a combined Anglo-Southern elite presence in the colonies.

In the published AH work Britannia and Columbia, the southern provinces revolt and a sort of combined parallel of the OTL Civil War (due to all Anglo-America remaining British and the North helping move troops down south) and British stamping out of rebellious provinces analogous to OTL's Canadian Rebellions (since they, of course, send troops as well) happens in the 1830s. The provinces are defeated and occupied by the North/Britain, notably Texas is split into three due to its power and influence in the south during this war.
 

Dumanios

US Balkanization

OTL: The closest to a balkanization of the USA was the US Civil War.

Shattered Union: After Washington DC is nuked, the US splits into seven countries, plus an EU occupation zone and Russian occupied Alaska.

TL-191: USA-CSA, again, plus Deseret.

FISOT II: Five different nations in OTL USA, with three at the end.

Yet Another ISOT Storm: The USA, CSA, Texas, California, and Deseret, through different ISOTS. The Vermont Republic also was there, until it was brought into the USA.
 

Codae

Cigar-Wielding National Leader Suicide-Bombs Important Government Building to Decapitate French Invasion

Look to the West (Thande): In 1807, British PM Charles James Fox invites London-invading French general Lazare Hoche to 10 Downing Street, and blows him up.

The Stars at Night: a Texas Timeline (Sicarius): In 1872, Texan President William Walker meets with Austin-invading French colonel Jean Danjou in the Texan capitol building, and blows him up.
 
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Lalli

1941: Hitler's Mediterranean Strategy:

- Germany occypies Middle East.
- Nazis Jewish slaves for Arabs.
- USA drops two nuclear bombs to Germany.
- Allies divide Germany for three countries after WW2.

A Different Finnish War:

- Sweden wins war against Russia on 1808.

A Dropped Pen:

- Martin Luther doesn't begin Protestant Reformation and religious development takes different path.

A Giant Sucking Sound: A President Perot:

- Ross Perot elect as POTUS.
- Vladimir Zhirinovsky become president of Russia.

A Song Was Heard in China - A Different Tiananmmen:

- PRC begins decracing.

A World of Laughter, A World of Tears:

- Walt Disney's presidency.

Ancient Egypt Survives Until the Present Day:

- Surviving Ancient Egypt. Well, not my favorite TLs but idea is still intresting.

And Hell Followd With Him:

- Worse Black Death

Austria: Never Forget Thy Past:

- Austria stays as monarchy after WW1.

Cliveless World:

- French India

Dominion of Southern America:

- Canadan US, British Deep South
- World War on end of 19th century

Europa - Imperial Ambition, Ancient Blood:

- German tribes unites as one empire.

For All Times:

- Franklin D. Roosevelt dies on 1941.

For Want of a Pretzel:

- George W. Bush dies.

Gurkani Alam:

- Surviving Moghul Empire

If You Wait You might Become King of Sweden:

- Scandinavia unites as one state.

Ironclad, Federalism:

- George Washington serves only one term.
- Alexandr Hamilton acts as POTUS.

Kalter Krieg - A TL of Three Way Cold War:

- Hitler assassinate on 1938.
- No WW2

Monica's Baby, the Ruin of Clinton:

- Monica Lewinsky become pregnant.

No Nero:

- emperor Britannicus

The Airship President:

- Nazis not rise to power.

The Coronation of the Hun:

- Attila becomes emperor of Rome.

The Union Forever:

- Different world war.
- Russian empire transfer peacefully to constitutional monarchy.
 
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