How viable would Pied Noir lead Algeria

Ah, thought he meant in the 1960s. At the least, though, that means such a state would be viable until today. Throw in the Harkis and their families and it becomes more so.
"À cette date, l'Algérie compte environ 9,5 millions de musulmans et environ 1 million d'Européens non-musulmans dont 130 000 juifs séfarades[réf. nécessaire]."
So, 10% Europeans and not many Jews according to wiki. Now they were heavily concentrated on the coasts and the West as mentioned.
Jews did side with the French government because they were full citizens, as per the Crémieux decret
 
The population of Algeria in 1960 was ~11 Million, meaning that those two million pied-noirs are 18% of the population. To put that into perspective, the highest the White population in South African ever got was 22%.

It won't stay that way in the middle to long term. The average Algerian birth rate was 7.38 in 1964. By comparsion the french birth rate was less than 3 per woman during the same time period.

I think the 2 million was an extrapolation to today, like the 40 million Algerians. As far as I know, in 1960 the European population of Algeria was around 10%.
There are 1.4 million people of pied noirs descent in France right now. Show casing the ethnic group's stagnant population growth.

Ah, thought he meant in the 1960s. At the least, though, that means such a state would be viable until today. Throw in the Harkis and their families and it becomes more so.

No it would not be. As time goes on the colonists population will go from being a small minority to an insignificant one in a few generations.
 
It won't stay that way in the middle to long term. The average Algerian birth rate was 7.38 in 1964. By comparsion the french birth rate was less than 3 per woman during the same time period.

No it would not be. As time goes on the colonists population will go from being a small minority to an insignificant one in a few generations.

I think you missed the point, which was that such a state would be viable for a few decades at the least.
 
I think you missed the point, which was that such a state would be viable for a few decades at the least.

Absolutely not. A pied noirs state in Algeria would be demograpically wise, less stable than apartheid South Africa was. And that is before you get into all the pressure the USA will put on it. As well as all the pan Arab and islamist fighters that would pour in to liberate Algeria. And all the gulf oil money that would equip said fighters. It would take a small miracle for said state to last into the 80s let alone any further than that.
 
Absolutely not. A pied noirs state in Algeria would be demograpically wise, less stable than apartheid South Africa was. And that is before you get into all the pressure the USA will put on it. As well as all the pan Arab and islamist fighters that would pour in to liberate Algeria. And all the gulf oil money that would equip said fighters. It would take a small miracle for said state to last into the 80s let alone any further than that.

Which again is the point, it could last for a bit especially given there was probably in the vicinity of a million or so Harkis and Pro-French Algerians. Whether or not it ultimately collapses is irrelevant to that.
 

Lusitania

Donor
There are less than 2 million French Algerians. There are more than 40 million Algerians the pied noirs are out numbered twenty to one, no way there maintaining a hold on the country without the French army.
But we talking about a 1960 population for starters. the population of Algeria in 1960 was closer to 12 million. of which the French and those who supported them was maybe 3 million or could of even been more.
 
Absolutely not. A pied noirs state in Algeria would be demograpically wise, less stable than apartheid South Africa was. And that is before you get into all the pressure the USA will put on it. As well as all the pan Arab and islamist fighters that would pour in to liberate Algeria. And all the gulf oil money that would equip said fighters. It would take a small miracle for said state to last into the 80s let alone any further than that.
Guess the question is how much European immigration there is, and what level of support France gives
 
You have good lands, you can have an industry similar to Southern Italy. A lot of the agricultural workers could be Spanish or Italians
The French agricultural enterprises in the Oran are probably going to go bankrupt paying pied noirs agricultural workers south European wages.
 
You should consider that alot of the Pied-noir were actualy spanish, portugese or italian, who where also not trusted by the french. Also I doubt it would become an Apartheid state and survive. The tunisians and moroccans were supporting the algerians even though mighty France was there. With France out of the picture the support will be bigger and unlike OTL the neighbors could get something out of their support.
Also there was a big moroccan minority that probably wasn't included in the population number, because they were considered non-citizens.
 
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This apartheid state would only delay the expulsion of French settlers from Algeria. And said expulsion would be even more violent than it was in the original timeline.
 
WI
Algeria absorbed Jewish, Ukrainian, Polish, etc. refugees as labourers. Immigrants would have difficulty gaining citizenship, but as long as their children learned French, the children could become full citizens of Algeria.
To absorb that many immigrants, Algeria would need to develop. More industrialized economy.
 
Hmm... maybe with some cultural genocide, culture assimilation (along with actual genocide) and system based off the Aparthied system in South Africa, will the Pied Noir dominate Algerian society. Suggestion to how Pied Noir lead Algeria, not I support such suggestions personally.
 
Post the creation of Israel, the position of Jews in most Moslem states went from being second class citizens downhill pretty rapidly including pogroms, and expulsions with confiscation of all assets. As French citizens, the Jews of Algeria had equality under the law and reasonably equal opportunity - attendance at French universities and professional schools etc. Sure there was social antisemitism (in the 40s, the 50s, and the 2010s everywhere) but that was certainly something you could live with. The Jews of Algeria, even though many had lived there "forever" were seen as foreign as the pied noirs and so a "threat" to Algeria, and on top of that demonized as agents of Israel, the "threat" to all Arabs/Muslims.

Following independence the nationality law in 1963 denied citizenship to non-Muslims. Somewhere above 130K Jews left Algeria, in 1969 1,000 Jews were left, after 2000, 50 at most. The Grand Synagogue in Algiers was turned in to a mosque.
 
Post the creation of Israel, the position of Jews in most Moslem states went from being second class citizens downhill pretty rapidly including pogroms, and expulsions with confiscation of all assets. As French citizens, the Jews of Algeria had equality under the law and reasonably equal opportunity - attendance at French universities and professional schools etc. Sure there was social antisemitism (in the 40s, the 50s, and the 2010s everywhere) but that was certainly something you could live with. The Jews of Algeria, even though many had lived there "forever" were seen as foreign as the pied noirs and so a "threat" to Algeria, and on top of that demonized as agents of Israel, the "threat" to all Arabs/Muslims.

Following independence the nationality law in 1963 denied citizenship to non-Muslims. Somewhere above 130K Jews left Algeria, in 1969 1,000 Jews were left, after 2000, 50 at most. The Grand Synagogue in Algiers was turned in to a mosque.
where the French not also intensely anti semitic?
 
Were the French antisemitic? Some yes, some no, some in the middle. Certainly Vichy cooperated with the Germans in rounding up and deporting Jews, and in Algeria there were camps for Jews and labor units but not like in Europe. After the war, the antisemitic laws were repealed and, at least in laws, Jews were equal French citizens. The antisemitism of France/the French was, in the post WWII period (between 1945 and Algerian independence in 1962) pretty minor compared to the loss of citizenship and other measures taken against Algerian Jews following independence.
 
The antisemitism of France/the French was, in the post WWII period (between 1945 and Algerian independence in 1962) pretty minor compared to the loss of citizenship and other measures taken against Algerian Jews following independence.
The antisemitism in Algeria was caused by French collaboration, not the other way around.

I doubt pre French Algeria was much more antisemitic than contemporary France.
 
Say the Pied Noir declare an independent Algeria with the backing of France

Would a Pied Noir dominated Algeria without troops from mainland France be viable

Yes, but there would have to be lots of atrocities first. Pretty nasty probably.
 
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