Yes, I know what a radiological bomb is. I am asking what specifically it is from OTL, or if it's some specific gas that wasn't weaponized OTL.
How Silent Fall the Cherry Blossoms
- Thread starter Geon
- Start date
- Status
Yes, I know what a radiological bomb is. I am asking what specifically it is from OTL, or if it's some specific gas that wasn't weaponized OTL.
De Gaulle still pursues an independent nuclear deterrent, then? And did he quit NATO this time?
Marc A
Marc A
Its a radiological weapon, the soviet used in there early rockets, until there nuclear warhead were small enough to fit on there rocket.
the GX3 radioactive gas comes from 1946 Belgian comic "The Secret of the Swordfish" by Edgar P. Jacobs
you bet on that, after two invasion by Germany and Soviet lurking around, France will take the nuclear deterrent.
but think that here thing s goes a little bit different as OLT
Geon mention that US President Taft goes for old Isolation politic of US, i think as Taft change his mind and return to NATO in 1952
he will find it dominate by a very big french men, called by everyone "Mon General"...
cubefreak123
Banned
I imagine that the US perspective on the space race is a bit of OTL, "we must beat those commies!" towards the Soviets. To the French it's probably, "Pshh. Those pompous jerks are trying to beat us?" And when Japan and whomever else comes later it will probably be like now, "Sure. Why not? Good for you." 
Am I the only one getting the feeling that the French are being painted as kind of...assholes in this TL? Seems like they're taking a US post-9/11 kind of stance with the world.
Am I the only one getting the feeling that the French are being painted as kind of...assholes in this TL? Seems like they're taking a US post-9/11 kind of stance with the world.
I imagine that the US perspective on the space race is a bit of OTL, "we must beat those commies!" towards the Soviets. To the French it's probably, "Pshh. Those pompous jerks are trying to beat us?" And when Japan and whomever else comes later it will probably be like now, "Sure. Why not? Good for you."
Am I the only one getting the feeling that the French are being painted as kind of...assholes in this TL? Seems like they're taking a US post-9/11 kind of stance with the world.
Well in a sense they are justified, chemical attack on Paris, german guerrillas warfare and at least from the beginning NATO big responsability was on their shoulder, so they will be a little more aggressive.
Not counting that without Korea and Indochina they will be a little more well off.
Note: as said earlier, frankly i think that London and Paris bakc off at Suez will be 'out of character', expecially with Paris being led by De Gaulle. Not counting that at the time they were not so dependent by arab oil and frankly much of that leaderships will be very happy if Nasser bite the dust.
katchen
Banned
Wallace is sounding a lot like an early version of former Virgnina Senator and former Secretary of the Navy James Webb.Here is the beginning of Wallace's Second Term. I have tried to steer a course between both sides of the aisle as it were regarding political matters maintaining a middle of the road stance. I hope those of a different political persuasion will be charitable with me.
Geon
P.S. Next posting will bring us up to date on TTL's space age.
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Wallace entered his second term badly shaken by the death of his Vice President and friend Robert Kennedy. In his biography later Wallace had admitted to his misgivings and early dislike of the young charismatic Vice President. However four years had transformed Wallace’s attitude to first respect and then a growing friendship. Kennedy’s no-nonsense gung ho attitude had appealed to Wallace. His death at the hands of a southern racist deeply affected him.
Wallace began his second term with a private vow he shared with only a select few members of his Cabinet. “When I am done the “n” word will have no place in southern society or anywhere else. Wallace would sic J. Edgar Hoover and the full resources of the FBI on southern racist groups making the destruction of groups like the KKK a top priority of his second term.
At the same time Wallace used the “bully pulpit,” of the presidency to urge southern educators and religious leaders to help “move the south away from hatred.” At one point in a speech in Birmingham, Alabama he pointed to a Confederate flag he had on the podium behind him next to the American flag.
This flag was carried with honor into battle by our ancestors one hundred years ago. Men died for what it represented. How would those men feel if they knew it was being used by a small minority as a symbol of hatred! (President Wallace in a speech in Birmingham, Alabama on August 9, 1969)Wallace also pushed a series of programs he called “The Compassionate Society.” Wallace was acutely aware of the poverty that existed in many Southern states and elsewhere in the nation. The Compassionate Society was based on a simple idea that Wallace touted when he spoke of the programs it encompassed, “Give a man a fish and you’ve fed him for a day, teach a man to fish and you’ve fed him for a lifetime.” Wallace would add the following statement, “But to teach him to fish you have to keep him alive long enough to learn.”
Wallace’s vision for the Compassionate Society was a nation that truly cared for the poor but did not bind them to permanent dependence on welfare. His plans involved the following.
Wallace’s Compassionate Society programs would ensure a welfare program that would hopefully gradually wean those on it off welfare. The measures Wallace proposed did not meet the approval either of many of his more liberal colleagues in the Democratic Party nor many Republicans who felt that Wallace’s plan amounted to more government spending and bigger government. Nevertheless by the end of his second term Wallace would have gotten all of the Compassionate Society Acts ratified by Congress.
- First, fair and equitable welfare distribution systems based on the economic status of the applicant taking into account all of his resources (if any).
- Helping those in need to get out of their cycle of poverty by providing vocational/technical education that would give them skills they could use in the market place.
- Except in the cases of those who were dependent children, severely disabled or ill and unable to work there would be a cut-off point for all those receiving benefits once they were judged able to find a job.
- Cooperating with local and state secular and religious organizations that aided the poor rather then working against them and having the national government be a supplement to their efforts rather then a replacement.
The Wallace Presidency would also witness another milestone on September 18, 1971 when Gus Grissom became the first man to land on the Moon.
. Webb, who wrote THE history of the Scots-Irish in the United States "Born Fighting" ( what may be a must read for AH people) makes the good point that poor white "trash" were put upon and discriminated against in the South too. Poor whites as well as African-Americans were share-croppers, were prevented from voting just as African-Americans were and suffered abysmal working conditions and health issues such as "brown lung" in Southern textile mills. And were and still are prevented from organizing labor unions, often by appeals to racism. It sounds like Wallace found a way to get Southern poor whites to realize that they were being played for suckers by Southern oligarchs. Going into a bit more detail on how that happened would be helpful, Geon.
Geon
Donor
Space Program Part II
Okay, first an apology that updates aren't coming as fast as they used to. I don't have internet at home however my employers have graciously allowed me to write this during my down time at work. Now however as we get later in the year I am a bit more busy so as you can tell my production has fallen off. On this I trust you will bear with me.
Katchen - I am not so up on the ins and outs on southern politics that I feel I could do the subject you mention justice. If anyone is please let me know and I would be happy to let you make a submission.
Here is part II of the Space Program, next we take a step back for a rather whimsical interlude. Remember the KKK group described earler that actually began a transformation? Well wait until you see that transformation-Prepare yourselves for the Stars and Bars Circus and Thrill show!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
John Glenn would have the honor of being the first man to orbit the Earth about 6 months later. Project Mercury would come to an end in December of 1962 with the successful 24 hour orbital flight of “Deke” Slayton.
The breakneck speed of the Mercury program gave way to the more measured pace of the Gemini and Apollo programs. A near disaster when Gemini 3 was launched convinced the Project managers of the need to slow down. Gemini 3 had been launched on March 23, 1965 with the mission of orbiting the Earth three times and returning. Gus Grissom and John Young were the two astronauts on board. Seconds after the Titan rocket left the ground the first stage exploded. Fortunately instruments detected the explosion and the safety tower safely launched the Gemini capsule away from the disintegrating rocket before the second stage blew. Grissom and Young were able to parachute in the capsule safely to Earth. The disaster convinced NASA technicians and project managers that the pace had to be slowed down.
Over the next eight years the pace was slowed down. Project Gemini concluded in 1967 proving it was possible to rendezvous, dock, and work in space for long periods. Project Apollo began in 1968 with a plan for reaching the Moon by 1971. On September 5, 1971 Apollo 11 with Gus Grissom, Frank Bormann, and Buzz Aldrin lifted off from Cape Canaveral Space Center for the Moon. In the stands watching the lift off was former President Kennedy, now confined to a wheelchair along with Vice President Hubert Humphrey. Three days later Gus Grissom would become the first human being to set foot on the Moon uttering the now immortal phrase, “This is just a small step, but it is the first great leap for mankind.”
Grissom would go on to set the endurance record in space for the 1974 Skylab mission, spending 179 days in Earth orbit aboard the Skylab space station. In 2004 when he finally passed away he requested his ashes be scattered on the Moon. That request would be granted a year later when a special space probe designed by private contractors was launched from the Kennedy Space Center in Florida. Named simply Memoriam it had a simple task, carrying the ashes of Gus Grissom in a special container patterned ironically after the Japanese ceramic bombs that fell on Los Angeles on November 5, 1944, Memoriam would crash into the Lunar surface shattering the container with the late astronaut’s ashes and scattering them over the lunar surface.
After the Skylab project (1973-1977) manned spaceflight was abandoned because of cost concerns. While the idea of a space shuttle was considered for a time the idea was shelved as not entirely practical. In 1995 however a new reusable booster system was developed using designs left by the late Dr. Werner Von Braun. This system would allow spacecraft to go into orbit more efficiently at less cost. A spacecraft that proved useful for this was the Delta Glider, a further development of the Dyna Soar project. The Delta Glider allowed the pilot to return the spacecraft to land safely on a runway look an airplane.
In 2002 work began on the International Space Station. Components were launched into space using the reusable booster system and would be assembled by the astronauts as they lived in worked in a Skylab “work shack” sent up first to provide shelter for a long term stay. The ISS would be completed on May 9, 2012 with the last module being added.
As indicated above plans are afoot for an international expedition to Mars sometime in 2020 and tentatively a plan in 2025 for a manned expedition to Jupiter to study the intricate moon system of that planet.
Okay, first an apology that updates aren't coming as fast as they used to. I don't have internet at home however my employers have graciously allowed me to write this during my down time at work. Now however as we get later in the year I am a bit more busy so as you can tell my production has fallen off. On this I trust you will bear with me.
Katchen - I am not so up on the ins and outs on southern politics that I feel I could do the subject you mention justice. If anyone is please let me know and I would be happy to let you make a submission.
Here is part II of the Space Program, next we take a step back for a rather whimsical interlude. Remember the KKK group described earler that actually began a transformation? Well wait until you see that transformation-Prepare yourselves for the Stars and Bars Circus and Thrill show!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
John Glenn would have the honor of being the first man to orbit the Earth about 6 months later. Project Mercury would come to an end in December of 1962 with the successful 24 hour orbital flight of “Deke” Slayton.
The breakneck speed of the Mercury program gave way to the more measured pace of the Gemini and Apollo programs. A near disaster when Gemini 3 was launched convinced the Project managers of the need to slow down. Gemini 3 had been launched on March 23, 1965 with the mission of orbiting the Earth three times and returning. Gus Grissom and John Young were the two astronauts on board. Seconds after the Titan rocket left the ground the first stage exploded. Fortunately instruments detected the explosion and the safety tower safely launched the Gemini capsule away from the disintegrating rocket before the second stage blew. Grissom and Young were able to parachute in the capsule safely to Earth. The disaster convinced NASA technicians and project managers that the pace had to be slowed down.
Over the next eight years the pace was slowed down. Project Gemini concluded in 1967 proving it was possible to rendezvous, dock, and work in space for long periods. Project Apollo began in 1968 with a plan for reaching the Moon by 1971. On September 5, 1971 Apollo 11 with Gus Grissom, Frank Bormann, and Buzz Aldrin lifted off from Cape Canaveral Space Center for the Moon. In the stands watching the lift off was former President Kennedy, now confined to a wheelchair along with Vice President Hubert Humphrey. Three days later Gus Grissom would become the first human being to set foot on the Moon uttering the now immortal phrase, “This is just a small step, but it is the first great leap for mankind.”
Grissom would go on to set the endurance record in space for the 1974 Skylab mission, spending 179 days in Earth orbit aboard the Skylab space station. In 2004 when he finally passed away he requested his ashes be scattered on the Moon. That request would be granted a year later when a special space probe designed by private contractors was launched from the Kennedy Space Center in Florida. Named simply Memoriam it had a simple task, carrying the ashes of Gus Grissom in a special container patterned ironically after the Japanese ceramic bombs that fell on Los Angeles on November 5, 1944, Memoriam would crash into the Lunar surface shattering the container with the late astronaut’s ashes and scattering them over the lunar surface.
After the Skylab project (1973-1977) manned spaceflight was abandoned because of cost concerns. While the idea of a space shuttle was considered for a time the idea was shelved as not entirely practical. In 1995 however a new reusable booster system was developed using designs left by the late Dr. Werner Von Braun. This system would allow spacecraft to go into orbit more efficiently at less cost. A spacecraft that proved useful for this was the Delta Glider, a further development of the Dyna Soar project. The Delta Glider allowed the pilot to return the spacecraft to land safely on a runway look an airplane.
In 2002 work began on the International Space Station. Components were launched into space using the reusable booster system and would be assembled by the astronauts as they lived in worked in a Skylab “work shack” sent up first to provide shelter for a long term stay. The ISS would be completed on May 9, 2012 with the last module being added.
As indicated above plans are afoot for an international expedition to Mars sometime in 2020 and tentatively a plan in 2025 for a manned expedition to Jupiter to study the intricate moon system of that planet.
Oh so a wonderful climax
Gus Grissom, the first man on moon, he had deserved it !
little bits and Details:
McDonnell wanted to use a safety tower on original Mercury Mark II what became Gemini
On Skylab program, it must be the use of Skylab and it's Backup Skylab B.
that 1977 US manned spaceflight was abandoned because of cost concerns, is realistic.
because several US politician like Walter Mondale or William Proxmire demand to stop this "waste of money"
seems they win in this TL
i work on second part of French in space
it will feature some US and USSR probes to moon.
Gus Grissom, the first man on moon, he had deserved it !
little bits and Details:
McDonnell wanted to use a safety tower on original Mercury Mark II what became Gemini
On Skylab program, it must be the use of Skylab and it's Backup Skylab B.
that 1977 US manned spaceflight was abandoned because of cost concerns, is realistic.
because several US politician like Walter Mondale or William Proxmire demand to stop this "waste of money"
seems they win in this TL
i work on second part of French in space
it will feature some US and USSR probes to moon.
cubefreak123
Banned
Interesting concept with a resurgent interest in space. Although I understand that manned space research seemingly going away then roaring back would cause a lot of research time and money getting poured into it, I don't know about Mars by 2020. I say that because they haven't done manned space flight for 2 decades but caught up (or maybe are even on track to surpass) OTL? Seems a little odd considering how much of it is trial and error; then again, I suppose just because the US isn't doing anything doesn't mean that someone else isn't...
So the US had no manned spaceflight between '77 and '95, but what about the rest of the world?
Geon
Donor
The Russians would have still built the Mir space station. They probably-budget constraints permitting- would have had men in space during this time.
And of course Japan put a man in space by 1995.
Geon
Here the second Part on French in Space and Soviet and US Lunar probes to 1963
The French Space program: Part Two
The Hope of CIEES on full scale French Space Program, after President de Gaulle phone call were short, very short!
in 1960 the French Fourth Republic had not the finance or political will for a large scale space program.
the French military were in full armament, like equip the Force de frappe (strike force) with nuclear weapons and there delivery system (R-2M, Mirage V supersonic Bomber and Nuclear Submarines)
while the French Air force got there VTOL interceptor SNECMA C-455 Celèoptére and it's Mach 3 Version AP-503 Basilic.
Political things went not so good in French Fourth Republic, the lost of Indochina colony, the fighting' in Algeria and begin of uprising in Congo (the former Belgium colony).
Lucky CIEES got enough budget for President de Gaulle demand for a "french Mission" to the Moon
LRBA (Laboratory Research for Ballistic and Aerodynamic ) proposed the "Améthiste" a rocket stage build from parts of 4 R-2M cores.
Améthiste would serve as first stage of new rocket called "Vulcain" it use a shorter R-2 as second stage and depending it mission, various third stages.
Also start a R&D program HM (hydrogen motor) on oxygen and hydrogen engine for a Vulcain high energy third stage.
During 1960 and 1962 several satellites were launch on modified R-2M relabel Diamant, with success, other end in disaster
Like the launches of Diadème and Polaire, were the Véronique pressure feed engine lost to fast pressure and the Satellites made only a suborbital flight.
in 1962 the first Vulcain made it's qualification launch bringing the test satellite Peole into orbit.
During same time the USA and USSR went in next step in the space race: Lunar probes.
At least they try, the USAF Pioneer in 1961/62, but the Probes never reach the Moon, either by exploding rockets or get in to low orbit
NASA had not better luck with Ranger Program, it took them 4 year to have first successful mission to moon in 1965.
The Soviet were not better they try fifth launches of Lunar probes, but the R-7 failed, the six launched successful labels Luna 1 miss the moon by over 10000 kilometer, on january 1962.
Then the french start launch series of Vulcain, Off curse the french activity were monitor by USA and USSR but not much they can do,
Lunar 2 made low pass over the lunar surface of 5 km, the close miss of Moon ever by a space craft, while NASA Ranger 4 was lost, after the Atlas-Vega launch the probe to the Moon.
Would the French be successful ?
On 1 december 1962 a Vulcain rocket take off CIEES spaceport direction the Moon, launching the probe "Columbiad" (after projectile of jules Verne "From the Earth to the Moon")
The french scientist show sense of humor by transmitting continuous the tape of "Clair de Lune" by Claude Debussy over a free channel, clear to hear for listener on radio telescope worldwide.
"a Lovely touch" remember Bernard Lovell, who monitor the Columbiad flight, then with Mark I radio telescope at Jodrell Bank Observatory,
"and more esthetic as "The Internationale" squeaking of Lunar 3[1] or "The Stars and Stripe Forever" that Ranger 5 screaming into space in july 1963…" he remark directly afterwards.
Back to the Columbiad, the french choice on rocket hardware was right, the melody "Clair de Lune" stop, the probe reach it's target, the Hipparchus crater on the Moon.
It became World News that France hit the Moon first, CIESS gain precious scientific data from Columbiad and the honorable participation in french military parade of 1963.
1963 get the Moon race a step further the Soviet send Lunar 3 behind the moon to take picture of it's fare side, but transmit only blurry pictures back.
the Soviet interrupt there Lunar program for 4 years and overwork it totally.
while Ranger 5 transmitting "the Stars and Stripe Forever", the TV camera failed again. NASA holds the program for two years to get "the Bugs out"
Columbiad-2 was more successful in taking better picture like Ranger 5, the french din't not activate there Camera in last minute, but the TV camera run from Rocket start on !
giving the complete space mission as non stop 72 hours TV coverage, from start to impact in the Hipparchus crater.
in same time the most watch TV event in 1963, before landing of Apollo 11 on Moon…
[1] in OTL it was Luna 10 who played the Internationale from Lunar Orbit in 1966, using a set of solid-state oscillators.
The French Space program: Part Two
The Hope of CIEES on full scale French Space Program, after President de Gaulle phone call were short, very short!
in 1960 the French Fourth Republic had not the finance or political will for a large scale space program.
the French military were in full armament, like equip the Force de frappe (strike force) with nuclear weapons and there delivery system (R-2M, Mirage V supersonic Bomber and Nuclear Submarines)
while the French Air force got there VTOL interceptor SNECMA C-455 Celèoptére and it's Mach 3 Version AP-503 Basilic.
Political things went not so good in French Fourth Republic, the lost of Indochina colony, the fighting' in Algeria and begin of uprising in Congo (the former Belgium colony).
Lucky CIEES got enough budget for President de Gaulle demand for a "french Mission" to the Moon
LRBA (Laboratory Research for Ballistic and Aerodynamic ) proposed the "Améthiste" a rocket stage build from parts of 4 R-2M cores.
Améthiste would serve as first stage of new rocket called "Vulcain" it use a shorter R-2 as second stage and depending it mission, various third stages.
Also start a R&D program HM (hydrogen motor) on oxygen and hydrogen engine for a Vulcain high energy third stage.
During 1960 and 1962 several satellites were launch on modified R-2M relabel Diamant, with success, other end in disaster
Like the launches of Diadème and Polaire, were the Véronique pressure feed engine lost to fast pressure and the Satellites made only a suborbital flight.
in 1962 the first Vulcain made it's qualification launch bringing the test satellite Peole into orbit.
During same time the USA and USSR went in next step in the space race: Lunar probes.
At least they try, the USAF Pioneer in 1961/62, but the Probes never reach the Moon, either by exploding rockets or get in to low orbit
NASA had not better luck with Ranger Program, it took them 4 year to have first successful mission to moon in 1965.
The Soviet were not better they try fifth launches of Lunar probes, but the R-7 failed, the six launched successful labels Luna 1 miss the moon by over 10000 kilometer, on january 1962.
Then the french start launch series of Vulcain, Off curse the french activity were monitor by USA and USSR but not much they can do,
Lunar 2 made low pass over the lunar surface of 5 km, the close miss of Moon ever by a space craft, while NASA Ranger 4 was lost, after the Atlas-Vega launch the probe to the Moon.
Would the French be successful ?
On 1 december 1962 a Vulcain rocket take off CIEES spaceport direction the Moon, launching the probe "Columbiad" (after projectile of jules Verne "From the Earth to the Moon")
The french scientist show sense of humor by transmitting continuous the tape of "Clair de Lune" by Claude Debussy over a free channel, clear to hear for listener on radio telescope worldwide.
"a Lovely touch" remember Bernard Lovell, who monitor the Columbiad flight, then with Mark I radio telescope at Jodrell Bank Observatory,
"and more esthetic as "The Internationale" squeaking of Lunar 3[1] or "The Stars and Stripe Forever" that Ranger 5 screaming into space in july 1963…" he remark directly afterwards.
Back to the Columbiad, the french choice on rocket hardware was right, the melody "Clair de Lune" stop, the probe reach it's target, the Hipparchus crater on the Moon.
It became World News that France hit the Moon first, CIESS gain precious scientific data from Columbiad and the honorable participation in french military parade of 1963.
1963 get the Moon race a step further the Soviet send Lunar 3 behind the moon to take picture of it's fare side, but transmit only blurry pictures back.
the Soviet interrupt there Lunar program for 4 years and overwork it totally.
while Ranger 5 transmitting "the Stars and Stripe Forever", the TV camera failed again. NASA holds the program for two years to get "the Bugs out"
Columbiad-2 was more successful in taking better picture like Ranger 5, the french din't not activate there Camera in last minute, but the TV camera run from Rocket start on !
giving the complete space mission as non stop 72 hours TV coverage, from start to impact in the Hipparchus crater.
in same time the most watch TV event in 1963, before landing of Apollo 11 on Moon…
[1] in OTL it was Luna 10 who played the Internationale from Lunar Orbit in 1966, using a set of solid-state oscillators.
Geon
Donor
General Wainwright and Tokyo Rose
I want to take some time now to back up and tie up some loose ends with some interludes which will try to tie up some loose ends in this story and give some ideas on the cultural impact of TTL. We'll begin with General Jonathan Wainwright and the woman most commonly identified as "Tokyo Rose".
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Interlude #1 – Homecomings
On November 6, 1946, the day following the 2nd anniversary of Japanese attack on Los Angeles, a special ceremony would take place at the White House. Two people, one a seasoned military officer, the other a middle aged woman of Japanese-American descent were to be honored by their country for the roles they had played in winning World War II. Those people were General Jonathan Wainwright and the recently wed Mrs. Iva Ikuko Toguri Giancomo.
Jonathan Wainwright would receive the Medal of Honor for his courage both in leading the final defense of the Philippines and in his daring escape from Japan with important information that led to the end of the war. Miss Toguri would receive the recently established Presidential Medal of Freedom for her part in transmitting needed information that led to the deaths of the War Cabinet and the final surrender of Japan. No one of course would know the full story; namely how the Emperor engineered Wainwright’s escape or how he had been the one to give Miss Toguri the needed information that would lead to the second bombing raid that tipped the political balance in Japan and allowed the Emperor to surrender. The true facts behind what actually happened would remain secret until 1997. Officially Wainwright and Toguri had been enlisted by a cabal of high level Japanese officials who were determined to end the war before their country was destroyed. Those officials were still serving in the Japanese government and so of course their names could not be revealed for many years.
With General Wainwright was his old friend, General Douglas MacArthur. MacArthur of course knew the truth behind the Japanese surrender and who had supplied the information that ended the war with Japan. He also knew the tremendous risks his friend had taken to deliver that information. MacArthur had led the drive to have Jonathan receive the Medal of Honor at the earliest possible time. When some congressmen tried to raise objections that General Wainwright was a “losing general,” Douglas had flown to Washington personally and virtually tongue-lashed several congressmen in their offices virtually shaming those who tried to block the measure into changing their votes or abstaining. As far as Doug was concerned his friend had earned the Medal he was receiving with blood and sweat.
No less proud was the husband of Mrs. Iva Ikuko Toguri Giancomo, Captain Anthony Giancomo of the U.S.N. [fictional character]. After the surrender Miss Toguri’s status was uncertain for a few months. But the moment General MacArthur took over as governing authority in Japan that status was changed to civilian POW. As far as the U.S. government was concerned Miss Toguri had been forced to act against her country by threats to her family in Japan and threats to her own person. There were those in the U.S. led by the rabid gossip columnist Walter Winchell who wanted Miss Toguri tried on charges of treason. However, Iva found she had several people on her side. Most notably the military governor of Japan, the President of the United States, and several thousand navy and marine personnel who had been stationed in the Pacific whose lives her single broadcast had saved by preventing the need for an invasion of Japan. Instead of being arrested when she arrived in San Francisco in February, 1946 she was swept up by several recently returned veterans of the Pacific war and carried on their shoulders through downtown San Francisco in a makeshift parade. When interviewed later one of the veterans would say, “If it hadn’t been for her I probably would have died on the beaches when we landed on Kyushu.”
Among those who met Iva in the parade was a naval captain, Anthony Giancomo. Anthony like thousands of others had listened to Iva’s broadcasts as “Tokyo Rose.” Now he was one of those who carried her aloft and later would be among a dozen men asking her to join him for dinner. He always believed it was the luck of a card draw that made him the lucky fellow for that night. Nevertheless that evening started a relationship that would last for the next 45 years. Anthony and Iva would be married in August, 1946 and would go on to have five wonderful children.
For both Jonathan and Iva the next few years would be busy indeed. Both would find themselves tapped by Hollywood to relate their stories of their time in Japan and their parts in ending the war. The rather over-dramatized film Escape from Tokyo would portray a much fictionalized account of Jonathan’s contrived escape (minus any mention of course of the real person responsible for that escape). A far better and more accurate (within limits of course) film would be Song of Tokyo Rose which portrayed the life of Iva up to the time she went to Japan and her part in the conspiracy.
Jonathan Wainwright would spend the few years remaining to him (he would die in 1953) speaking to veterans’ groups around the nation. He would receive many other honors before his death and President Taft would declare a national day of mourning to honor him when he died of a stroke on September 2, 1953.
Iva Giancomo would eventually settle in New York with her husband Anthony. She would eventually become a disk jockey and host her own “golden oldies,” show on the radio for eight years entitled the Gold Star Hour where she would play some of the wonderful old melodies for “her fellow former orphans.” She often would invite veterans on the show as guest disk jockeys. Like Wainwright she developed a deep love for “her fellow former orphans,” and was often invited to veterans’ reunions over the years. After her husband died in 1991 at the age of 74 she would go to live with one of her children in Cleveland, Ohio where she would pass away on September 26, 2006 surrounded by her children and grandchildren. At her funeral several veterans would carry her coffin to its final resting place and left several American flags and flowers to honor the woman whose courageous actions shortened the Pacific war.
I want to take some time now to back up and tie up some loose ends with some interludes which will try to tie up some loose ends in this story and give some ideas on the cultural impact of TTL. We'll begin with General Jonathan Wainwright and the woman most commonly identified as "Tokyo Rose".
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Interlude #1 – Homecomings
On November 6, 1946, the day following the 2nd anniversary of Japanese attack on Los Angeles, a special ceremony would take place at the White House. Two people, one a seasoned military officer, the other a middle aged woman of Japanese-American descent were to be honored by their country for the roles they had played in winning World War II. Those people were General Jonathan Wainwright and the recently wed Mrs. Iva Ikuko Toguri Giancomo.
Jonathan Wainwright would receive the Medal of Honor for his courage both in leading the final defense of the Philippines and in his daring escape from Japan with important information that led to the end of the war. Miss Toguri would receive the recently established Presidential Medal of Freedom for her part in transmitting needed information that led to the deaths of the War Cabinet and the final surrender of Japan. No one of course would know the full story; namely how the Emperor engineered Wainwright’s escape or how he had been the one to give Miss Toguri the needed information that would lead to the second bombing raid that tipped the political balance in Japan and allowed the Emperor to surrender. The true facts behind what actually happened would remain secret until 1997. Officially Wainwright and Toguri had been enlisted by a cabal of high level Japanese officials who were determined to end the war before their country was destroyed. Those officials were still serving in the Japanese government and so of course their names could not be revealed for many years.
With General Wainwright was his old friend, General Douglas MacArthur. MacArthur of course knew the truth behind the Japanese surrender and who had supplied the information that ended the war with Japan. He also knew the tremendous risks his friend had taken to deliver that information. MacArthur had led the drive to have Jonathan receive the Medal of Honor at the earliest possible time. When some congressmen tried to raise objections that General Wainwright was a “losing general,” Douglas had flown to Washington personally and virtually tongue-lashed several congressmen in their offices virtually shaming those who tried to block the measure into changing their votes or abstaining. As far as Doug was concerned his friend had earned the Medal he was receiving with blood and sweat.
No less proud was the husband of Mrs. Iva Ikuko Toguri Giancomo, Captain Anthony Giancomo of the U.S.N. [fictional character]. After the surrender Miss Toguri’s status was uncertain for a few months. But the moment General MacArthur took over as governing authority in Japan that status was changed to civilian POW. As far as the U.S. government was concerned Miss Toguri had been forced to act against her country by threats to her family in Japan and threats to her own person. There were those in the U.S. led by the rabid gossip columnist Walter Winchell who wanted Miss Toguri tried on charges of treason. However, Iva found she had several people on her side. Most notably the military governor of Japan, the President of the United States, and several thousand navy and marine personnel who had been stationed in the Pacific whose lives her single broadcast had saved by preventing the need for an invasion of Japan. Instead of being arrested when she arrived in San Francisco in February, 1946 she was swept up by several recently returned veterans of the Pacific war and carried on their shoulders through downtown San Francisco in a makeshift parade. When interviewed later one of the veterans would say, “If it hadn’t been for her I probably would have died on the beaches when we landed on Kyushu.”
Among those who met Iva in the parade was a naval captain, Anthony Giancomo. Anthony like thousands of others had listened to Iva’s broadcasts as “Tokyo Rose.” Now he was one of those who carried her aloft and later would be among a dozen men asking her to join him for dinner. He always believed it was the luck of a card draw that made him the lucky fellow for that night. Nevertheless that evening started a relationship that would last for the next 45 years. Anthony and Iva would be married in August, 1946 and would go on to have five wonderful children.
For both Jonathan and Iva the next few years would be busy indeed. Both would find themselves tapped by Hollywood to relate their stories of their time in Japan and their parts in ending the war. The rather over-dramatized film Escape from Tokyo would portray a much fictionalized account of Jonathan’s contrived escape (minus any mention of course of the real person responsible for that escape). A far better and more accurate (within limits of course) film would be Song of Tokyo Rose which portrayed the life of Iva up to the time she went to Japan and her part in the conspiracy.
Jonathan Wainwright would spend the few years remaining to him (he would die in 1953) speaking to veterans’ groups around the nation. He would receive many other honors before his death and President Taft would declare a national day of mourning to honor him when he died of a stroke on September 2, 1953.
Iva Giancomo would eventually settle in New York with her husband Anthony. She would eventually become a disk jockey and host her own “golden oldies,” show on the radio for eight years entitled the Gold Star Hour where she would play some of the wonderful old melodies for “her fellow former orphans.” She often would invite veterans on the show as guest disk jockeys. Like Wainwright she developed a deep love for “her fellow former orphans,” and was often invited to veterans’ reunions over the years. After her husband died in 1991 at the age of 74 she would go to live with one of her children in Cleveland, Ohio where she would pass away on September 26, 2006 surrounded by her children and grandchildren. At her funeral several veterans would carry her coffin to its final resting place and left several American flags and flowers to honor the woman whose courageous actions shortened the Pacific war.
I see what you did there.
Glad to see two of this timeline's arguably most important characters get the happy endings they deserve. I'm still curious as to the specifics of how the revelation of the Emperor's actions will play out, of course. Keep it up! (This is a really, really good timeline, have I mentioned that?)
Geon, something that I thought of the other day. Based on the fact that the US needed a large response to a medical emergency that required the use of military medical resources, the majority of which were probably military medics, there may be an earlier implementation of a true Emergency Medical Services program, leading to earlier EMTs and Paramedics than OTL by a couple of decades. The emphasis might be different than OTL. In OTL, the first emphasis was trauma, due to the new interstate system. Because of the more medical nature of the attack, the early emphasis for this EMS system might be more medical, with trauma added later as the need becomes more apparent.
Torqumada
Torqumada
I'm loving these postwar stories. Great to know Tokyo Rose ITTL was a heroine, remembered 61 years after the surrender.
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I'm loving these postwar stories. Great to know Tokyo Rose ITTL was a heroine, remembered 71 years after the surrender.
Umm... that should be 61 years. 71 years would be 2016.
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