HMS Hermes rebuild, South Africa 1941-42

Hi all, OK suitably enlightened about forum rules, I’d like to continue the discussion about a potential rebuild for HMS Hermes 95 in 1941. See https://www.alternatehistory.com/forum/threads/hms-hermes-95-reasonable-interwar-rebuild.423856/ for some details of possible rebuilds

She arrived at Simonstown, South Africa for a refit, and although I have no details as to what the refit was, I’d say an overhaul of her engines, boilers cleaned out and bottom scrapped would have been highly likely. She made Simonstown on the 19th November 1941, was in the Selbourne Dry dock from 6th December to 23rd January 1942, and completed her sea trials by 31st January.

Given the short time span for refit, and the recognition that she was an old ship that was going to be used on secondary tasks, and resources available are limited, what I propose could have happened was the following. The tripod mast and fire command post are removed, along with all six 5.5-inch guns. This reduces topside weight, accepting any surface threat will realistically be dealt with by her escorts, or own aircraft.

The three 4-inch Mk V guns are removed from the flight deck, and are mounted on extended sponsions, allowing them to use their 80-degree elevation, where the 5.5’s were, along with another three 4-inch guns, shipped in from the UK. They will use the same magazines as the 5.5-inch did, abet with some modification. Four new sponsions, one either side forward of the first 4-inch gun, and another one either side, astern of the rear 4-inch guns are built. These each are given a single 2-pdr Pom-Pom gun.

A single mast replaces the tripod, and a Type 286P radar set, brought out by HMS Repulse, on her way to Singapore, is fitted to provide air and surface search capability. Two 284 AA gunnery control radar sets are also installed to provide separate port and starboard gun control with the HACS.

Moving onto aircraft capabilities, seven outriggers, two before the bridge, three after and two opposite, are installed. Aviation fuel is increased from 8,000 to 13,000 imperial gallons, at the cost of slightly reducing bunker fuel. This would allow a deployment of a maximum of 20 aircraft, 12 Swordfish and 8 Martlet Mk II (with folding wings)

The ship would remain in Indian Ocean waters, and be used for escorting convoys, hunting raiders, as part of a task force, or deployed to the Med. Now onto the questions.

Does Selbourne dry dock have the infrastructure to remove the weighty tripod and control room, and also lift out the 5.5-inch guns, which look like they will be difficult to get out. Is she also capable of installing a new mast and building gun sponsions?

What would be a realistic time frame for all this work to be done?

How does fire control work, can we have to HACS, one for each side?

Can she carry so many outriggers, do the two on the port side, opposite the island, inhibit flying operations.

Regards
Fatboy Coxy
 
This certainly sounds doable to me, though my expertise is limited. The biggest issue is going to be political as what you're describing probably would double the time of the refit at least (probably triple). To do that in the face of the Japanese attack would be very difficult.

That being said, if Churchill is convinced to be more cautious with Force Z and the Indomitable doesnt run into problems like it did in OTL, a strong taskforce in Ceylon might provide the refit with the political breathing room it needs to happen.

Upon looking at your proposal again, I'm not sure it makes military sense to put that much into an ancient second line carrier. Even with the improvements you describe, I cant see the RN sending her into the Mediterranean unless they're totally screwed. If all the Hermes is doing is convoy and anti-sub work in the Indian Ocean, she doesn't need a substantial refit. The additional dockyard time, radar, and AA armament should probably go to frontline vessels.
 

Deleted member 94680

Plans were made in 1937 to replace Hermes's three single 4-inch guns with two twin 4-inch anti-aircraft guns, one forward and another aft of the island, as well as two octuple 2-pounder mounts. A single High-Angle Control System would have been fitted to control these guns, but the dockyard was overwhelmed with other work and couldn't begin to design the changes until July 1938. They were scheduled to be installed between September and December 1939, but the beginning of the war intervened and nothing was done. The ship's petrol storage was to be increased to 13,000 imperial gallons (59,000 l; 16,000 US gal) in April 1940, but this also does not seem to have occurred. Wiki page on Hermes

Looking at the refit of Eagle during WWII your best bet is an adjustment to the anti-air defences and maybe a better radar suite.
 
I could see the RN sending Hermes into the Mediterranean, heck Argus participated in Club Runs and OP TORCH and I would argue she was a less capable ship overall.
 
I could see the RN sending Hermes into the Mediterranean, heck Argus participated in Club Runs and OP TORCH and I would argue she was a less capable ship overall.

The Mediterranean! did I say that?:confounded: er I did!

Any career in the Med is likely to be short, especially if we send her there in 1942, with the Luftwaffe arriving! I think I read somewhere she was sunk after something like 30 plus bomb hits from the Japanese dive bombers, but the third bomb was enough, the rest were just overkill, target practice for the aviators. The little AA improvement I've given her, isn't going to stop a good Stuka attack. And as for torpedoes, she might survive one, but never two.

However, as you pointed out Argus went there, as did Eagle, neither first rate, so I guess she would be found on a Malta Convoy run, coming from Alexandria.
 
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