HMS EAGLE in the Falklands

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SsgtC

SsgtC

Banned
haider najib said:
Question american aircraft carriers are massive how the hell do they operate with allied ports and etc it seems only america can fit these beast itsnt that a design flaw that these carriers cant use allied ports?
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It's not the port facilities that's usually the problem. The problem is that there's rarely a dry dock that can fit them. I watched a show on this a few years ago. The Navy actually has a plan to put a carrier on a modified lifting vessel (I think the same one that brought the Cole home) and use the dry dock facilities here.
 
haider najib

haider najib

SsgtC said:
The Navy actually has a plan to put a carrier on a modified lifting vessel (I think the same one that brought the Cole home) and use the dry dock facilities here.
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Sorry do you mean non american ports? Such as europe or are you talking about american ports.
 
Athelstane

Athelstane

If the Navy was willing to build entire classes of carriers they couldn't fit through the Panama Canal, forgoing NATO dry docks would be a quite bearable price.
 
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Not James Stockdale

Not James Stockdale

As far as drydocks capable of fitting a Nimitz, there are only a few options available in Europe. Odense has a dock that is long and wide enough but may not be deep enough. The best options would probably be Chantiers in Saint-Nazaire, the Damen (formerly Sobrena) dock in Brest, or the Damen Verolme yard in Rotterdam. There are a lot of big docks in Germany, but they don't have the depth. The Fincantieri yard in Palermo may have a dock wide enough for a Nimitz-class.

In Asia, there's absolutely no shortage of huge drydocks. The dock at the Mitsubishi yard in Nagasaki is a kilometer long and a hundred meters wide. Additionally, considering the fact that Dry Dock 12 at Newport News is 9.5 meters deep, we may not need a full 11 meter dock for a Nimitz-class.
 

King_Arthur

Just caught up. This tl is amazing and I would so love to be Air PWO on the Eagle or Invincible (to a lesser extent).

To contribute to the discussion, the Royal Navy has literally no need for a humongous Murica Machine. In a perfect world we would have 2 updated Audaciouses at the size of the Liz and 3 STOVL carriers at about 30 or 35,000 tons to operate as commando carriers. Also in an ideal world, the Fleet Carriers would have Hornets and Super Hornets (or perhaps the Rafale?) and the Commando Carriers would have choppers and Harrier III (which would be capable of breaking the speed of sound).
 

voodoomaster

Seeing as my father was one of the fighter controllers on HMS Invincible and later PWO on HMS Ark Royal i love this timeline.

To add to earlier comments this certainly does mean that the butterflies are waving here as the power and capability of a large carrier such as Eagle is confirmed but also it will change the US and NATO opinions of the royal navy and their fixed wing aircraft.
It certainly means that HMS Ocean is butterflied away as with the royal navy stock riding high by 1990 the royal navy will have two larger carriers and 3 invincible class.

As for the design there is one ready to go that would only need updating and adapting to royal navy needs.
The CVV project or medium aircraft carrier, in effect a slightly enlarged de gaulle class but conventionally powered.

Keep up the good work
 

kaymay

Great update as usual it would be good to see two new full size carriers and the three invincible class. I could see the Typhoon fighter being adapted for them. That would be amazing. The three invincible could be used in ASW and support for a Marine task group a bit like the Americans do.
 

King_Arthur

Also I would recommend Ark Royal 2.0 becoming a LPD as the RN surely missed that capability between the scrapping of Albion and Bulwark and the building of Ocean.
 

Hammerbolt

kaymay said:
Great update as usual it would be good to see two new full size carriers and the three invincible class. I could see the Typhoon fighter being adapted for them. That would be amazing. The three invincible could be used in ASW and support for a Marine task group a bit like the Americans do.
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The UK's treasury would have to grow massively for this! :D

At least try to save some cash by using either the F-18 or the Rafale! And 3 Invencibles? Maybe stick with 3 Ocean-class? They could operate Harriers, afaik.
 

King_Arthur

Hammerbolt said:
The UK's treasury would have to grow massively for this! :D

At least try to save some cash by using either the F-18 or the Rafale! And 3 Invencibles? Maybe stick with 3 Ocean-class? They could operate Harriers, afaik.
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Um we had 3 invincibles it otl. Also what Ocean-class?
 

Hammerbolt

King_Arthur said:
Um we had 3 invincibles it otl. Also what Ocean-class?
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You didn't have 3 and 2 CVs. And I was refering to the HMS Ocean (yeah, not class, sorry). That ship was pretty good value for money, imho, thanks to being built mostly to comercial standards. It could do with a speed boost (25knots?), maybe the ramp, but other than that...
 

Nick P

Donor
Put HMS Eagle into a short refit/repair and plan to retire her by 1990 along with HMS Hermes. Build a pair of conventional carriers as a replacement. We still need to replace HMS Fearless and Intrepid with the likes of HMS Albion and Bulwark and Ocean - could these use the same basic hull as the new carriers?

When the new carriers arrive we can sell the Invincible-class (India, Australia, Thailand, Brazil etc) or convert them to helicopter carriers. I think converting them to LPDs is a step too far.
 

Zheng He

Not James Stockdale said:
As far as drydocks capable of fitting a Nimitz, there are only a few options available in Europe. Odense has a dock that is long and wide enough but may not be deep enough. The best options would probably be Chantiers in Saint-Nazaire, the Damen (formerly Sobrena) dock in Brest, or the Damen Verolme yard in Rotterdam. There are a lot of big docks in Germany, but they don't have the depth. The Fincantieri yard in Palermo may have a dock wide enough for a Nimitz-class.

In Asia, there's absolutely no shortage of huge drydocks. The dock at the Mitsubishi yard in Nagasaki is a kilometer long and a hundred meters wide. Additionally, considering the fact that Dry Dock 12 at Newport News is 9.5 meters deep, we may not need a full 11 meter dock for a Nimitz-class.
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For the Nimitz class carriers it is not just dry docks, depending on how far you want to go with maintenance you have to have the facilities to service nuclear reactors as well.
 
Not James Stockdale

Not James Stockdale

Zheng He said:
For the Nimitz class carriers it is not just dry docks, depending on how far you want to go with maintenance you have to have the facilities to service nuclear reactors as well.
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The only places in the world where this can happen are Newport News and Bremerton.
King_Arthur said:
Sorry, I meant LHD not LP
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I don't think you can combine the hull form for a well dock with 30+ knots for fixed wing carrier ops. You also can't try to jam a dock into an existing warship hull, especially an Invincible.
 
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