Discussion in 'Alternate History Discussion: After 1900' started by flasheart, Jul 14, 2018.
Replace Super Etendard and Exocet with Sukhoi Su-24 and AS-11 Kilter.
Su-24? Hmm. Possibly. Kh-58? Not a chance. It's not even been introduced in Soviet service as of May '82.
The AS-11 was deployed in 1982, so there's no way Argentina would get it. And I very much doubt the USSR would sell them such an aicraft, considering they didn't even sell it to Warsaw Pact allies; afaik only Syria got some, in the late 80s.
Edit: isn't the AS-11 an anti-radar missile?
Now we are going soviet client state route . What about a brace of Badgers and KSR-5 missiles . 1000nm radius of action from Mainland and a 130 mile missile range . Escorts would be difficult but some interesting possibilities can occur .
Wikipedia fails (I always believe that info is worth what you paid for it) to tell us what ASM the Su-24 carried before the AS-11 (there was an ASM variant, Wiki says). So, let's assume the Su-24 comes with whatever ASM the Su-24 carried in 1980
I don't think the US would stand near strategic bombers in the Americas.
Argentine navy with Kilos would be interesting.
Considering they couldn't even keep what they had operational, I don't see them don't any better with Kilos.
An interesting possibility like sinking a KSR-5 into the side of an American flagged cargo ship by mistake? I Agree.
How the hell are the soviets going to give thr argentines this the brits made an exclusion zone they will stop it and you bet if america finds about argentines getting soviet weapons, they will try and stop it or give britain full access to uncle sam shed. Also they could arm chile ans they would love that.
Israel flew weapons to Peru which were forwarded to Argentina, there is some speculation that Israel supplied Gabriel AS!s to Argentina during the war.
The same way the Argentinians had British warships and aircraft, they bought them before hostilities were thought likely.
The assumption was that Argentina is a Soviet client state, and thus has access to Soviet kit throughout the 1970s.
Weapons were sent through Libya via Brazil including SA7 SAMs machine guns and mortars, this is reported to be a Soviet operation.
As folks said, the Kilter wasn't in service, and i'm not sure about the SU-24, its a damn expensive bit of kit (and is pretty much brand new) so if they were exported, expect to pay through the nose for them. If the Argentinians were offered Soviet kit it might be something more commonly available like the MiG-23/27 combo
This last page shows the issue with trying to ram in extra PODs to a Time Line rather than proceeding organically from an initial one. If the Argentines were Soviet client state the Royal Navy would have a know out of the area surface fleet threat and thus would likely retain a fleet carrier or the US would implicitly guarantee the safety of the Falklands and other useful British bases against pro-Soviet threats.
The Argentines risked an armed move because they were a US ally and assumed they were better buds than the British. The Americans were supposed to tell the Limeys to play nice. A pro-Soviet Junta would know it was going to get stomped on.
Were not a lot of these assumptions because of a VERY pro Argentinian US Diplomat who was more for building a friendly SouthAm block against the Soviets and the Junta took this as the US being okay with any action they took (Considering they were happily turning a blind eye to all the horrid shit the Junta was already doing).
John Nott v Robin Day
Jean Kirkpatrick, US Ambassador to the UN.
That's her! Yeah IIRC she was very much a case of 'not saying I support Argentina buuuuuuuuuuuut...' and it was in the name of geopolitics as she viewed it a better thing to build a strong SouthAm block against the Soviets or any Soviet influence and was quite okay with the Argentine invasion. But then again this was pretty much par for the course in the US Politics in regards to South America from the 50's onwards "Who cares how shitty they are to their own people, as long as they ain't red, and if they are..well I'm sure folks at Langley can see to that." or "Unfriendly to us..in this Hemosphere? here let us introduce you to the Marines..several thousand of them, all at once..."
So I'd assume that if somehow the Argies were Soviet friends you'd hear Washington's REEEEEEEEEEEEEEE from orbit and there would probably be a LOT of pressure to get rid of the Junta.
Al Haig was Secretary of State and he was very pro-British and from what I understand he put Kirkpatrick in her place.
There's this film
For real. As I mentioned, the US would have told the British exactly one thing and that would have been "You're welcome to use anything you need from us." If not having already removed the Argies themselves at some prior date, probably about the point the commies started throwing nuns out of helicopters.
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