Hitlergrad

Discussion in 'Alternate History Discussion: After 1900' started by Aloha, Nov 8, 2019.

  1. Aloha that b with the deadass fresh ass timbs, homie

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    Hey guys.
    Not really sure where to start so I guess I'll start by saying that this is my first TL (I might be rusty because of this and history only recently being an interest of mine, so apologies for that), which will be about Hitler becoming the leader of the Soviet Union instead of Nazi Germany. I don't think anyone else has entertained that idea before and I thought it was pretty interesting, and I've said before that I'd do this TL so I thought I would give it a shot.

    Inspired by TLs such as Rise of Joseph Stahl, Our Struggle, and Iron Eagle.
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2019 at 7:50 PM
  2. OurSacredWar Meri of Ethiopia

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    Interesting concept. Watching!
     
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  3. IntellectuallyHonestRhino Well-Known Member

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    Good luck on your first TL! It's a daunting task, but it's always worth taking a shot and charging through! :)
     
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  4. Michel Van Well-Known Member

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    how end up the Little annoying Austrian in USSR ?!
     
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  5. Aloha that b with the deadass fresh ass timbs, homie

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    We'll just wait and see ;)
    Before I start I just want to say a few things:
    • Ideas that other people have will be much appreciated and I'll even take some of them into consideration. In fact, I'll recommend that; don't be afraid to put ideas out there.
    • I'll probably be a bit slow with updates on this TL, but that does not mean that I've finished it or abandoned it or that I've died etc. It's simply because I'm often busy with issues in real life and I just generally take my time when writing. I might or might not start in the next holidays.
    • Although this has been inspired by many TLs, this one isn't going to be written the same as the ones I've been inspired by. It's not really a story or from other people's perspectives more than it is a narrative, perhaps a biography in the sense. This also will probably not be a very long one.
    • This should be obvious, but anyone who uses this TL to post racist, anti-Semitic, and other bigoted posts will be reported. Hitler is still very much a villain and I do not advocate fascism, Stalinism or Hitler in anyway. This was created simply for the purpose of an interesting alternate world.
      • This TL will contain material that may be sensitive to some viewers.
    Feel free to ask questions and give constructive criticism as the TL goes on. Hope you have fun reading (in the future)!
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2019
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  6. Sir Oswald Yeet

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    I actually had an idea like this, but didn't know how to write it out. Good luck!
     
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  7. Aloha that b with the deadass fresh ass timbs, homie

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    Honestly even I don't think this would be too easy for me to write (I have a basic idea though). Actually really nervous lol. Thanks!
     
  8. TimTurner Cartoon Phanatic

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    @Aloha what happens to Volga Germans ITTL?
     
  9. riki2048ksp New Member

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    Maybe some POD about Hitler-Trotskij-Stalin-Tito all living in Vienna in 1913 or Hitler getting sent to and defecting from the Eastern front in WWI? His political views should still be tweakable at those times
     
  10. Kurt_Steiner That's a years supply!

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    Interesting...
     
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  11. riki2048ksp New Member

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    Then, let me point out one tiny detail: the Russian language uses its letter for the hard "g" sound in place of the letter "h" in loanwords since that tongue lacks an aspirated consonant (the sound "h" usually makes). So Hitler in Cyrillic would be Адольф Гитлер, which would then be romanized back in Adolf Gitler, as he would be remembered
     
  12. novussa Well-Known Member

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    Hitler with rescources of the soviet union Well shit europé is screwed.
     
  13. Viralworld Éirí Amach an Ghealach Donor

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    I have no idea what sort of shenanigans would land Hitler as General Secretary of the CP, but I think it’s safe to say his ideology and ideas would be have to be pretty far from those IOTL to rise in the Party during Lenin and the power struggle between Stalin and Trotsky - one cant exactly espouse a fascistic Nordic ultranationalism when in charge of a communist and largely Slavic country!
     
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  14. Viralworld Éirí Amach an Ghealach Donor

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    This is how I would go about it too - Hitler’s unit winds up in the Eastern Front, he defects to the Bolsheviks after Brest-Litovsk is signed and joins a militia in the RSFSR, then at the end of the Civil War he settles in the Volga German ASSR and during Korenizatsiya he becomes a local official and climbs to Party boss (also without a WW2 as we know it, the Volga Germans might not even be uprooted like they were). From there he could have a rise like Khrushchev and work under the Stalinist system (his populist skills IOTL could be an asset to Stalin and so he gains favor) and see how things go from there. The politics of the USSR would be interesting without a Nazi Germany and that’s something that would be interesting to deal with in this timeline - there are many possible scenarios for Гитлер to work with here and whatever is chosen will affect his rise. The lack of devastation in the ranks of the Party without a Nazi invasion (and the deaths of tens of millions of Soviet citizens) or even without the Great Purge will certainly create some interesting butterflies and characters that we didn’t see in real life. Stiff competition for a would be General Secretary Hitler, but I’m sure he’ll find his way.

    If you want to, you could even have Hitler either participate in the Bavarian Soviet or Spartacist uprisings and flee East in the aftermath, or say he doesn’t join the German Army but remains in his native Austria and eventually ends up in red Ukraine or serving Béla Kun’s Hungarian Soviet Republic and working his way into the CCCP when it goes to hell.

    I think the scenario is doable although of course a Hitler that is a Civil War veteran and Bolshevik apparatchik will be politically pretty different from OTL - I will follow with interest!
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2019
  15. TimTurner Cartoon Phanatic

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    this will be a great timeline.
     
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  16. Aloha that b with the deadass fresh ass timbs, homie

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    Thanks guys, for the kind words and great ideas!
    I'm afraid I have to add to the second point on my second post here that my computer (had it for quite a long time) has been acting like a real son of a bitch lately and I'm thinking of getting a new one. For that reason, it may be delayed, but I'll see what I can do.
     
  17. Calcaterra Stuff About Politics (& Sports) Donor

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    Don't you think that Stalin would have had Hitler purged after a while? Stalin was notoriously bad at public speaking and could best be described as a skilled political operator specializing in bureaucracy, so I wouldn't imagine having Hitler, who is everything Stalin is with the addition of being one of the greatest orators of all time (I hate Hitler, but from what's said about his people skills, he could have sold gloves to a man without arms), would be preferable to Stalin.
     
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  18. Viralworld Éirí Amach an Ghealach Donor

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    Well, if anything the Hitler we know was politically shrewd and an hardcore opportunist - I don't imagine he would try to outshine the Georgian while he lived. Likely he would do what every other official did after the Old Bolsheviks and the officer corps were liquidated: keep your head down and play your part. Stalin needed new men after the Purges and I think that actually opens a spot for a talented Bolshevik organizer like ITTL Hitler to rise through the ranks (much like Georgy Zhukov after the General Staff had been decimated) - provided he keeps a lower profile than Stalin anyway. Although this does beg the question: without Nazi Germany posing an immediate threat to the Soviet Union and maybe Kirov's murder being butterflied (if we follow J. Arch Getty and co's argument that Kirov's murder was authentic and not staged by Stalin to justify the purges), do we still see the Great Purges of IOTL? It's entirely possible that the extreme paranoia and fear of counter-revolutionary infiltration Stalin dreamed up doesn't manifest itself in massive purges without Hitler and a few other contingent events. I think that the Purges could clear the way for the General Secretary to take notice of an effective apparatchik in the Volga ASSR like Hitler, but at the same time he could be struck by it if he isn't careful. No purges means he has less of a chance of being taken out back and shot for being a Trotskyist or Right Oppositionist, but it might be harder for ITTL Hitler to penetrate the clique of Old Bolsheviks hanging around Stalin and makes his chances of achieving the seat of General Secretary more difficult without heavy political maneuvering.

    Of course, the timeline could go the route of having an excellent orator like Hitler become just prominent enough by 1925-1926 to make a difference in the power struggle against Stalin, but a former German soldier and outsider rising so quickly up the ranks of the Bolshevik Party that he could lend enough weight to overthrow Stalin is unlikely.
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2019
  19. Aloha that b with the deadass fresh ass timbs, homie

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    Mostly correct and I don't want to give too much away, but he won't be as hard on fascism as you might think ;)
     
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  20. Resurgam Teacher and Writer of Things

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    Honestly, my biggest question... and nitpick... is how Hitler becomes leader of the Soviet Union while (assumed) still being Hitler (or Stalin), but the premise interesting enough that I'd like to see what you do with it.