Heron invents the steam engine
- Thread starter Hobelhouse
- Start date
In Greece payment of rawmen equals that of hoplites and they all were free men.
Our evidence for the practice is zero. Galleys were exclusively warships, and service in the fleets, even as rowers, was not permitted to slaves and only exceptionally to freedmen. Slave-oared galleys (to be more precise, prisoner-rowed, with these people being either unsold captives or convicts) are a late medieval innovation.
Yes. The demand for better iron to improve the steam pumps will result in the introduction of steam bellows. This will lead to improvements in metallurgy and alloy-making. These improvements will lead to better-quality tools (a possible export to Asia?).
What next?
I just had another thought - with people gradually and gradually being dispossessed by steam machinery, would one of the emperers perhaps start a resettlement/ colonization program to the frontier? Perhaps more native Romans would enlist in the army, and Rome would not be forced to rely on 'barbarians' to fill out its ranks.
Slave or convict rowers only became general practice in the 16th century, as the "price revolution" made free oarsmen too expensive.
At one point in the Pelopponesian War, IIRC, the Athenians were badly shorthanded, and offered slaves their freedom if they would volunteer as rowers. The promise was honored, so these were freedman rowers, not slave rowers. Ancient merchant galleys may have had slave rowers - but the entire crew was likely to be the shipowner's slaves, including the skipper.
-- Rick
Maybe you could get the gradual formation of Northern european German kingdoms and the subsequent influx of Roman immigrants seeks to homestead on their relatively undeveloped land.
How much speed/momentum could these steam engines develop at low technology levels? I know, it depends on the pressure of the combustion chamber, but i know very little of how could the romans make one. Probably out of bronze, but that isn't nearly as strong as steel.
Were there bells in the roman empire? Yes, large church-like bells. I remember that when cannons were first developed, their building was left to the bell makers, and something similar could happen to combustion chambers.
Because i'm thinking that the most appealing use for the steam engine would be militar. Sea warfare consisted mostly on ramming and boarding the enemy ships, right? If in the first stages of the steam engine, it could be used to power some smaller vessels with the typical spear-shaped bow at great speeds, it might become unbeatable on the sea. If not cracking the enemy ship in half, at the very least destroy their hull in the flotation line and sink them.
Kind of like manned, steam-powered torpedos
Were there bells in the roman empire? Yes, large church-like bells. I remember that when cannons were first developed, their building was left to the bell makers, and something similar could happen to combustion chambers.
Because i'm thinking that the most appealing use for the steam engine would be militar. Sea warfare consisted mostly on ramming and boarding the enemy ships, right? If in the first stages of the steam engine, it could be used to power some smaller vessels with the typical spear-shaped bow at great speeds, it might become unbeatable on the sea. If not cracking the enemy ship in half, at the very least destroy their hull in the flotation line and sink them.
Kind of like manned, steam-powered torpedos
Well, in fact, Heron's engine is more in the line of a rocket than a proper engine that follows a thermodynamic cycle.
I think it has value, though, as putting together, in the same place: heat, vapor and rotatory movement.
It doesn't have to be a ship... there are some tasks that demanded rotatory movements... think of mills.
That also makes me think, in the roman times, there wasn't much in the regard of actual coal, right? Didn't they use mostly charcoal? That might not be the best for actually obtaining power out of a steam engine.
Edit (so as not to bump the thread):
Ugh sorry, i apologize, i didn't realize it was that old.
I know necroing is bad, i'm new to this forum, but not new to forums in general... i was just browsing around and doing searches and got this result and i didn't even check the date.
Sorry!
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A word to the wise:
Don't necro 6 year old threads. You are new here, and don't know our traditions. Fine.
But if you do this again you'll probably get a warning from a moderator.
I'm not sure precisely where 'necromancy' starts. I tend to think of it as 1 year. I've seen someone else say 6 months. but certainly anything older than that is out.
If you want to comment on something old, start a new thread and say "Gee, I saw this old thread [give link] about X. It would be neat because...". That's the best way to handle it on this forum I think. If you give the link, people can go look themselves.
It's still not capable of producing much in the way of power, which is kind of relevant.