Henry Tudor, Heretic and Father of Kings

Discussion in 'Alternate History Discussion: Before 1900' started by Cate13, Nov 4, 2018.

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  1. Threadmarks: Section Fourteen - Early 1530s

    Cate13 Well-Known Member

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    “The fifteen thirties began with two important Tudor marriages. The first was the marriage of Princess Mary Tudor, daughter of King Arthur and Queen Catherine (not to be confused with Queen Maria, daughter of King Henry VII and Queen Elizabeth), to Ferdinand I Habsburg, King of the Romans and Archduke of Austria.

    The second, arranged by King Henri III, was the marriage of Prince Henry Tudor to Sybylle Von der Mark, Princess of Cleves. King Henri hoped that a new bride would bring his father out of his depression, as well as provide his younger half-sisters with a mother.”
    Matheo Henrikson, “The 1500’s Was A Crazy Century, and It Was Mostly the Tudors’ Fault”​


    “… decided to open the movie with the marriage of King James V to Princess Louise of France. We thought it would be especially potent to see that not even on his wedding was James V free from the shadow his younger brother casts. (Ewan McGregor) really captures the rambunctious headless energy of a young Prince Alexander. This isn’t a young man who has set out to eclipse his brother at every turn, but a boy who can’t help but be just a little too extreme.

    Interviewer: And James V?

    Director: Robert (Carlyle) is an amazing King James V: in turns frustrated, envious, and sometimes adoring of his younger brother. Rob really gets into his head.

    Interviewer: And what about the decision to end the movie before…”
    Interview with the Director of Prince Alexander Stewart (1993)​


    “The young Princess was so beautiful in her bridal gown. She spoke to me in my own tongue with nary an accent. Mama, I am so excited to serve as one of her ladies.”
    Letter from a young Austria noblewoman to her mother​


    “Prince Henry has suffered a deep melancholy these past years. He continues to spend all of his time with the Ladies Elizabeth and Eleanor. I have spoken to him about Your Majesty’s wish that he remarries. He expressed no opinion beyond obedience to his King’s will. I am deeply concerned for ….”
    Fragment of a letter from Prince Henry’s secretary to King Henri III​


    “It is as if my husband is a sleep, even when he walks about. I feel as if there is a great gulf that separates us two. The only time I see that there might be a living man behind my husband is when he reads from the Bible to his daughters.”
    Journal Entry of Sybelle of Cleves from early in her marriage to Prince Henry ​
     
  2. Threadmarks: Section Fifteen - 1535

    Cate13 Well-Known Member

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    “With his father mired in grief, King Henri III stepped to the forefront of the movement that would soon be called the Awakening. Many of the rulers of Europe assumed that King Henri would slowly back away from the association with the reformers. Instead the young Tudor King continued to participate in Awakening: communicating with Martin Luthor and Frederick III and offering sanctuary to the French Huguenots.

    It was the continued practices of King Henri III that prompted Pope Clement VII to take action. The young king of Aragon, Ferdinand III was encouraged to claim the title of King of Navarre by dint of his mother Germaine of Foix’s claim. The forces of Aragon would muster late in the year of fifteen thirty-four and war would break out early in fifteen thirty-five.

    Navarre was initially caught unware and lost several small towns to the advancing forces of Navarre. King Henri III would respond quickly himself and his youngest brother, the only one in Navarre, would march out with Army of Navarre. Several battles would follow as the two armies clashed.

    While King Henri III made an admirable showing, the Aragoneese forces continued to advance. Then, in what must have felt like the death nell of Navarre, King Henri III was injured in battle.”
    Patrick Wendal, “The First Navarrese Tudor King”​


    “My lady wife has brought me news of the injury of my dear Henri. Oh my boy, my wonderful son. You have always been all that could be desired in a son, God please don’t take him from me like thou took Anne.

    Hast your face been turned from me, Oh Lord in Heaven? Is this a punishment? If my path is just, why are we left alone to face the forces that would have us turn from your Holy Word?
    The Entry in the Journal of Prince Henry right before the entry that would come to be known as the Declaration of the Awakening. ​


    “The Declaration of the Awakening in its earliest conception is found in the Journal of Prince Henry. Later, Prince Henry would edit and publish it as almost a manifesto. He recounts his melancholia he suffered after the death of his wife Anne, and the comfort found in the Bible. Then he speaks out against those would, in his words, ‘veil and conceal the Word of God behind the language of pagans.’ Prince Henry narrates how he received word of his eldest son’s injury, of turning to God in prayer. Then…”
    Lise Marie Peters, “The Awakening of Europe”​


    “I feel like I am Awakening from a long sleep or throwing off great chains. None stands between me and the Lord of Heaven. I read His word, I obey His will, not the will of some foreign prince who styles himself the vicar of Christ. And His will is that Navarre is freed to follow Him.”
    The most well-known line of the Declaration of the Awakening and what gave the Awakening its name.​


    “The Declaration of The Awakening is perhaps the most honest account of depression found in the Renaissance. Prince Henry pulls no punches as he describes the deep darkness that he found himself mired in after the death of his wife and the anxiety he suffered in defying the pope. In this essay I will describe how the Declaration shaped the discussion of mental health in the fifteen, sixteen, and seventeen hundreds.”
    “Mental Health in Europe” Theisis Project by doctoral candidate William Matteson ​


    “While Navarre would not formally break with the Catholic Church until several months after the end of the second War for the Soul of Navarre, the Declaration was seen by many as the start of true Protestantism in Navarre. ”
    Isaac Laab, “Henry Tudor, Heretic and Father of Kings”​
     
  3. Threadmarks: Section Sixteen - 1536

    Cate13 Well-Known Member

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    “While Prince Henry entrance into the Second War for the Soul of Navarre was heralded as the turning point, Prince Henry actually contributed very little martial assistance to the war. He would only participate in two battles, one of which he lost. His return to the politics of Navarre did serve as a great moral booster to the army, many of the leaders having served with Prince Henry in the First War for the Soul of Navarre. But Prince Henry’s greatest contribution to the war effort would be the publication of the Declaration of Awakening.

    The Declaration of Awakening inspired the forces of Navarre: sections were set to music as hymns or marching tunes [1] and it was often read in its entirety directly before a battle. While the Declaration was strongly national, speaking of the need for Navarre to throw off the yoke of foreign princes, many other protestants identified strongly with ideas encapsulated in the Declaration. While no foreign assistance would arrive in time to affect the War, the Declaration did much to bind Navarre to the cause of protestants.”
    Isaac Laab, “Henry Tudor, Heretic and Father of Kings” ​

    [1] In fact the National Anthem of Navarre currently include two verses that borrow strongly from the Declaration. The inclusion of these verses is currently being debated in the Cortes.


    “The Navaresse fight as if possessed by demons, we have already lost the land gained and we continue to retreat chased by these singing chanting soldiers.”
    Letter from an Aragonese frontline officer to his commanding officer​


    “One year and three months after the forces of Aragon marched into Navarre, all Aragonese forces had been expelled from Navarre and territories that hadn’t been part of Navarre for quite a while had been taken by the advancing Navarese forces. Young King Ferdinand and his mother, Germaine of Foix, would both renounce their claim upon the Crown of Navarre. The Second War for the Soul of Navarre would end in an even stronger win for Navarre than the First War for the Soul of Navarre did.”
    Matheo Henrikson, “The 1500’s Was A Crazy Century, and It Was Mostly the Tudors’ Fault”​


    “King Henri III Tudor would recover from his wounds in time to oversee the Treaty of Vitoria where he officially declared Navarre a protestant country.”
    Patrick Wendal, “The First Navarrese Tudor King”​
     
  4. InternetholicLi New Member

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    Mar 29, 2018
    I don't have much historical knowledge about this timeline to comment anything historywise about it, but I absolutely have to let you know that I love your Alternate History story. If I didn't know that this is an Alternate History Timeline, I would have thought that it was a brilliantly written real autobiography or history book of Henry Tudor.
     
  5. Cate13 Well-Known Member

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    Oct 25, 2016
    Oh, wow! Thank you so much! I’m flattered that you like it that much.
     
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  6. Threadmarks: Section Seventeen - Mid 1530s

    Cate13 Well-Known Member

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    Oct 25, 2016
    “The marriage of Infanta Maria Aviz of Portugal to Prince Francis Valois, Duke of Brittany occurred late in the year of fifteen thirty-five. It was said that there was never a handsomer couple. The new Dauphine, now called Marie, greatly resembled her mother excepting the dark hair she inherited from her father and Dauphin Francis was considered one of the finest princes of Christendom.

    The young couple appeared quite happy with each other. They would spend rather large of time in Brittany early in fifteen thirty-six but would return to court at the request of King Francis. It would be there, shortly after a ride through the countryside, that the Dauphin would collapse after drinking from a glass of wine.

    Prince Francis III Valois, Duke of Brittany, would die later that night. The Dowager Duchess of Brittany would accuse the new Dauphin, Prince Henri, of poisoning her husband. In an effort to avoid the growing scandal, Marie of Portugal would be sent back to Brittany where it was hoped that the familiar surrounding would allow her to compose herself.

    Once she reached Brittany, it was discovered that she was with child. The country waited wondering whether Marie would deliver a boy, the new heir to France, or a girl.”
    Karen Talls, “Marie of Portugal”​



    “The Infanta has delivered a daughter whom she has named Marie Francoise. The child bears strong resemblance to her father and shows all signs of living.”
    Letter from the midwife of King​


    “The French Court was surprised when the young Marie Francoise Valois was named Duchess of Brittany, the successor of her father. It was known that King Francis I had intended to unite Brittany with France. In all probability the appointment was less for the young Marie Francoise and more for her mother. It appeared that in exchange for Marie Francoise inheriting Brittany, Marie of Portugal would cease accusing the new Dauphin of poisoning her husband. In all likelihood, King Francis believed he could betroth the future son of the new Dauphin to Marie Francoise and so unite Brittany with France in that way.”
    Matheo Henrikson, “The 1500’s Was A Crazy Century, and It Was Mostly the Tudors’ Fault”​
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2018
  7. Tyler96 Well-Known Member

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    Adelaide, South Australia
    Is Henri of France still married to Catherine de Medici?
     
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  8. Cate13 Well-Known Member

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    Oct 25, 2016
    Nope, Catherine de Medici ended up somewhere else. I have plans for her. Still trying to figure out who Henri Valois will marry.

    Anybody have any suggestions?
     
  9. The Professor Pontifex Collegii Vexillographiariorum

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    Collegium Vexillarum
    Did you mean "excepting" not "accepting"?
    And you have a "King Francoise" in there too.
     
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  10. Tyler96 Well-Known Member

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    Adelaide, South Australia
    Something to do with a longer-lived Cesare Borgia shaking things up in Italy?

    When would Henri be getting married ITTL- would it be before or after his brother's death in 1536? Because obviously after that date his value as a marital partner goes up as he's now the Dauphin rather than a mere second son.
     
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  11. FalconHonour Well-Known Member

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    Nov 16, 2018
    Let's face it, if Henri is still in love with Diane De Poitiers, he's going to resist getting married all he can. I could see him agreeing to marry a child: one of the Emperor's infant daughters, perhaps? That way he can be seen to be doing his duty by France, but he's still got years to mess around with his mistress...
     
  12. Cate13 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for catching it :)
     
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  13. FalconHonour Well-Known Member

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    Nov 16, 2018
    "Rather large amounts of time", methinks. ;) And marrying little Marie of Brittany to Henri's hypothetical son? A, they're going to need a dispensation and B, Henri had better hurry up and marry then, or else the age gap between the would-be spouses will become insurmountable. Especially if little Marie is the elder. :)
     
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  14. Cate13 Well-Known Member

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    Oct 25, 2016
    A little bit, but more due to someone visiting Italy who OTL never made it to Italy as far as I can determine.

    Henri Valois will be getting married after he becomes the Dauphin.
     
  15. Cate13 Well-Known Member

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    Oct 25, 2016
    Eh, OTL Diane encouraged Henri to sleep with his wife for heirs. She’d probably be able to talk him into marrying. As long as he doesn’t get the stupid idea to marry Diane or something.
     
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  16. Cate13 Well-Known Member

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    Just cause King Francis hopes to marry his future grandson to Marie Francoise doesn’t meant it’s gonna happen. ;) best laid plans of mice and men and all that.
     
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  17. FalconHonour Well-Known Member

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    Nov 16, 2018
    This is true. As is Diane being able to talk Henri into marrying. But he's still going to be reluctant... I could still see the whole process taking rather longer than Francois would like!
     
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  18. Threadmarks: Section Eighteen - Late 1530s

    Cate13 Well-Known Member

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    Oct 25, 2016
    “Kathryn Tudor was described by her contemporaries in a variety of different ways: her allies described her as striking and handsome, her enemies called her mannish. What we do know is that Kathryn Tudor was tall, easily six feet one, possibly taller, with the famous Tudor hair [1] and her grandmother Catharine of Navarre’s strong nose.

    While this combination of characteristics could have left Kathryn Tudor feeling awkward and unsure, by all accounts the young Tudor princess was self-assured, confident, and sometimes brash.”
    Elizabeth Tudor, Duchess of Calais, “Kathryn Tudor”​

    [1] Due to a plethora a Tudors with red hair, Tudor hair means red hair, much like Titian hair means red hair in our timeline.


    “Would that the Princess (Kathryn) had been born a man, she would make the finest Prince. Truly sometimes she seems like a prince instead of princess. She strides through crowds as if she was unhampered by skirts, does not glide like other ladies. And so tall, the good princess is taller than all in court except perhaps her father.”
    Letter from a lady in the service of Princess Kathryn to her family​


    “Catherine of Aragon and her eldest granddaughter did not get along. Later in life, Queen Catherine would claim that Kathryn Tudor was not her granddaughter, but a devil wearing her granddaughter’s face. For, she said, one of her line could not be so completely heretical.”
    Matheo Henrikson, “The 1500’s Was A Crazy Century, and It Was Mostly the Tudors’ Fault”​


    "Queen Catherine spent much of the fifteen thirties shoring up her only son’s position. She would broker the betrothal of John of Wales with Maria Habsburg, daughter of the Holy Roman Emperor and Isabella of Portugal, sister of King John III of Portugal. Catherine would also insist that Prince John travel to Wales and begin governing there. This, more than anything else, is what strengthened John of Wales’s position.

    While of dubious health, John Tudor of Wales was said to be quite charismatic and due to his governance of Wales, most of the south of England was strongly supportive of King Arthur’s only son.”
    Walter Owns, “The Tragedy of Catherine of Aragon”​
     
  19. Cate13 Well-Known Member

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    And the longer it takes, the older King Francis gets and then it might be up to Henri to arrange the betrothal, and Henri doesn't like his brother's widow. She has this habit of accusing him of murdering her husband.
     
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  20. Threadmarks: Section Nineteen - 1539 & 1540

    Cate13 Well-Known Member

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    Oct 25, 2016
    “Lady Elizabeth Tudor, daughter of Prince Henry and Anne Boleyn, would travel to England to visit her mother’s family at age thirteen. It is widely thought that the main purpose of her visit was to smuggle English Bibles into England. It would be shortly after Lady Elizabeth’s arrival that the Tudor Bible began to appear in England.

    Lady Elizabeth would stay to become one of the chief lady-in-waiting’s of her cousin, Princess Kathryn Tudor. The two would grow extremely close over the next few years, likely bonding over shared religious beliefs, sharing the enmity of Queen Catherine, and their common Tudor hair.”
    A. E. Bell, “The Early Tudor Years” ​

    [1] Due to a plethora a Tudors with red hair, Tudor hair means red hair, much like Titian hair means red hair in our timeline.


    “Late in the Fall of 1539, King Arthur traveled to Wales to visit Prince John of Wales. There in what is one of the more ironic historical anecdotes, King Arthur and his son contracted the sweat. The same deadly disease Arthur Tudor had escaped almost 40 years earlier.

    The news that both King Arthur and Prince John of Wales were ill sent the court into a tizzy. For, if both passed, the next in line was Princess Kathryn Tudor. While the 17-year-old princess was the eldest daughter of King Arthur’s eldest daughter, she was also known to consort with Awakeners, and Awakeners were in the minority in England at the time.”
    Matheo Henrikson, “The 1500’s Was A Crazy Century, and It Was Mostly the Tudors’ Fault”​


    “The tension continued to rise between the two court factions, Queen Catherine’s faction and Princess Kathryn’s faction. After several days of no news, Prince Francis announced his intent to travel to Wales to see for himself the state of his Uncle and Nephew. It was then that things reached a breaking point.

    Prince Francis and his traveling companions were waylaid but what appeared to be highway robbers. In the ensuing fight, Prince Francis was killed.

    As this news reached the Royal Court, Princess Kathryn accused her grandmother of assassinating her father. There was scuffle between Princess Kathryn and her ladies and the royal guards, and Princess Kathryn was escorted to her rooms and guards were posted outside.

    It was then that the news officially reached the Royal Court, both King Arthur and Prince John were dead.”
    Everett Jacobs, “Catherine and Kathryn” ​


    “It seems odd to me that the Spanish Queen would secure the young Princess as such, unless the Spaniard believed King Arthur and the Princes of Wales to be dead. If they are both dead, we must act quickly to secure the safety and future of our new Queen.”
    Letter from Thomas Cromwell, Earl of Essex to his son Gregory Cromwell​
     
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