This happened when I met my ex-husband, same surname (not Tudor, but apparently quite common) and from opposite ends of the country 🤷🏻♂️
Henry Tudor, Heretic and Father of Kings
- Thread starter Cate13
- Start date
This happened when I met my ex-husband, same surname (not Tudor, but apparently quite common) and from opposite ends of the country 🤷🏻♂️
It's not quite that common, only a little more than Smith or Jones in America. Glad you liked it!
Myself and my mother are the genealogists in the family, so anytime a cousin runs into an unknown individual with the right surname, once of us gets a call or text asking how we might be related.
Epilogue Thirty-Two - Kathryn and Margaret
AN: Just a short one today
<MARY DOUGHERTY walks through portrait gallery>
MARY DOUGHERTY: Perhaps the most famous Tudor relationship is that of Queen Kathryn and her only child, Margaret of Wales.
Selections from the documentary The Tudor Family
“Everyone knows Kathryn Tudor had a bad relationship with her daughter: everyone learns in in history class, and it was a major plot line in season seven of the Tudors. And then thing is, it was….
If you stop during the adolescence of Margaret of Wales.
But so many people have problems with their parents during their teen years. If you only look at the childhood Margaret of Wales when considering Kathryn Tudor and Margaret’s relationship, you only get half the picture. Throughout the last decade of Kathryn’s reign, things improved between Kathryn Tudor and Margaret of Wales immensely.
Sure, outside factors made it easier for them to get along: distance and a lessening of the power imbalance. But what really mattered was they both made an effort to improve the relationship.
And that’s what indicates a good relationship, not where it is, but where it’s going.”
Selections from Prospectus for Ellen Carstairs, Historical Psychology Doctoral Student
“Perhaps the most surprysing thing of all is that my mother the queene is funny. Has she always been thus? All my memories of her from childhood feature noght but volume and movement, as close to a storm as a living person can get. But now I find cheer and a quick wit. Has she gentled or I tempered?”
Selection of a letter from Princess Margaret of Wales to her cousin, Duchess of Suffolk
<MARY DOUGHERTY walks through portrait gallery>
MARY DOUGHERTY: Perhaps the most famous Tudor relationship is that of Queen Kathryn and her only child, Margaret of Wales.
Selections from the documentary The Tudor Family
“Everyone knows Kathryn Tudor had a bad relationship with her daughter: everyone learns in in history class, and it was a major plot line in season seven of the Tudors. And then thing is, it was….
If you stop during the adolescence of Margaret of Wales.
But so many people have problems with their parents during their teen years. If you only look at the childhood Margaret of Wales when considering Kathryn Tudor and Margaret’s relationship, you only get half the picture. Throughout the last decade of Kathryn’s reign, things improved between Kathryn Tudor and Margaret of Wales immensely.
Sure, outside factors made it easier for them to get along: distance and a lessening of the power imbalance. But what really mattered was they both made an effort to improve the relationship.
And that’s what indicates a good relationship, not where it is, but where it’s going.”
Selections from Prospectus for Ellen Carstairs, Historical Psychology Doctoral Student
“Perhaps the most surprysing thing of all is that my mother the queene is funny. Has she always been thus? All my memories of her from childhood feature noght but volume and movement, as close to a storm as a living person can get. But now I find cheer and a quick wit. Has she gentled or I tempered?”
Selection of a letter from Princess Margaret of Wales to her cousin, Duchess of Suffolk
but next weekend should be the last epilogue and then I’ll turn my attention to Thousand Days.
Epilogue the Last
AN: Some of you may recognize this and notice the missing epilogue eight. I just wasn't able to write something I liked better, so I ended up just moving it here to close out the timeline. Thanks so much for all y'all participation! I'll be taking a bit off to get ahead on Thousand Days, and then I'll start posting for that again.
“What it is about Prince Henry Tudor that so captures the imagination? Historians, novelists, songwriters, and others have studied, celebrated, and honored Prince Henry for the past five hundred years.
Yes, he was an impressive man; he founded one of our world’s major religions, authored many a treatise, and composed sundry songs. But he isn’t alone in these accomplishments. There are others who founded a religion, and the authors of treatises and songs are unnumbered. So, what is it about Prince Henry that so captures the imagination?
Perhaps more so than any other historical figure, Prince Henry is real. So often the important figures of history come to us through a lens of hero worship or distain; we never truly know who they were.
But thanks to his own tremendous candor, we know who Prince Henry was. He told us in his own writings and communications; he was extremely self-absorbed, struggling with mental illness, a devoted father, and a dedicated husband. And the more we pry into Prince Henry’s history the clearer this picture is.
We have absolutely no indication that he ever cheated on any of his wives. No rumors, no accusations, nothing. In a time when men were held to no standards of fidelity this is extraordinary. And while his success as a father may be up for some debate—his relationship with Duke John Tudor for example—no one can argue that he tried.
In a century of outstanding individuals, Prince Henry doesn’t stand out because he was necessarily better—though some will argue that he was—but because he was real.”
“Sometimes I wonder how my life would be different without Prince Henry. It’s an odd thought and one that most people probably don’t think about, but he has an immense impact on my life. I have manic depressive disorder which is the mental illness most commonly attributed to Prince Henry.
For the longest time people with mental illness were called crazy or possessed. Treatments were torture at best. But Prince Henry’s candidness regarding his struggles with mental illness completely changed how Europe regarded mental illness. There is no telling the stigma that might have continued to surround mental illness without his influence.
Because of one man’s complete commitment to oversharing absolutely everything, my life is better.”
“What it is about Prince Henry Tudor that so captures the imagination? Historians, novelists, songwriters, and others have studied, celebrated, and honored Prince Henry for the past five hundred years.
Yes, he was an impressive man; he founded one of our world’s major religions, authored many a treatise, and composed sundry songs. But he isn’t alone in these accomplishments. There are others who founded a religion, and the authors of treatises and songs are unnumbered. So, what is it about Prince Henry that so captures the imagination?
Perhaps more so than any other historical figure, Prince Henry is real. So often the important figures of history come to us through a lens of hero worship or distain; we never truly know who they were.
But thanks to his own tremendous candor, we know who Prince Henry was. He told us in his own writings and communications; he was extremely self-absorbed, struggling with mental illness, a devoted father, and a dedicated husband. And the more we pry into Prince Henry’s history the clearer this picture is.
We have absolutely no indication that he ever cheated on any of his wives. No rumors, no accusations, nothing. In a time when men were held to no standards of fidelity this is extraordinary. And while his success as a father may be up for some debate—his relationship with Duke John Tudor for example—no one can argue that he tried.
In a century of outstanding individuals, Prince Henry doesn’t stand out because he was necessarily better—though some will argue that he was—but because he was real.”
Rachel Rowell, “Father of the Reawakening, and a Good Father”
“Sometimes I wonder how my life would be different without Prince Henry. It’s an odd thought and one that most people probably don’t think about, but he has an immense impact on my life. I have manic depressive disorder which is the mental illness most commonly attributed to Prince Henry.
For the longest time people with mental illness were called crazy or possessed. Treatments were torture at best. But Prince Henry’s candidness regarding his struggles with mental illness completely changed how Europe regarded mental illness. There is no telling the stigma that might have continued to surround mental illness without his influence.
Because of one man’s complete commitment to oversharing absolutely everything, my life is better.”
Facebook Post by Mattie Naeson on the 440th anniversary of Prince Henry’s death
It was great following this TL and seeing your take on Henry VIII's life with the love, loss, and moving on that entails.
I appreciate the additional posts that explore the world and fleshes out the impact that Henry and his descendents had on England and the world.
I wish you luck on your next project.
I appreciate the additional posts that explore the world and fleshes out the impact that Henry and his descendents had on England and the world.
I wish you luck on your next project.
Unless Cate decided to start again and rewrite this is the link
Queen of Five Thousand Days
The Tiny Tudors Challenge We all know that things could have been very different for Henry VIII and Anne Boleyn if Elizabeth had had a twin brother. What about if she was one of a higher order of multiple births? Write a story where, on the 7th of September 1533, Anne gives birth to...
www.alternatehistory.com
I was just linked to this... and I feel a little bad... but this was an amazing ride and I read it in less than a day... Now I'm off to go read the next one! If it's even HALF as amazing as this one, I'll consider the time well spent.
Here are some fan-made lists of the monarchs of Ireland-Scotland, England, and Navarre I've created:
Ireland-Scotland (1488‘-)
Houses of Stuart (1488-1685), O'Leon (1685-1826), Medigee (1826-'97), Tudor (1897-1903), FitzGerald (1903-)
1488-1513: James IV (1473-1513), King of Scotland
1513-1542: James V (1512-1542)
1542-1586: James VI (1539-1586), King of Ireland
1586-1617: James VII (1568-1617)
1617-1649: Robert IV (1585-1649)
1649-1673: David III (1609-1673)
1673-1685: James VIII (1660-1685), grandson of prior
1685-1737: Alexander IV (1655-1737), half-brother-in-law of prior
1737-1744: Charles I (1671-1744)
1744-1752: Margaret II (1697-1752)
1752-1826: Bridget (1737-1826), granddaughter of prior
1826-1828: Alexander V (1756-1828)
1828-1844: David IV (1790-1844)
1844-1850: Robert V (1799-1850), brother of prior
1850-1897: James IX (1847-1897), grandson of prior
1897-1903: Margaret III (1866-1903), cousin of prior
1903-1922: Charles II (1885-1922)
1922-1991: Alexander VI (1903-1991), brother of prior
1991-2020: Robert VI (1920-2020)
Since 2020: David V (b. 1974), grandson of prior
England (1485-1879)
Houses of Tudor (1485-1703), Wettin (1703-'84), and FritzTudor (1784-1879)
1485-1521: Henry VII (1457-1521)
1521-1540: Arthur I (1486-1540)
1540-1590: Kathryn I (1523-1590), granddaughter of prior
1542-1560: Alexander I (1513-1560), co-monarch and husband
1590-1601: Margaret I (1561-1601) & Edmund I (b. 1560)
1601-1653: Alexander II (1578-1653)
1653-1674: Henry VIII (1620-1674), grandson of prior
1674-1689: Arthur II (1647-1689), great-grandson of prior
1689-1703: Anne I (1643-1703), cousin of prior
1703-1711: John Alexander (1689-1711), nephew of prior
1711-1759: Edmund II (1709-1759)
1759-1761: Alexander III (1727-1761)
1761-1765: Henry IX (1711-1765), uncle of prior
1765-1772: Edward VI (1732-1772)
1772-1784: Anne II (1740-1784), sister of prior
1784-1803: Henry X (1762-1803)
1803-1810: Henry XI (1796-1810)
1810-1866: Kathryn II (1784-1866), aunt of prior
1866-1879: Alexander IV (1829-1912), grandson of prior
1879: Monarchy abolished
Navarre (1483-)
Houses of Foix (1483-1517), Albret (1484-1503), and Tudor (1503-)
1483-1517: Catherine (1468-1517)
1484-1503: John III (1469-1503), co-monarch and husband
1503-1517: Henri/Henry II (1491-1579), co-monarch and husband
1517-1580: Henri/Henry III (1504-1580)
1580-1591: Henri/Henry IV (1522-1591)
1591-1599: Anne I (1559-1599)
1599-1632: Henri/Henry V (1559-1632), cousin of prior
1632-1654: John IV, grandson of prior
1654-1659: Charles V
1659-1683: Vacant
1683-1710: Jeanne III
1710-1729: John V
1729-1737: Henri/Henry VI, brother of prior
1737-1785: Eleanor II, niece of prior
1785-1791: Charles VI (b. 1773), grandson of prior
1791-1810: Vacant
1810-1840: Henri/Henry VII, nephew of prior
1840-1873: Elizabeth
1873-1888: Anne II
1888-1913: John VI
1913-1979: Henri/Henry VIII
1979-1996: Jeanne IV
Since 1996: Anne III (b. 1973), granddaughter of prior
Ireland-Scotland (1488‘-)
Houses of Stuart (1488-1685), O'Leon (1685-1826), Medigee (1826-'97), Tudor (1897-1903), FitzGerald (1903-)
1488-1513: James IV (1473-1513), King of Scotland
1513-1542: James V (1512-1542)
1542-1586: James VI (1539-1586), King of Ireland
1586-1617: James VII (1568-1617)
1617-1649: Robert IV (1585-1649)
1649-1673: David III (1609-1673)
1673-1685: James VIII (1660-1685), grandson of prior
1685-1737: Alexander IV (1655-1737), half-brother-in-law of prior
1737-1744: Charles I (1671-1744)
1744-1752: Margaret II (1697-1752)
1752-1826: Bridget (1737-1826), granddaughter of prior
1826-1828: Alexander V (1756-1828)
1828-1844: David IV (1790-1844)
1844-1850: Robert V (1799-1850), brother of prior
1850-1897: James IX (1847-1897), grandson of prior
1897-1903: Margaret III (1866-1903), cousin of prior
1903-1922: Charles II (1885-1922)
1922-1991: Alexander VI (1903-1991), brother of prior
1991-2020: Robert VI (1920-2020)
Since 2020: David V (b. 1974), grandson of prior
England (1485-1879)
Houses of Tudor (1485-1703), Wettin (1703-'84), and FritzTudor (1784-1879)
1485-1521: Henry VII (1457-1521)
1521-1540: Arthur I (1486-1540)
1540-1590: Kathryn I (1523-1590), granddaughter of prior
1542-1560: Alexander I (1513-1560), co-monarch and husband
1590-1601: Margaret I (1561-1601) & Edmund I (b. 1560)
1601-1653: Alexander II (1578-1653)
1653-1674: Henry VIII (1620-1674), grandson of prior
1674-1689: Arthur II (1647-1689), great-grandson of prior
1689-1703: Anne I (1643-1703), cousin of prior
1703-1711: John Alexander (1689-1711), nephew of prior
1711-1759: Edmund II (1709-1759)
1759-1761: Alexander III (1727-1761)
1761-1765: Henry IX (1711-1765), uncle of prior
1765-1772: Edward VI (1732-1772)
1772-1784: Anne II (1740-1784), sister of prior
1784-1803: Henry X (1762-1803)
1803-1810: Henry XI (1796-1810)
1810-1866: Kathryn II (1784-1866), aunt of prior
1866-1879: Alexander IV (1829-1912), grandson of prior
1879: Monarchy abolished
Navarre (1483-)
Houses of Foix (1483-1517), Albret (1484-1503), and Tudor (1503-)
1483-1517: Catherine (1468-1517)
1484-1503: John III (1469-1503), co-monarch and husband
1503-1517: Henri/Henry II (1491-1579), co-monarch and husband
1517-1580: Henri/Henry III (1504-1580)
1580-1591: Henri/Henry IV (1522-1591)
1591-1599: Anne I (1559-1599)
1599-1632: Henri/Henry V (1559-1632), cousin of prior
1632-1654: John IV, grandson of prior
1654-1659: Charles V
1659-1683: Vacant
1683-1710: Jeanne III
1710-1729: John V
1729-1737: Henri/Henry VI, brother of prior
1737-1785: Eleanor II, niece of prior
1785-1791: Charles VI (b. 1773), grandson of prior
1791-1810: Vacant
1810-1840: Henri/Henry VII, nephew of prior
1840-1873: Elizabeth
1873-1888: Anne II
1888-1913: John VI
1913-1979: Henri/Henry VIII
1979-1996: Jeanne IV
Since 1996: Anne III (b. 1973), granddaughter of prior
Prince John Michael Tudor
More lists are coming soon.
Thanks!
Here are more fan-made lists, this time for the Iberian monarchs besides Navarre. Unlike the earlier lists, these ones feature some guesswork based on information from the timeline itself. Feedback involving filling the gaps is appreciated.
Aragon (1479-)
House of Trastamara (1479-?)
1479-1516: Ferdinand V & II (1452-1516), King of Castile since 1475
1516-A. 1580: Ferdinand III (b. 1513)
Castile (1474-1903)
Houses of Trastamara (1474-1555), and Habsburg (1506-1XXX)
1474-1504: Isabella I (1451-1504)
1475-1505: Ferdinand V & II (1452-1516), co-monarch and husband, King of Aragon after 1479
1504-1555: Joanna (1479-1555)
1506: Philip I (1478-1506)
1516-1560: Charles V (1500-1560)
1560-A. 1580: Philip II (b. 1527)
D. 1610: Maximillion I (b. 1570)
1610-1903: Kings
1903: Monarchy abolished
Portugal (1495-1903)
House of Aviz (1495-1903)
1495-1521: Manuel I (1469-1521)
1521-1559: Joao/John III (1502-1559)
1559-1577: John Emmanuel I (1521-1577)
1577-A. 1580: Sebastian I (b. 1543)
D. 16XX: Emmanuel I (b. 1571)
16XX-B. 1875: Kings, including Joao Leander I
B. 1875-1903: Joao Leander II (1821-1910)
1903: Monarchy abolished
It would be more helpful if you or someone else drew up a family tree for the Tudors.
There are family trees at various points in the thread, check the Thread marks but beware spoilers