Harold wins at Hastings but not at Stamford Bridge

The Norman army sets sail a month earlier and lands in Pevensey on the 28th of August. Two weeks later King Harold the Second of England meets Duke William of Normandy just outside of Hastings on September the 14th and achieves a decisive victory. Duke William is dead and his army limps back to Normandy leaving his son Robert as Duke. Just four days later Harald Hardrada lands at Scarborough first defeating the Northern Earls Edwin and Morcar at the Battle of Fulford then marching on York. Upon his sacking of York, he is confronted at Stamford Bridge by a new English army led by King Harold. The result is a massacre and the English are soundly beaten, Harold retreats tail between his legs back to London whilst Harald stakes a claim to the whole of Northumbria and parts of northern Mercia calling it Danelaw.

I'd be interested to see what people regarding whether this may or may not have been plausible? If so the effects are huge, the Vikings have a strong foothold in Britain after years of raiding, Saxon Britain still lives on in Wessex and the Norman war machine is massively weakened. The potential then spirals almost out of control, does King Philip of France try to overthrow the weakened Norman dukedom, does the English dream live on in King Harold, how far does Harald Hardrada take his conquest and finally and most interesting for me is what happens to Williams son Robert. He was a major part of the First Crusade and so following this timeline he may never accompany it or depending on events the Crusade may never happen at all.
 
If Harold wins he'll take over the whole of England just like the Danes had a couple hundred years earlier, there is no need to reestablish the Danelaw since he can just be King of England.
 
The most recent example of a separate North would be Eric Bloodaxe's independent York-based state.

If Harold Godwinson is defeated and able to retire on London, then Hardrada COULD declare himself a Northern king, but more likely would press the attack, especially if his army remains strong. Tostig for one is going to be pressing for that option, as only the elimination of his brother secures his safety

But even if Hardrada takes London, and Harold and the other Godwinsons are either slain or forced into exile, this doesn't mean that Norwegian rule has any necessary long-term survival. As well as any scions of the Godwinsons, there is also Edgar aetheling and his claim to the crown of England
 
The most recent example of a separate North would be Eric Bloodaxe's independent York-based state.

If Harold Godwinson is defeated and able to retire on London, then Hardrada COULD declare himself a Northern king, but more likely would press the attack, especially if his army remains strong. Tostig for one is going to be pressing for that option, as only the elimination of his brother secures his safety

But even if Hardrada takes London, and Harold and the other Godwinsons are either slain or forced into exile, this doesn't mean that Norwegian rule has any necessary long-term survival. As well as any scions of the Godwinsons, there is also Edgar aetheling and his claim to the crown of England
Not to mention that Herald is very old and his death could start problems.
 
If Harold wins he'll take over the whole of England just like the Danes had a couple hundred years earlier, there is no need to reestablish the Danelaw since he can just be King of England.
The key difference here is Harold surviving. That means more fighting, and Harold probably wins.
If Harald wins at Stamford Bridge BUT Harold survives then Harald would not become King of England that quickly I would say it would take some years of infighting. Also, the Vikings very rarely through history campaigned during winter so it would be interesting to see what would happen over the course of the winter especially with the Saxons on one side and the Scots on the other.
 
The most recent example of a separate North would be Eric Bloodaxe's independent York-based state.

If Harold Godwinson is defeated and able to retire on London, then Hardrada COULD declare himself a Northern king, but more likely would press the attack, especially if his army remains strong. Tostig for one is going to be pressing for that option, as only the elimination of his brother secures his safety

But even if Hardrada takes London, and Harold and the other Godwinsons are either slain or forced into exile, this doesn't mean that Norwegian rule has any necessary long-term survival. As well as any scions of the Godwinsons, there is also Edgar aetheling and his claim to the crown of England
I think leaders like Hereward alongside the Godwinsons and a united Wessex, East Anglia and Mercia it would be a bit of a struggle not to mention the Canmores in Scotland. I think Harald would struggle to keep hold of his land without further reinforcements from Norway unless Tostig managed to gather enough support for himself that Haralds army was supplemented by an English contingent but this then adds the further problem of if Tostig does become King of Wessex overthrowing his half brother then where does that leave him and Harald.
 
I think Harald would struggle to keep hold of his land without further reinforcements from Norway unless Tostig managed to gather enough support for himself that Haralds army was supplemented by an English contingent but this then adds the further problem of if Tostig does become King of Wessex overthrowing his half brother then where does that leave him and Harald.
Idk if Harald had plans for it, but he could have tostig be a subordinate underking with him as overlord
 
Idk if Harald had plans for it, but he could have tostig be a subordinate underking with him as overlord
We'll never know to be fair but Tostig could have rebelled against his new Norwegian overlord with the help of some English Earls
 
Top