Hapsburg version of WAFFEN SS ?

Is there any way that, after 1848, the Hapsburgs could've created their own proto-version of the WAFFEN SS foreign legions for the purposes of cementing unity amongst the disparate ethnic groups of the A-H Empire ?
 
Is there any way that, after 1848, the Hapsburgs could've created their own proto-version of the WAFFEN SS foreign legions for the purposes of cementing unity amongst the disparate ethnic groups of the A-H Empire ?

Was the waffen SS goal to unite disparate ethnic groups? Yeah maybe unite them in the gas chamber :mad:. Is this a joke? I'm pretty sure they only let in "racially reliable" groups join up.

However if you are talking about uniting ethnic groups via military service, the Habsburgs practiced it throughout their entire history. They took it to a fault right up until WWI when commanders couldn't even communicate with eachother because one spoke Czech and the other spoke Romanian.
 
First of all, no. Not a Waffen SS. The Waffen SS foreign volunteers were based on occupation, 20th century (ww2 class) propaganda (way more effective than any earlier propaganda) and fear and hatred of communism. Since there is no such enemy, the whole concept fails. Perhaps if you beef the Ottomans and have them try to convert the Balaksn you can get a christian legion or something, but it would still be catholic, excluding any protestants.

Secondly, the Austrians did raisxe ethnic units at a regular basis. The racial tensions in the Austrian part of the Empire were actually no big issue. It was the Hungarians that treated their minorities more or less like this (mainly Slovaks, Croats, Serbs and Romanians).
 
Was the waffen SS goal to unite disparate ethnic groups? Yeah maybe unite them in the gas chamber :mad:. Is this a joke? I'm pretty sure they only let in "racially reliable" groups join up.

In terms of the common war effort, dude- yes the WAFFEN SS, as I understand it, did aim to have men from different ethnic backgrounds fight together against the common Bolshevik enemy- from reading a book on the different Waffen SS divs yest, many of the SS national legions actually combined volunteers from different countries together- such as Dutchmen grouped with Latvians & Lithuanians or Albanians alongside Croats & Bosniaks etc in the same div- for the purposes of attempting to form unified anti-Communist forces. As for the "racially reliable" criterion, sure that was a big issue for Himmler at the outset- but when the war started to go against the Nazis, they had to drop their standards somewhat to allow for more recruits regardless of racial background- such as with the Russian & Ukrainian volunteers who'd previously been considered UNTERMENSCH.
 
Well it seems kind of weird. I am not used to hearing the word Waffen SS and "uniting disparate ethnic groups" in the same sentence. But I will take your word for it, since WWII isn't my specialty by any means.

The Habsburgs barely united their armies by ideology though. Like many other pre-modern armies pay, and before that feudal duties drove people to fight.
 

Tellus

Banned
The Waffen SS was all about recruiting "good stock" from occupied areas, and put the idea of a united Europe high in their propaganda arsenal, and made a point to recruit enthusiastic volunteers everywhere. The idea of Europe's common battle against communism drew quite a few volunteers, and the chivalry-inspired ideals of the corps was enticing as well. Its important to keep in mind that there wasn't this big stigma on anything SS back then yet, and also that the various parts of the SS were not all equally implicated in war crimes. There are enormous differences between say, the Waffen SS - essentially just a well-trained, all-volunteer, pan-european army - and say, the Eizengruppen.

Considering that the Waffen SS had korps from every European country, including volunteers from neutral nations and even a few British P.O.Ws who turned coat to fight the Soviets, there are still people today well outside the far-right who argue that the group can still claim to have been the first modern "European", rather than national, fighting force.
 
The Waffen SS was all about recruiting "good stock" from occupied areas, and put the idea of a united Europe high in their propaganda arsenal, and made a point to recruit enthusiastic volunteers everywhere. The idea of Europe's common battle against communism drew quite a few volunteers, and the chivalry-inspired ideals of the corps was enticing as well. Its important to keep in mind that there wasn't this big stigma on anything SS back then yet, and also that the various parts of the SS were not all equally implicated in war crimes. There are enormous differences between say, the Waffen SS - essentially just a well-trained, all-volunteer, pan-european army - and say, the Eizengruppen.

Considering that the Waffen SS had korps from every European country, including volunteers from neutral nations and even a few British P.O.Ws who turned coat to fight the Soviets, there are still people today well outside the far-right who argue that the group can still claim to have been the first modern "European", rather than national, fighting force.

Would you please look sites like http://www.axishistory.com/ and read!
Waffen SS as well as regular Heer units were implicated in warcrimes. Not all, but.

"good stock" well yes medical requirements were rigid initally but as already mentioned deteriorated as the war and casualties wore on.
 
differences between say, the Waffen SS - essentially just a well-trained, all-volunteer, pan-european army - and .

1) Waffen SS was NOT an all volunteer force.

2) Training varied a lot during the war.

3) Waffen SS were responsible for a lot of war crimes, in both East and West front ( Oradour, for exemple )
 
The Waffen SS stopped being elite, well-trained and all volunteer in early 1942.

Early, the Waffen SS units were treated only to surplus arms and equipment, such the Heer rejected. They used Masuer Schnellfeuer pistols instead of submachine guns, they used Czech MGs and rifles and had little heavy equipment.

By the time the Waffen SS to 4 divisions were elite, most of the Waffen SS were force-conscripted militia with little training, motivation and equipment.
 
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