Sure thing, dude ;)
Just create some sort of back story .. Might start during ww1 with the death of the emporer. Have Karl assassinated too or trip and break his head or simply abdicate the throne. Change the interwar period to make the Soviets even less trusted. Nazis are still the really bad guys but set it up that the west if at all possible is happy to see the Germans and Russians bloody each other, but with the coupe in Berlin and much more sane minds begging the west for mercy at all costs to contain and halt the red menece you might get some traction.
 
Completely impossible. Sorry.

Agreed.

With a POD this late, there just isn't much room to shift things that much. The problem isn't getting rid of Hitler early.

There is an outside chance, perhaps, if Stalin dies suddenly, either through accident, natural means, or assassination at the outset, and a massive power struggle ensues which stalls Soviet offensives in 1944. The borders of the Zones were decided in September 1944. If the Soviets are still involved in too much turmoil to send a representative, the question might be put off; and then, delays in resuming the offensive result in the Western Allies meeting up with them a little farther east.

But all this would really manage, at most, would be the success of Churchill's goal of a German eastern frontier on the Eastern Niesse, along with Stettin, since the Allies are sitting on more real estate. The Soviet occupation zone doesn't get Thuringia, but does get western Silesia. Poland ends up getting Lvov by way of compensation.

There's an even more outside chance of a southern German state being formed, which is joined to Austria. Churchill toyed with the idea. But it's not likely to come off.

But that's a far cry from what the OP is asking for.
 
Just create some sort of back story .. Might start during ww1 with the death of the emporer. Have Karl assassinated too or trip and break his head or simply abdicate the throne. Change the interwar period to make the Soviets even less trusted. Nazis are still the really bad guys but set it up that the west if at all possible is happy to see the Germans and Russians bloody each other, but with the coupe in Berlin and much more sane minds begging the west for mercy at all costs to contain and halt the red menece you might get some traction.
Yes I thought aboutsomthing like that...the problem is just one...and that is why I said that this challenge was a very tough one; let's put in this way...in 1989 I need to have a world looking EXACTLY like OTL, with the only exception of this enlargened and empowered Germany, ruled by an Habsburg. Now digging too deep, wich means going too long back in history, may butterfly away too many things :) ...but I will consider it
 
Agreed.

With a POD this late, there just isn't much room to shift things that much. The problem isn't getting rid of Hitler early.

There is an outside chance, perhaps, if Stalin dies suddenly, either through accident, natural means, or assassination at the outset, and a massive power struggle ensues which stalls Soviet offensives in 1944. The borders of the Zones were decided in September 1944. If the Soviets are still involved in too much turmoil to send a representative, the question might be put off; and then, delays in resuming the offensive result in the Western Allies meeting up with them a little farther east.

But all this would really manage, at most, would be the success of Churchill's goal of a German eastern frontier on the Eastern Niesse, along with Stettin, since the Allies are sitting on more real estate. The Soviet occupation zone doesn't get Thuringia, but does get western Silesia. Poland ends up getting Lvov by way of compensation.

There's an even more outside chance of a southern German state being formed, which is joined to Austria. Churchill toyed with the idea. But it's not likely to come off.

But that's a far cry from what the OP is asking for.
Yeah, I always liked the "sothern german state" idea...that would have been nice to see; frankly speaking I am one always wishing for Bavaria and Baden-Württemberg to secede from that useless Germany and join their austrian brethren in a glorious, nice, ad pictoresque "Southern Germany"...this provided that one gets to restore all those monarchies, of course...I am a staunch monarchist, unfortunatley, or to say better, a staunch "habsburgist" :)
 
Yeah, I always liked the "sothern german state" idea...that would have been nice to see; frankly speaking I am one always wishing for Bavaria and Baden-Württemberg to secede from that useless Germany and join their austrian brethren in a glorious, nice, ad pictoresque "Southern Germany"...this provided that one gets to restore all those monarchies, of course...I am a staunch monarchist, unfortunatley, or to say better, a staunch "habsburgist" :)

My family is from the Nuremberg area, and have a patent of imperial nobility from said Habsburg monarchs :)

It would be a different state run from Vienna instead of Berlin and hopefully more focused on Germans than on trying to bring lots of other groups who would be better served with their own nations into the fold. Austria Hungary simply wasn't manageable, now toss in the rest of Germany and it would be very unwieldy with lots of court drama for an HBO series
 
Yeah, I always liked the "sothern german state" idea...that would have been nice to see; frankly speaking I am one always wishing for Bavaria and Baden-Württemberg to secede from that useless Germany and join their austrian brethren in a glorious, nice, ad pictoresque "Southern Germany"...this provided that one gets to restore all those monarchies, of course...I am a staunch monarchist, unfortunatley, or to say better, a staunch "habsburgist" :)

I do sympathize. The Habsburgs don't look so bad compared to what came after them...

Otto von Habsburg of course floated the idea in the last months of the war of a Danubian Federation, which might encompass at least some of the old Austro-Hungarian lands. Churchill had some interest in the idea; but Stalin was deadset against it. And since he was occupying or soon to occupy much of the territory in question, it was a dead letter. This is one reason I say that the Soviets are the real obstacle here, not Hitler or the Nazis.

But even if Soviet advances are temporarily stalled, and the Allies manage to occupy all of Austria, most of Bohemia, and maybe even parts of Slovenia and Hungary, I think it's an uphill climb. There was still a lot of political opposition to the Habsburgs in Austria. I think there's really zero chance of Otto's Danubian monarchy (the Czechs won't buy in, regardless of whether they fall under communist rule), but maybe a small chance of a new Greater South German State (I'm not sure what you would call it...the Federation of the Danube?) that includes Bavaria and Baden-Wurtemburg; Stalin might not be so unhappy with a Germany further divided. Whether you could get Otto as, say, president of this federation is harder to say. In terms of culture, dialect and religion, of course, it's a state that makes more sense than West or East Germany really did, and might be more viable in the long run.

The best bet for the Habsburgs to get their throne is to never lose it in the first place. The Great War turned out to be a very bad idea.
 
My family is from the Nuremberg area, and have a patent of imperial nobility from said Habsburg monarchs :)

It would be a different state run from Vienna instead of Berlin and hopefully more focused on Germans than on trying to bring lots of other groups who would be better served with their own nations into the fold. Austria Hungary simply wasn't manageable, now toss in the rest of Germany and it would be very unwieldy with lots of court drama for an HBO series
Very nice to hear that, I have a patet of nobility too form provence...btw in my opinion Austria should have capitalized on the vast influence it held upon germany, for as much as I love habsburgs, their foreigh policy during XIXth century was absurdely stupid...they wished they could keep the whole situation in Germany into an indefinite stall...in order to get what? To administrate 12 different nationalities that simply do not like you? If they had kept out of Italy, instead of getting stuck in it, and they haf focused upn germany, they could well have been the ones to unify the country; they lacked, maybe, some of prussian military power, but they compensated excellently in cultural influence; with a unified Germany with Vienna as its capital, the habsburgs would have well been able to let the hungarians go their own way; needless to say, that would also have appeased the russians.
Instead what do we see? Austria blatantly ignorig the whole german question to the point of german people looking for prussia to stick the country together, and instead focusing on Italy, the Balkans, and other useless places; for a country wich has been the head of the HRE for centuries, that is quite stupid indeed; that said it is my opinion that Franz Joseph, while being truly a good man, was a terrible monarch.
unfortunately I live in Naples, italy...a city (and a state) wich has been raped and devasteted from our "northern liberators"...thing is that the late Bourbons, were pretty much as stupid as the last habsburgs, and they practicely gave the country away on a silver plate with their ignorance (The much Ferdinand II was the worst one, with this regard). that is why, while most of my fellows are "neo-Boubonist", I am actually quite pro-Habsburgist...we had Habsburg monarchs for three centuries here in Naples, and those silly Bourbons, for...130 years?
 
I do sympathize. The Habsburgs don't look so bad compared to what came after them...

Otto von Habsburg of course floated the idea in the last months of the war of a Danubian Federation, which might encompass at least some of the old Austro-Hungarian lands. Churchill had some interest in the idea; but Stalin was deadset against it. And since he was occupying or soon to occupy much of the territory in question, it was a dead letter. This is one reason I say that the Soviets are the real obstacle here, not Hitler or the Nazis.

But even if Soviet advances are temporarily stalled, and the Allies manage to occupy all of Austria, most of Bohemia, and maybe even parts of Slovenia and Hungary, I think it's an uphill climb. There was still a lot of political opposition to the Habsburgs in Austria. I think there's really zero chance of Otto's Danubian monarchy (the Czechs won't buy in, regardless of whether they fall under communist rule), but maybe a small chance of a new Greater South German State (I'm not sure what you would call it...the Federation of the Danube?) that includes Bavaria and Baden-Wurtemburg; Stalin might not be so unhappy with a Germany further divided. Whether you could get Otto as, say, president of this federation is harder to say. In terms of culture, dialect and religion, of course, it's a state that makes more sense than West or East Germany really did, and might be more viable in the long run.

The best bet for the Habsburgs to get their throne is to never lose it in the first place. The Great War turned out to be a very bad idea.

Truly so...in that case who cares about Czechia or even Hungary? They can stay where they are...actually such a southern german state would be much more powerful than 1914 Austria-Hungary
 
Hi mates...I've come up with another, more plausible idea for this whole stuff: I have come to think that actually, there were quite a lot of plans for the division of germany, late in the conflict: now, most (not all, but most) of theese plans, while calling for a partition and de-industrialization of the country, never considered giving german territory away to foreign countries, with the exception of the Ruhr and Saar areas; now let's assume that Otto von Habsburg is restored to the throne in Austria, during say 1936-38, in order to stabilize the country in face of german diplomatic pressures. Of course this will simply not work, and Austria will be annexed anyway; but this would give Otto some legitimization in the post-war process. Now let's always assume that a coup against Hitler succeeds in 1944, and though unable to sign peace with the western allies, the new provisional government manages to move all of its troops to the east; due to this little advantage and due also to the fact that many of the best german commanders are still alive (Erwin Rommel, someone?), the germans manage to resist those two more months upon the Vistula, so to stop the soviets long enough to allow Patton to enter Berlin (and Wien and Prague and Breslau).
All not extremely absurd untill now, you shall convene.
Now let's move to the post-war timeframe; let's imagine that with the soviets out of germany, Stalin gets a totally free-hand in eastern Europe (much like in OTL), BUT, when it comes to Germany, the western allies decide to implement one of the wartime plans: a modified version of the Roosvelt plan, or the Wells plan: so we get Germany divided into three or more smaller states; let's assume, that the country is split into its pre-unification constituent states, with Prussia, strippes of its Western territories, wich are, instead awarded to a new Westfalian state; Austria is split from the rest of Germany; Otto is reisntated to his throne; now while in Austria many are still not totally confortable with the restored monarchy, all in all, the populace considers Otto as their head of state, illegally deposed by a foreign aggression...more or less so...well not totally, but...whatever; they will buy it, and Otto had quite a charisma...I am sure he can make his people buy this version of the story, maybe capitalizing upon the disdain Austrians feel towards their northern neighbours.
Stalin is unhappy with the outcome of the war (and many soviet commanders will have their head roll for not managing to get into Germany); anyway his claims to the country are dismissed by the allies, on the basis that germany is going to be partitioned and demilitarized, and it will never pose a threat to its neighbours; most of all the concept is that Germany is to become neutral, and niobosy is getting nothing inside the country, not the alles, nor the soviets (weel this is untrue...); after all what Stalin truly wanted was to weaken germany, and that seems to have been accomplished; also the allies will speak of the necessity to build a bunch of buffer states to divide the two influence zones, and bla bla bla...the point is that Stalin is bought, at least for a while.
This situation, with a partitioned Germany, will last for a few years, with one exception: the southern german states (or state, depending on wich post-war plan you want to implement; some called fo a restroarion of Bavaria, Baden, Württemberg and, others for the creation of a single southern german state) joins Austria very soon; there are a few reasons for this to happen: first of all, southern germans come to see that Austria is enjoying a faster recovery, a greater political stability, and is not threatened by what are perceived as soviet expansionism and western (mostly French) desire for revenge; on the other hand otto needs a wider political platform in order to stabilize his hold to the throne; southern germans are culturally akin to austrians to whom they have looked for leadership for centuries, while being never too enthusiastic of prussian miilitarsim (and protestantism). Now what we get is a southern german confederation, wich ironically is modeled after the north german confederation formed by Prussia in the wake of its victory over Austria in 1866; monarchy is restored in Bavaria, Württemberg and Baden (southern german states are quite conservative, so in the immediate post-war period it is not that absurd to imagine a restoration of monarchy in those lands; also Rupprecht of Bavaria was famed as a good man, and a victim of nazism. In addition the restoration of german southern monarchies is presented as the proof that southern german states are not being "annexed" by Austria). Now Stalin opposes this, but not so much: after all such a confederation is still not very powerful; also, he is much more interested in eastern and northern germany, and he thinks that an independent southern germany might even be better thaan a western-controlled one...more or less; anyway is army is partially demobilized, the americans have the atomic bomb, and he does not wish war with the west upon southern germany.
Meanwhile time passes on; the korean war starts to rage; Germany is quiet; when Stalin dies he is succeded by a more moderate Nikita Chruscev; on the 1st of january, 1957 the Saarland rejoins Germany (or to better say, southern germany); we are in a totally different mood now, the seeds of european cooperation have been planted: NATO is a reality already; a close inter-german relationships has already been allowed to develop; along with this mood, western germany (or the western german staes, according to your likes) holds a referendum, in wich the great majoritty of voters, opts to join Southern Germany. Chruscev says nothing more or less, while being not happy at all; US, UK and France, have now realized that the soviets pose muchn greater a threat than this moderate, liberal, Habsburg-guided, pro-European Germany. Evantually Eastern Germany (or Prussia + Saxony), are allowed to join the union too; the yaear is 1958-1959; Chruscev protests vigorously, but after all germany was not in his grip, so there is not much he can do, nor he can explicitely meddle into the domestic policies of two formally independent states, so he does nothing, as a matter of facts, unwilling to go to war for such a small gain as not to allow two states, both outside of his direct political influence to merge together along with ethnical and historical lines (after all this was the official predicament during OTL too: Germany was "one nation, two states", and bla bla bla, clutter like that.)
Once the reunification process is complete a new constitution is drafted, with the main german monarchies restored and so son...actually this Germany would look much like the one from 1870, but with Austria at its head, instead of Prussia.
This leaves Bohemia out, but this is a matter for another day; and MOST OF ALL, this is not ASB...just unlikely ;)
 
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