Greek and Latin

I read a thread that asks could Latin have replaced Greek in the ERE,
it would play some part in lessening East West rifts between the Roman Empires and the Churches. The thread is over a year old so i cant reply to it. Hard to see how it would happen once Greek was so well established.

But it led to another Whatif

Could greek have supplanted Latin in Rome before the Republic, might there have been a way Greek might have become the language of the Aristocracy that overthrew the King.

Or might the Romans have adopted Greek later on. Yes unlikely.

What if Greek and Latin were given some special equal status, so the Empire became effectively bi-lingual. A latin Greek commonwealth instead of the Empire ?.

Another way to avoid the Latin Greek diivision of the ancient world.
 
I read a thread that asks could Latin have replaced Greek in the ERE,
it would play some part in lessening East West rifts between the Roman Empires and the Churches. The thread is over a year old so i cant reply to it. Hard to see how it would happen once Greek was so well established.

But it led to another Whatif

Could greek have supplanted Latin in Rome before the Republic, might there have been a way Greek might have become the language of the Aristocracy that overthrew the King.

Or might the Romans have adopted Greek later on. Yes unlikely.

What if Greek and Latin were given some special equal status, so the Empire became effectively bi-lingual. A latin Greek commonwealth instead of the Empire ?.

Another way to avoid the Latin Greek diivision of the ancient world.

The bolded part, other than the commonwealth part, is the case OTL - de facto, not sure it ever became de jure. A Greek-speaking East as opposed the Latinized "barbarians" (and Italy) of the West.

I think this would be better served by having the East keep using Latin as well as Greek, and vice-versa in the West.
 
The bolded part, other than the commonwealth part, is the case OTL - de facto, not sure it ever became de jure. A Greek-speaking East as opposed the Latinized "barbarians" (and Italy) of the West.

I think this would be better served by having the East keep using Latin as well as Greek, and vice-versa in the West.

Thanxs, yes were thinking along the same lines, i was thinking of it being more formal, better if enshrined in law, how do we get there though.
Do we need to avoid Empire and have some sort of Commonwealth flowing
from the Republic. Possibly unfeasable.

But if when the Empire is divided East/West maybe a concordat, some form of Constituton, that enshrines the equality of both languages in law.
 
Thanxs, yes were thinking along the same lines, i was thinking of it being more formal, better if enshrined in law, how do we get there though.
Do we need to avoid Empire and have some sort of Commonwealth flowing
from the Republic. Possibly unfeasable.

But if when the Empire is divided East/West maybe a concordat, some form of Constituton, that enshrines the equality of both languages in law.

I don't know why you need it enshrined into law, it was pretty accepted in practice.

The main problem is that Latin never really successfully spread in the East, and the West was overrun by barbarians who didn't know Greek. The former would take some reason to encourage use of Latin more than OTL, the latter is another problem entirely.
 
Yes, that's my starting point the Empire prior to the Barbarian colonisations
is divided East West by Latin Greek, is there a path that leads to some equality of both through out the Empire, thats why i wondered about Greek becoming important before the Republic, maybe a Greek colony in Rome altering it's cultural development. So that rome is enfused with Greek heritage, the son returns to conquer the father later on.
 
Yes, that's my starting point the Empire prior to the Barbarian colonisations
is divided East West by Latin Greek, is there a path that leads to some equality of both through out the Empire, thats why i wondered about Greek becoming important before the Republic, maybe a Greek colony in Rome altering it's cultural development. So that rome is enfused with Greek heritage, the son returns to conquer the father later on.

Well, Rome did embrace the Greek East. Its not really a problem until long after the WRE has faded away.
 
but not at the Governmental and trading level, greek was the language of administration, wasn't it ?

Maybe a stronger Greek diaspora across the mediterranean, meaning having to go futher back to alter the history of the wars between the Greek States.
maybe less internecie strife allows for Greek to be more widespread.
 
but not at the Governmental and trading level, greek was the language of administration, wasn't it ?

Maybe a stronger Greek diaspora across the mediterranean, meaning having to go futher back to alter the history of the wars between the Greek States.
maybe less internecie strife allows for Greek to be more widespread.

Not sure what you mean here (underlined).

And how would a stronger Greek diaspora help, assuming the butterflies don't trample the whole development of Rome?
 
I was referring to East, aernt masses said in Greek, and isnt the administration of the East a Greek speaking affair,

Thinking a more wide spread greek diaspora through italy,
 
I was referring to East, aernt masses said in Greek, and isnt the administration of the East a Greek speaking affair,

Thinking a more wide spread greek diaspora through italy,

Yes and yes.

And well, southern Italy was pretty Greek, is that not enough?
 
A couple of unorganized remarks:

In the 1st centuries (BC and AD), actually Greek was the most frequently spoken language in Rome - mainly due to immigrants from the East. Only in the 2nd Latin took over again; but in the same period, the local languages became stronger in the East. Here I'm talking about men in the street.


Rome embracing Greek before dumping the kings?
Quite possible. But that would change the whole character of *Rome.
I would very much question it if you predict a rise of this city and and expansion around the Med as Rome performed IOTL.
The special character of Rome was that it was in touch with the Hellenistic world, but not yet part of it. Perhaps an expanding grecophonic Naples is what you want?

Note that as late as around 200 BC, Cato the Elder despised the Greek speaking "snobs" (let me put it that way) and emphasized the old Roman virtues. Despite that Cato may be an, um, extraspecial character, it sheds some light on the relation of the languages during the Republic. Greek was the language of the educated, and by that in suspect of being sissy-like.

And no, there was never such a concept as an official language.
The Romans just had to be able to talk to the locals, and that worked only by using Greek in the East. The Romans hadn't started the spread of Greek. They already found a region where they could communicate in a language they also knew.
Not much would change about the language of the people if official documents would have to be issued in Latin only.

And finally, the Balkans were very much Latin-dominated during the Empire.
Of this, only Romanian is left with a Romance language.
If the larger part of the Balkan invasions and settlements can be prevented, Latin would have a more influential position even at such a late time.
 
And finally, the Balkans were very much Latin-dominated during the Empire.
Of this, only Romanian is left with a Romance language.
If the larger part of the Balkan invasions and settlements can be prevented, Latin would have a more influential position even at such a late time.

Thanx, Which balkan invasions and settlements ?
And if that happens and history goes mainly the way it did IOTL, what implications are there for Byzantium of a latin speaking balkans, does that make it easier for the area to become catholic ?, doe it rebel against constantinople, be more sympathetic to the pope and venice etc, as the turks tke anatolia does a latin balkans identify itself with rome, will rome be more likely to make a serious effort to prevent muslimexpansion into the blkans ?

lotta questions :p
 
And finally, the Balkans were very much Latin-dominated during the Empire.
Of this, only Romanian is left with a Romance language.
If the larger part of the Balkan invasions and settlements can be prevented, Latin would have a more influential position even at such a late time.

Indeed, even following the Byzantine reconquest, there was a large and influential Latin speaking community in the Balkans, especially along the Danube itself.
 
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