GPMGs common in WW1?

  • Thread starter Deleted member 1487
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Deleted member 1487

How do you get GPMGs common in WW1 and what would the impact be of having something like that on the war?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General-purpose_machine_gun
Apparently in 1916 the Germans were testing a model like that, but didn't get it in service and sort of adopted a version of their heavy MG as a light MG with the MG08/15
 
I think the closest weapon to a GPMG in WWI was the Hotchkiss MkI Portative. http://world.guns.ru/machine/fr/hotchkiss-portative-e.html

Weight 12.80kg/28 1/2 pounds. Could be fitted with a bipod a light weight tripod or the heavy tripod used by the Hotchkiss medium machine gun used by the French. Cyclic rate of 500 rounds per minute and a sustained rate of 250 rpm firing from a 15 or 30 round rigid strip or a semi rigid belt made up of 3 round mini strips linked together. The WWI British tanks used them and could fire enormous quantities of ammo.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzsWPOCiwe0
 

Deleted member 1487

As far as the Hotchkiss is there anyway you could get the French to make that a GPMG pre-war so that it was widespread among all the services?

It would be interesting to see if the Lewis gun could be adopted by the US and adapted for multiple roles...then because it was a US weapon it wouldn't be exported, so the Entente doesn't get it until 1917. Any idea what impact that would have?
 
I think the closest weapon to a GPMG in WWI was the Hotchkiss MkI Portative. http://world.guns.ru/machine/fr/hotchkiss-portative-e.html

Weight 12.80kg/28 1/2 pounds. Could be fitted with a bipod a light weight tripod or the heavy tripod used by the Hotchkiss medium machine gun used by the French. Cyclic rate of 500 rounds per minute and a sustained rate of 250 rpm firing from a 15 or 30 round rigid strip or a semi rigid belt made up of 3 round mini strips linked together. The WWI British tanks used them and could fire enormous quantities of ammo.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzsWPOCiwe0

The M1909 version used by the US Army(Benet-Mercie) had poor QC on heat treating by Colt, leading to frequent breakages of firing pins and extractors.
These were not easy to replace in the field.
It did have an easy to change barrel, though.

Other nations had better luck with them.

However, this would be a better weapon to go with

http://www.forgottenweapons.com/light-machine-guns/madsen-light-machine-gun/

The Madsen Light Machine Gun
 

Deleted member 1487

The M1909 version used by the US Army(Benet-Mercie) had poor QC on heat treating by Colt, leading to frequent breakages of firing pins and extractors.
These were not easy to replace in the field.
It did have an easy to change barrel, though.

Other nations had better luck with them.

However, this would be a better weapon to go with

http://www.forgottenweapons.com/light-machine-guns/madsen-light-machine-gun/

The Madsen Light Machine Gun

The Germans used it on the Eastern front and hated it, not adopting it because of its problems.
 
If Hout had invented a GPMG, Canada could have avoided the Bren Gun Scandal.

On a practical note, a GPMG would have vastly simplified training and logistics for a tiny peacetime army of reservists (Canada) rapidly expanding to take on the most successful army on the planet (Imperial Germany.)
 
The M1909 version used by the US Army(Benet-Mercie) had poor QC on heat treating by Colt, leading to frequent breakages of firing pins and extractors.
These were not easy to replace in the field.
It did have an easy to change barrel, though.

Other nations had better luck with them.

However, this would be a better weapon to go with

http://www.forgottenweapons.com/light-machine-guns/madsen-light-machine-gun/

The Madsen Light Machine Gun

Is the Madsen going to stand up to the sustained fire role it only weighed 9 kg. Dont know if it had a fast change barrel but if it didnt have one its not going to last very long before something melts.
 
Is the Madsen going to stand up to the sustained fire role it only weighed 9 kg. Dont know if it had a fast change barrel but if it didnt have one its not going to last very long before something melts.

Could come with a tripod mounting for sustained fire. The barrel/breech can be changed over and the Danes used to issue troops with a couple of spare barrel/breeches to allow sustained fire.

My choice for the role.
 
It could be useful on the Eastern front. However in the West, it would only prove that trench warfare is by definition immobile. It will not do much for offensives breaking through enemy trenches, but will give the defensive dug-in soldier another edge over the attackers storming towards them through open field. The best way to use it would still be to mount it on tanks and ground-strafing planes.
 
Widespread GPMG is going to be a godsend for attacking forces; people often forget this, but it was actually common for infantry assaults to succeed in carrying the first couple rows of trenches. The problem was that counter-attacks would usually flatten the overextended and undergunned attackers. Being able to carry lots of mobile firepower in GPMG form means counterattacks are going to become much bloodier.
 

Deleted member 1487

Widespread GPMG is going to be a godsend for attacking forces; people often forget this, but it was actually common for infantry assaults to succeed in carrying the first couple rows of trenches. The problem was that counter-attacks would usually flatten the overextended and undergunned attackers. Being able to carry lots of mobile firepower in GPMG form means counterattacks are going to become much bloodier.
Those are my thoughts too, plus the production benefits from having a standard pattern of MG, meaning they can make more of them; that should have a major impact on logistics and tactics.
 

NoMommsen

Donor
How do you get GPMGs common in WW1 and what would the impact be of having something like that on the war?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General-purpose_machine_gun
Apparently in 1916 the Germans were testing a model like that, but didn't get it in service and sort of adopted a version of their heavy MG as a light MG with the MG08/15
Actually they got something like that into service, but only late and then only in small numbers : an aircooled version of the light version of the MG 08/15 called lMG 08/18 : http://world.guns.ru/machine/de/mg-0-e.html

One of the main problems for a "universal" MG, aka light MG used as a heavy MG is its mounting when used as such. This problem was - after the war - solved mainly by ... Madsen :D .
On search for an universal MG the Reichswehr tested the Madsen of its time together with a portable mountig. They discarded the gun but bought the license for the mounting, that was then adaptedto the MG 34.

But no idea with what POD they could have been brought to develop at least the machine gun earlier.
 
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