I heard a new opinion the other day, yea Bush was wrong at the time, Iraq didn't have any WMD in 2003, but is anyone could ensure Saddam Hussein would never try to develop a real one? @Iwanh I think this is interesting, you made Saddam Hussein alive, what would comes next?
Geronimo : What if Osama Bin Laden was killed prior to 9/11?
- Thread starter Iwanh
- Start date
Pakistan won't be declared a major-non NATO ally perhaps. I'm still wondering why the OTL Bush administration declared them as such, considering Washington and Islamabad have a strained complex relationship.
Musharraf recognised that after 9/11 they needed to back the U.S. and the U.S. made it pretty straightforward too, deputy secretary of state Richard Armitage threatened that if they didn't get on board they would be considered a target. Bush considered Musharraf a close ally in the war on terror after that, and a lot of the security analysis was that it was better to have them inside the tent than out, where they could make more trouble.
"Ally"
Musharraf's regime recognized the Taliban.
Then even after the U.S. designated Pakistan as an MNNA, the country still drifted closer to Russia and China.
Oh God, I completely forgot that there was a bombing in London on July 7, 2005. I'm not sure how different the attacks or the responses will be compared to OTL, though, assuming they still end up happening.
As for Hurricane Katrina, hopefully John Edwards' response to it is better than George W. Bush's was that's for sure.
The AQ of this TL is targeting Russia more instead of the West. Although Madrid still happened on time as per OTL.
I think Edwards would really try to put up a better response than Bush, especially if he wants to be reelected in 2008.
bumping this so it doesn't get inactive
theres alot of questions i have for TTL
im wondering if the 2008 recession ever happens in this timeline
will arnold schwarzenegger be in the 2016 election instead of trump (that would be awesome as instead of being like bush jr 2.0 in OTL he would be like jorgan von strangle from fairly odd parents IRL)
also if theres a part 2 of this timeline set after 2017 like with massively mutiplayer (player two start part 2)
will china even be a superpower without 9/11
i heard in one recent video that with no 9/11 covid and tiktok would not be a thing and eventually the twin towers will have youtube tourist videos/animation memes/vines etc watched by kids/teens who see the twin towers in games/anime/cartoons/music etc they indulge in TTL
sorry for all these questions but this timeline intrigues me as i am making a game thats set in a world where 9/11 never happens and the ussr never fell and i need as much research as possible for it
back on topic about whats currently in TTL
i wonder when or how al queda would collapse in TTL like with the taliban
also as a canadian myself will canadas aging problem still be a thing without harper and tredau essentially making canada more of a liberal country turning conservative like in OTL
will canada be more like japan in TTL not in terms of old age but in terms of culture
im hyped up for this
theres alot of questions i have for TTL
im wondering if the 2008 recession ever happens in this timeline
will arnold schwarzenegger be in the 2016 election instead of trump (that would be awesome as instead of being like bush jr 2.0 in OTL he would be like jorgan von strangle from fairly odd parents IRL)
also if theres a part 2 of this timeline set after 2017 like with massively mutiplayer (player two start part 2)
will china even be a superpower without 9/11
i heard in one recent video that with no 9/11 covid and tiktok would not be a thing and eventually the twin towers will have youtube tourist videos/animation memes/vines etc watched by kids/teens who see the twin towers in games/anime/cartoons/music etc they indulge in TTL
sorry for all these questions but this timeline intrigues me as i am making a game thats set in a world where 9/11 never happens and the ussr never fell and i need as much research as possible for it
back on topic about whats currently in TTL
i wonder when or how al queda would collapse in TTL like with the taliban
also as a canadian myself will canadas aging problem still be a thing without harper and tredau essentially making canada more of a liberal country turning conservative like in OTL
will canada be more like japan in TTL not in terms of old age but in terms of culture
im hyped up for this
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ILPD45
Kicked
Best of luck on your game - just note that in this timeline, the fall of the Soviet Union has already happened as it’s before the POD which is in 1998.
This timeline is still active. The creator of the timeline, Iwanh, posted his most current update about a week and a half ago. The timeline probably isn't going inactive anytime soon.
I assume that the 2008 Recession probably still happens, though not as bad as OTL.
Since the Hatch Amendment never passed, I don't think Arnold Schwarzenegger can legally run for the US president. Also, try not to mention Trump around these part due to "current politics". I just don't want you getting in trouble with the admins.
It's probably too early to tell if there will be a part 2 to the timeline, given that the timeline is still in mid-2005.
It's probably too early IMHO to tell what will happen with China.
Yeah, without 9/11 happening and the Twin Towers still standing strong and tall, there will be videos and memes and such about them.
I'm not sure how 9/11 not happening with butterfly away TikTok or Covid, but it's probably too early to tell.
I'm not sure how the USSR not falling in 1991 will effect 9/11, but I wish you good luck with your timeline.
If the Recession happens in 2008, I can see it being not as bad if Congress stays Dem controlled and can pass stimulus quickly enough. Depending on how the Democrats and Edwards respond, it could lead to him winning a second term but probably in a more thin margin of victory than his ‘04 election.
China will probably follow the same path as OTL. It would still become belligerent in the next decade.
The Twin Towers still standing will appear in all films and games set in modern-day in New York.
I think Tiktok won't be butterflied away, just like how in most "no 9/11 timelines", we would still see carbon copies of Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram. Any change maybe so small that it is negligible.
There's a timeline called New Union on Alternate History Wiki wherein the USSR does not collapse in 1991 as the New Union Treaty is signed. 9/11 still happens on schedule for TTL but the U.S. invades Sudan instead because the Soviets were able to mediate peace in Afghanistan by restoring the monarchy. Without the Taliban to take hold, Osama bin Laden hides in Sudan instead. During this alternate War on Terror, the U.S./NATO and the USSR/CTSO cooperate on anti-terrorism matters in the Horn of Africa instead.
New Union
With all the recent tensions caused over Russia's reemergence as a global and regional player, it's rather hard to imagine (especially for recent generations) what the world was once like before the collapse of communism in the late 1980s. Though it may come as a shock to learn that the end of...
althistory.fandom.com
Timeline (New Union)
January 1 — A drafting committee is formed to work on a final version of the New Union Treaty. Six of the 15 Soviet republics (Armenia, Estonia, Georgia, Latvia, Lithuania, and Moldova) do not participate in the drafting. March 6 — The first version of the New Union Treaty is approved by the...
althistory.fandom.com
Differences (New Union)
The following article contains sections which are to help explain specific events and scenarios within the New Union timeline. All sections are to be written from OTL's perspective in order to help understand minor changes which wouldn't be mentioned within the timeline itself. Please do not add...
althistory.fandom.com
Was the recession inevitable either way? Regardless who won in 2004 or what party takes the House or Senate in 2006?
Highly unlikely iOTL that a different 2006 midterm outcome (where the Senate was the only chamber in doubt) would have impacted the recession arriving. The housing market had already peaked in summer of 2006China will probably follow the same path as OTL. It would still become belligerent in the next decade.
The Twin Towers still standing will appear in all films and games set in modern-day in New York.
I think Tiktok won't be butterflied away, just like how in most "no 9/11 timelines", we would still see carbon copies of Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram. Any change maybe so small that it is negligible.
There's a timeline called New Union on Alternate History Wiki wherein the USSR does not collapse in 1991 as the New Union Treaty is signed. 9/11 still happens on schedule for TTL but the U.S. invades Sudan instead because the Soviets were able to mediate peace in Afghanistan by restoring the monarchy. Without the Taliban to take hold, Osama bin Laden hides in Sudan instead. During this alternate War on Terror, the U.S./NATO and the USSR/CTSO cooperate on anti-terrorism matters in the Horn of Africa instead.
New Union
With all the recent tensions caused over Russia's reemergence as a global and regional player, it's rather hard to imagine (especially for recent generations) what the world was once like before the collapse of communism in the late 1980s. Though it may come as a shock to learn that the end of...Timeline (New Union)
January 1 — A drafting committee is formed to work on a final version of the New Union Treaty. Six of the 15 Soviet republics (Armenia, Estonia, Georgia, Latvia, Lithuania, and Moldova) do not participate in the drafting. March 6 — The first version of the New Union Treaty is approved by the...Differences (New Union)
The following article contains sections which are to help explain specific events and scenarios within the New Union timeline. All sections are to be written from OTL's perspective in order to help understand minor changes which wouldn't be mentioned within the timeline itself. Please do not add...
Was the recession inevitable either way? Regardless who won in 2004 or what party takes the House or Senate in 2006?
Without 9/11, it's possible the far-right conspiracy culture could be either butterflied away or watered down as it produced a number of conspiracy theories.
I think we still would get "x invasion was for oil" "the US wants to conquer the world" "UN is the New World Order in the larval stage" kind of theories but no "Bush did 9/11" and variations of those questioning how the steel melted or saying he did that because he's the Antichrist seeking to turn America into a Police State(which later would be used against Obama and Trump as well)
It'll be watered down. Conspiracy theories weren't born overnight. There were already conspiracy theories in the 1990s against the Clinton Administration, especially after the Waco incident.
Here, these post-9/4 conspiracy theories would come out in a different form.