Germany Navy makes a difference: 1918 offensive

http://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=59564

The above link details an interactive story where the Germany Navy is able to defeat the RN and interrupt the supply lines of the BEF. It is in no shape to resist the German Army when they come and the Germans win the war.

A brief summary: A new commander takes over the fleet. After some very indecisive engagements the Kaisers fleet launches a number of raids against Allied targets, in particular a small German force is landed in the UK which has enough time to steal some of the King's hunting trophies. This results in the UK fleet is split up, and when the German fleet finally masses for the push down the channel their command and control of such a large force isn't so good. This plus weather that favored the Germans results in victory for the hun, who in turn lay waste to the channel ports.

And you really should read the linked story, it is very well written.

Now the big point: Is this a plausible chain of events or total nonsense?
 

CalBear

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http://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=59564

The above link details an interactive story where the Germany Navy is able to defeat the RN and interrupt the supply lines of the BEF. It is in no shape to resist the German Army when they come and the Germans win the war.

A brief summary: A new commander takes over the fleet. After some very indecisive engagements the Kaisers fleet launches a number of raids against Allied targets, in particular a small German force is landed in the UK which has enough time to steal some of the King's hunting trophies. This results in the UK fleet is split up, and when the German fleet finally masses for the push down the channel their command and control of such a large force isn't so good. This plus weather that favored the Germans results in victory for the hun, who in turn lay waste to the channel ports.

And you really should read the linked story, it is very well written.

Now the big point: Is this a plausible chain of events or total nonsense?


Utter impossibility.

The High Seas Fleet was at a such a numerical disadvantage that the British could have split off the entire Battle Cruiser force and still have outgunned the High Seas Fleet nearly 2-1. This doesn't even consider that availability of 14 USN battleships, most of which were never deployed to the UK because of concerns over fuel oil supplies. If the RN has somehow suffered a serious defeat, this concern would have gone by the boards, if for no other season than some of the RN oil burners would be out of the picture.

The High Seas Fleet was lucky to escape with its skin at Just land (whatever the weakness of the British BC design, it didn't extend to the BB designs). A second attempt to bring about a decisive action would have had the same result.
 
Is this a plausible chain of events or total nonsense?

Total nonsense.

Not only was the Kaiser fleet so much smaller than the RN, but you must also keep in mind that the RN sailors and officers, especially the high-ranking officers, were far more experienced and would never let the Hun fool 'em.
And even if, due to some intervention by Kaiseralien Space Bats, the Brits are truely fooled, even splitting up their fleet leaves each segment bigger than the German fleet.

The German's only chance of making a difference at sea is quickly sending their entire fleet away at the start of the war, and launching a naval blitzkrieg on India, Malayia, or South Africa.
That, too, won't make too much of a difference.
 
As a note, I played that game on the German side. Later, while talking to a player on the British side, I realized something:

The Brits were played by morons.
 

Markus

Banned
Total nonsense.

Not only was the Kaiser fleet so much smaller than the RN, but you must also keep in mind that the RN sailors and officers, especially the high-ranking officers, were far more experienced and would never let the Hun fool 'em.

:D:D:D Doggerbank? Jutland? the far more experienced high-ranking officers must have had a bad day, well two in a row.


As a note, I played that game on the German side. Later, while talking to a player on the British side, I realized something:

The Brits were played by morons.

Their communication was obviously done by morons, otherwise they would have won big both times.
 
Not being funny, but sooner they melted it all down and used the metal to build tanks would have been far more useful than a couple of warships holed up in Bremenhaven
 

Anaxagoras

Banned
Jutland? the far more experienced high-ranking officers must have had a bad day

Yeah, the British had such a bad day that they came within minutes of getting the High Seas Fleet under the guns of their entire battleship line, where it would have been pulverized.
 

MrP

Banned
the far more experienced high-ranking officers must have had a bad day, well two in a row.

No, one could only say two bad days in a row had Dogger Bank been the very day before Jutland. Two separate bad days is just two separate bad days.
 
Hang on, didn't the British win at Dogger Bank? The RN is to be considered to have had a bad day if every battle isn't a re-run of Trafalgar?
 

Markus

Banned
Yeah, the British had such a bad day that they came within minutes of getting the High Seas Fleet under the guns of their entire battleship line, where it would have been pulverized.


came within minutes of...
would have been...

They still did not get it done and that´s what matters!


Hang on, didn't the British win at Dogger Bank? The RN is to be considered to have had a bad day if every battle isn't a re-run of Trafalgar?

Big RN victory: one obsolete german cruiser sunk, three modern battlecruisers were allowed to get away. All becsue of poor communications(by flag).:D
 

MrP

Banned
Big RN victory: one obsolete german cruiser sunk, three modern battlecruisers were allowed to get away. All becsue of poor communications(by flag).:D

Beatty was rather irresponsible with his Flag Lt from what I recall. The bloke seems to have been a complete twit, and even Beatty knew it.
 

Markus

Banned
Oh yes, what a terrible defeat that was.

A wasted victory. No.1 that is. Jutland was No.2 because the Brits with all their experienced high-ranking officers still did not get their communications in order a year later. :D
 
The German's only chance of making a difference at sea is quickly sending their entire fleet away at the start of the war, and launching a naval blitzkrieg on India, Malayia, or South Africa.
That, too, won't make too much of a difference.

And would be impossible anyway. Most German boats, like the French, were designed to operate at relatively short range, and once the War started, they'd have practically nowhere to take on new coal stores.
 
A wasted victory. No.1 that is. Jutland was No.2 because the Brits with all their experienced high-ranking officers still did not get their communications in order a year later. :D

Jutland wasn't a bad day - the only bad day possible for the RN was a defeat that breaks the blockade of Germany - not a glourious path, but a war winning one. The fact the HSF had to spend three months (I think) in repair and refit after Skaggerat, and the RN was ready for sea in four hours meant that despite no second Trafalgar, the objectives of the battle for the Germans failed.

Comms were a problem for the RN - but when you can half your fleet and still have each constitiuent part larger, plus having a whole bunch of pre-dreds in the Channel Fleet to support them, it makes the posibility of a successful breakout in 1918 pretty low.

Not to mention the German morale. They mutinied when being asked to do this IRL - if the sailors could be persuaded out, would their morale be much higher?
 
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