tallthinkev
Donor
Syria used Panzer IV's in the Six Day War. Also when Kurt Tank went to Argentina and built the FMA IAe 33 Pulqui II, it was the Ta 183 by another name.
German WWII Equipment post-war?
- Thread starter Shtudmuffin
- Start date
Maybe more relevant to the thread, I believe Willi Messerschmit designed a prototype jet fighter for Egypt.
The Soviets would never have allowed them to sell first class equipment to the Israelis, they wanted it all for themselves. They even stopped the Czechs from continuing to produce the ME-262 out of fear that it would allow the Czechs to resit them. As to why the major European powers (Britain & France) didn't sell them equipment I can think of three reasons.
1 The Israelis couldn't afford it.
2 British and French interests in the Middle East lay with the Arabs, we needed the oil.
3 Why would Britain supply arms to the terrorists responsable for the death of numerous British servicemen.
The Junkers Ju 86, used as a bomber and airliner by Germany, Switzerland, Hungary, Sweden and South Africa (yes!), was still used postwar by Sweden as an electronic warfare aircraft.
The Junkers Ju 52 was license-built during WW II in France and used post-war by the Armee de l' Air as the Amiot AAC.1 Toucan, as a transport in both the French Vietnam war and the Algerian war (see picture). It was also used as a make-shift bomber in Vietnam. It was also used as a civilian airliner by Societe de Transports Aeriens (STA) and Air France in the late 1940s and early 1950s.
Portugal used the Ju 52 as a cargo transport and for paratroopers in its colonial wars.
In Spain the Ju 52 was built under license as CASA 352.
The Swiss air force used Ju 52s as paratroop transports until 1982.
British European Airlines also used the Ju 52 for a short time in the nineteen-forties.
Amiot AAC.1 Toucan in Algeria
The Junkers Ju 52 was license-built during WW II in France and used post-war by the Armee de l' Air as the Amiot AAC.1 Toucan, as a transport in both the French Vietnam war and the Algerian war (see picture). It was also used as a make-shift bomber in Vietnam. It was also used as a civilian airliner by Societe de Transports Aeriens (STA) and Air France in the late 1940s and early 1950s.
Portugal used the Ju 52 as a cargo transport and for paratroopers in its colonial wars.
In Spain the Ju 52 was built under license as CASA 352.
The Swiss air force used Ju 52s as paratroop transports until 1982.
British European Airlines also used the Ju 52 for a short time in the nineteen-forties.
Amiot AAC.1 Toucan in Algeria
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Ah. I understand 2 & 3. Somewhere in the back of my head, I knew that, but I had forgotten. As for 1, I guess I never really considered that. Perhaps the equipment would have been affordable and serviced in small numbers though (at least some of the aircraft; high-maintenance tanks like the Tiger wouldn't last a day in the sandy environment of Palestine and I'm betting the same for the Panther), but maybe not. Or, theoretically, the equipment could have been dumped onto the Israelites. But you raise a good point.
Das_Colonel
Banned
A book I have mentions ex French, Luftwaffe and Spanish Ju-52's being used in PNG in the 1950's and 1960's
Czechoslovakia had around 65 Panthers. 32 were refurbished and used. Later on as recovery. I posted about it few weeks ago.
https://www.alternatehistory.com/discussion/showthread.php?t=233294
Czechoslovakia also had numbers of Pz IV and actually manufactured for Czechoslovak army but also exported Hetzers to Switzerland.
After war Sdkfz 251 were redesigned, fully enlcosed and manufactured in Slovakia in total number 1500.
Czechoslovak army used 88 mm AA (believe parts were made during war in Slovakia).
From planes already mentioned Avia S-199 and CS-199, Avia S-92 but also Avia C-2 (Arado 96), but also Siebel 204, Fiesler 156 and Bu 181 were manufactured.
Pz IV captured from Syrians by Israelis is believed to be delivered by Czechoslovakia.
Yugoslavians were also manufacturing clones of MG 42.
https://www.alternatehistory.com/discussion/showthread.php?t=233294
Czechoslovakia also had numbers of Pz IV and actually manufactured for Czechoslovak army but also exported Hetzers to Switzerland.
After war Sdkfz 251 were redesigned, fully enlcosed and manufactured in Slovakia in total number 1500.
Czechoslovak army used 88 mm AA (believe parts were made during war in Slovakia).
From planes already mentioned Avia S-199 and CS-199, Avia S-92 but also Avia C-2 (Arado 96), but also Siebel 204, Fiesler 156 and Bu 181 were manufactured.
Pz IV captured from Syrians by Israelis is believed to be delivered by Czechoslovakia.
Yugoslavians were also manufacturing clones of MG 42.
I think the Syrians also used Sturmgeschutz III mobile assault guns in a tank destroyer role as well.
And the aforementioned Egyption jet fighter that Messerschmidt designed was the Helwan HA-300. It was originally a collaboration with Hispano Aviacion in Franco's Spain, but funding fell through or something like that.
And the aforementioned Egyption jet fighter that Messerschmidt designed was the Helwan HA-300. It was originally a collaboration with Hispano Aviacion in Franco's Spain, but funding fell through or something like that.
The US navy used the V1 missile in a series of tests in the 1940's.
In US use it was known as the LOON. I dont think it was a success though
In US use it was known as the LOON. I dont think it was a success though
Nord aircraft factory assembled a number of FW-190 for use with Armee de l'Air though only 14 were operational with Normandie-Nieman regiment along their Yak-3 
Also Nord build the Siebel 204 and Morane the Fi 154 as Criquet supplying the latter to Vietnam.
Other German types built were as mentioned the Ju52 as Toucan.
French aircraft factories during occupation had been retooled to repair and supply Luftwaffe units based in France which made for a potential to use the output post-war; the Nord NC900/FW-190 weren't a success as workers during occupation had sabotaged production making the resultant aircraft structually weak and unpleasant to fly.
A number of ex-luftwaffe transports were used by various operators post-war granted by ex. Britain to Danish Air Lines as repartions for aircraft impressed or lost during the war.
MG 42 clone is in use with the Danish army.
Also Nord build the Siebel 204 and Morane the Fi 154 as Criquet supplying the latter to Vietnam.
Other German types built were as mentioned the Ju52 as Toucan.
French aircraft factories during occupation had been retooled to repair and supply Luftwaffe units based in France which made for a potential to use the output post-war; the Nord NC900/FW-190 weren't a success as workers during occupation had sabotaged production making the resultant aircraft structually weak and unpleasant to fly.
A number of ex-luftwaffe transports were used by various operators post-war granted by ex. Britain to Danish Air Lines as repartions for aircraft impressed or lost during the war.
MG 42 clone is in use with the Danish army.
VW restarted production of an updated Kubelwagen in the late 60's for the civilian market.
I've dwelled in this topic a bit in my own tripolar Cold War-scenario.
JNA used German calibres and weapons extensively, StG 44 was the standard service weapon of their paratrooper units up to early 1980s, and their SARAC M53 LMG is a direct copy of MG-42 - it even uses the same cartridge.
As for postwar developments directly based on German designs:
The Soviet RPG-2 is a child of Bazooka/Panzerschreck and Panzerfaust 150M
And as mentioned here, CETME and later G3 started from StG 45:
Spanish 5.56 NATO-caliber CETME Ameli is also interesting, combining features of G3 and overall design of MG-42.
And then there are postwar works of German airplane engineers.
Bell X-5 was "inspired" by P.1101
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bell_X-5
And later on Kurt Tank designed the Indian HAL HF-24 Marut, and Messerschmitt worked with Helwan HA-300 in Egypt.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helwan_HA-300
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HAL_HF-24_Marut
JNA used German calibres and weapons extensively, StG 44 was the standard service weapon of their paratrooper units up to early 1980s, and their SARAC M53 LMG is a direct copy of MG-42 - it even uses the same cartridge.
As for postwar developments directly based on German designs:
The Soviet RPG-2 is a child of Bazooka/Panzerschreck and Panzerfaust 150M
And as mentioned here, CETME and later G3 started from StG 45:
Spanish 5.56 NATO-caliber CETME Ameli is also interesting, combining features of G3 and overall design of MG-42.
And then there are postwar works of German airplane engineers.
Bell X-5 was "inspired" by P.1101
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bell_X-5
And later on Kurt Tank designed the Indian HAL HF-24 Marut, and Messerschmitt worked with Helwan HA-300 in Egypt.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helwan_HA-300
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HAL_HF-24_Marut
Sweden kept the 10.5cm leFH18 howitzer in depots until 1982.
The 10.5cm GebH40 howitzer was used by a number of European countries (e.g. Hungary) until replaced by the M56 by the mid-60s.
Finland still uses the 15cm sFH18 howitzer, rebarreled to Soviet 152mm in 1988.
The 7.5cm KwK42 was modified into the CN-75-50 by Giat, and mounted on about 2,000 AMX-13 serving worldwide.
The 10.5cm GebH40 howitzer was used by a number of European countries (e.g. Hungary) until replaced by the M56 by the mid-60s.
Finland still uses the 15cm sFH18 howitzer, rebarreled to Soviet 152mm in 1988.
The 7.5cm KwK42 was modified into the CN-75-50 by Giat, and mounted on about 2,000 AMX-13 serving worldwide.
Romania got 13 Panthers. They were retired in 1950.
Romania allso has 2 (two!) Panzer IV tanks left in when the war ended. I don't think they lasted much longer.
The Bf-109 fighters (some of them built locally) were allso used into the '50-s. I don't know exactly when they were retired, but no earlier then 1951, when the first jets (soviet yak 17 and 23) arrived.
I bought one in 1973. Called "The Thing" in the US market and hecho en Mexico. Orange. It was extremely fun but horribly unreliable.