German offensive in the West in 1915

  • Thread starter Deleted member 1487
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I would agree, though the political rammifications of falling back on the Channel ports and digging in will be huge, causing governments to collapse and generals to be scapegoated. It could also cripple armies, physically and morally, which can mean big things for the French down the road, both at Verdun and other points. French manpower peaking early can cause the French to collapse before the Americans get involved or even cause the US to cut off unsecured loans, which ends the war in 1917 with a negotiated peace.



Ahhh, I don't want to give away what is going on there because I want to present that as part of a TL later. This thread is part of a process helping me think out the narrative.
Suffice to say that the offensive in the West is based on the hope that knocking the French out of the war will render any Russian gains irrelevant, as per OHL's thinking at this period historically. It was based on a number of faulty assumptions that the Entente made as well.

AH is not alone in the East, nor sitting still. Russia has been worse in 1914, while AH has survived and grown enough to take the offensive themselves without German help.

OTL AH gets a very bad rep for things outside their control/bad decisions which won't be a factor here. Based on how the initial battles went AH remained at a deficit that was compounded by each action after. Had things gone slightly differently early on, AH would have had a completely different reputation. Read Tom_B's "Austro-Hungarian Tannenberg" to understand what I mean.

OTL initially the AHs, despite severe mismanagement in deployments, beat the Russians very badly in Galicia. Russian reinforcements and fog of war prevented these victories from turning into decisive battles that would have changed the course of the entire war. Instead of entirely destroying several Russian armies, which was a distinct possibility and missed opportunity OTL, the AHs lost their nerve and retreated. Like I said, read Tom_B's TL, which covers that POD. Mine will be different, but no less butterfly-y.

So what you are saying is that your ATL cannot be argued with because everything is being taken of in another ATL.

So you have an ATL covered by another ATL surrounded by one big ATL that will be subject to modifications by other ATL's if required.

OK...go for it.

Actually I read some of Tom-B 's Operation Unicorn on another website. I assume this is the same Tom-B as I have seen here. He also managed to create a 100 ATL's including a maid putting the wrong sugar in Kitchener's tea that made him angry and forced him to forget about issuing an order for two battalions to go to Limerick (I made that bit up).

It can work but you have to keep your eye on the detail otherwise it can unravel quickly.

Please don't have the Grand Fleet blowing up like Roman candles with one hit while the Germans come home without a scratch even after 20 hits each. I'm tired of those now. And don't have the Germans inventing everything that the allies did in the OTL.

Best wishes.
 

Deleted member 1487

So what you are saying is that your ATL cannot be argued with because everything is being taken of in another ATL.

So you have an ATL covered by another ATL surrounded by one big ATL that will be subject to modifications by other ATL's if required.

OK...go for it.

Actually I read some of Tom-B 's Operation Unicorn on another website. I assume this is the same Tom-B as I have seen here. He also managed to create a 100 ATL's including a maid putting the wrong sugar in Kitchener's tea that made him angry and forced him to forget about issuing an order for two battalions to go to Limerick (I made that bit up).

It can work but you have to keep your eye on the detail otherwise it can unravel quickly.

Please don't have the Grand Fleet blowing up like Roman candles with one hit while the Germans come home without a scratch even after 20 hits each. I'm tired of those now. And don't have the Germans inventing everything that the allies did in the OTL.

Best wishes.
:D
Not quite that bad, sorry for being so obtuse about it, I just wanted to work out the Western Front portion without having the thread 'devolve' into an Eastern Front argument. These kinds of threads have a habit of straying of topic. I strive for detail and realism if I can, I'm just trying to start conversation here about potential issues while staying close to the reality of the situation. Sometimes here I have gotten off topic regarding plans versus reality, something that is a major issue in WW1 operations.
 
:D
Not quite that bad, sorry for being so obtuse about it, I just wanted to work out the Western Front portion without having the thread 'devolve' into an Eastern Front argument. These kinds of threads have a habit of straying of topic. I strive for detail and realism if I can, I'm just trying to start conversation here about potential issues while staying close to the reality of the situation. Sometimes here I have gotten off topic regarding plans versus reality, something that is a major issue in WW1 operations.

I understand.
 

Deleted member 1487

Any other ideas about how a Western Front offensive in 1915 would work?
 
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