"German" Belgium

Susano

Banned
What if Belgium and Limburg became part of the German Confederation like Luxemburg after the Treaty of Vienna, but still was part of Netherland?
How would this change history?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Kingdom_of_the_Netherlands

Well, then logically an independnat Belgium would most likely be part of the German Cofnederation, too. Barring butterflies preventing that war, that would mean that most likely belgium would take a side in the German War of 1866. Or any equivalent war, of course.

If they take the Prussian side and win, it may become part of the North German Cofnederation - and hence of the German Empire later on. If they dont become part of the NGC, they will most likely stay within the German Customs Association like Luxemburg did IOTL, not a great change but something. If they take the Prussian side and lose, then nothing, GC is restored and thats it, though a butterflied Austrian victory would of course drastically change the political future.

If they take the Austrian side and win, then again nothing, see above. If they tke the Austrian side and lose, thing sget intersting: Prussia might try to annex it, too, but there raethe french to consider, who are itching to intervene in some form, no matter how (hence Bismarcks fast peace with Austria, IOTL). They could take that as a pretext to intervene against Prussia, or maybe Prussia is quick enough there, too...

Before any inner-German war it would have little impact, though, IMO.
 

Valdemar II

Banned
One of the first changes I could see would be that the entire Liege and Luxembourg will become part of Belgium, like you Susano I doubt that Belgium will become annexs by Prussia, but I could see Belgium as a internal Kingdom in Germany, the other thing I think will happen are that the Flemish will think of themselves as Germans (in the same way Bavarians does), which will change the whole relationship beetween Wallon and Flanders
 

Susano

Banned
One of the first changes I could see would be that the entire Liege and Luxembourg will become part of Belgium, like you Susano I doubt that Belgium will become annexs by Prussia, but I could see Belgium as a internal Kingdom in Germany, the other thing I think will happen are that the Flemish will think of themselves as Germans (in the same way Bavarians does), which will change the whole relationship beetween Wallon and Flanders

The seocnd thing is not encessarily so, but I think that might happen. After all, they revolted against the Dutch, due to the cofnessional split, and might hence embrace Germany as an alternative identity to Dutch...

As for Belgium becoming an internal kingdom, if they dont side with a winning Prussia, as in one of my four scenarios, not encessarily. As said, they might then become independant but in customs union with Germany, as Luxemburg IOTL. Then again, if the Belgians do assume German identity the sam enationalist fervor that drove the South German states into the Prussian side in the Franco-German War might also happen in Belgium...
 

Valdemar II

Banned
The seocnd thing is not encessarily so, but I think that might happen. After all, they revolted against the Dutch, due to the cofnessional split, and might hence embrace Germany as an alternative identity to Dutch...

As for Belgium becoming an internal kingdom, if they dont side with a winning Prussia, as in one of my four scenarios, not encessarily. As said, they might then become independant but in customs union with Germany, as Luxemburg IOTL. Then again, if the Belgians do assume German identity the sam enationalist fervor that drove the South German states into the Prussian side in the Franco-German War might also happen in Belgium...

At least in north and East Belgium, but it's unlikely that, that will happens among the Francophone including the Elite, but there could be a interest in keeping France away by becoming a memberstate in Germany, as the choice of the lesser evil.
 
First I would like to say that this might change the Belgian war of independence. OTL neither Prussia nor Austria got involved, I believe this could change in this case.
The Netherlands did effectively beat Belgium in the early stages of the war, basicly up until the point that France got involved. The reason France got involved was because they hoped to annex Belgium (and the reason the UK got involved because they wanted to make sure France didn't). If Belgium was closer in the sphere of influence of both Prussia and Austria, which it would if all of it was in the German confederation, they might react if they see that France is trying to annex Belgium. I believe that Prussia as well as Austria were on good terms with the Netherlands, so they might support it instead of Belgian independence. It would not surprise me if the end result was that Belgium stays Dutch or if some kind of federation was formed between the Netherlands and Belgium.

Furthermore I don't think that (if Belgium becomes independent) they would consider themselves German. Certainly not the French speaking parts, which consisted not only of the Walloon population, but also the upperclass (and part of the middle class) Flemish people.
 

Susano

Banned
First I would like to say that this might change the Belgian war of independence. OTL neither Prussia nor Austria got involved, I believe this could change in this case.
The Netherlands did effectively beat Belgium in the early stages of the war, basicly up until the point that France got involved. The reason France got involved was because they hoped to annex Belgium (and the reason the UK got involved because they wanted to make sure France didn't). If Belgium was closer in the sphere of influence of both Prussia and Austria, which it would if all of it was in the German confederation, they might react if they see that France is trying to annex Belgium. I believe that Prussia as well as Austria were on good terms with the Netherlands, so they might support it instead of Belgian independence. It would not surprise me if the end result was that Belgium stays Dutch or if some kind of federation was formed between the Netherlands and Belgium.
Eh, Im not sure. If the part of the Netherlands thats inside teh GC rebells, wouldnt it, if the GC leading powers get involved, be more logical that they are truely for an independant belgium (as oppsoed to France and its expensionist wishes)? After all, the Netherlands is just halfway in, or kinda like Denmark whose King was member as Duke of Holstein and Lauenburg, but... well, as he was mainly King of Denmark he wasnt really in. Same would apply for the NL. So IF the GC powers intervene for teh sake of teh GC and their sphere of influence, it would most likely be on Belgian side.

Furthermore I don't think that (if Belgium becomes independent) they would consider themselves German. Certainly not the French speaking parts, which consisted not only of the Walloon population, but also the upperclass (and part of the middle class) Flemish people.
They didntr eally consider themselves French, either, though.
The problem was that theDutch-Belgian split was about religion. The Belgians didnt want to be Dutch, because their catholciism was supressed. Hence, they more or less invented a new identity, the Belgian one. However, if they are part of the GC, they dont need to invent a new one, they already have a premade one to pick up, so to say ;)
 
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