French Hegemony after Napoleon

hey, all. now that i've worked out a progression of the Napoloenic wars ending in a French hegemony that i'm satisfied with, i need to figure out what happens afterward. one thing i decided on for the TL a long time ago is that Napoleon still dies when he did IOTL--his death is officially attributed to stomach cancer but it's rumored through to the present-day that he was actually poisoned by assassins from a defeated nation--so now i need to figure out how the French administration deals with their empire after he dies. it will have to eventually end with alot of the French empire being cut back to nearly OTL French borders (except extending east to the Rhine and encompassing the Low Countries and Frisia) and the different client states becoming independent though (arguably) still within France's sphere of influence.

these are some other events to consider ITTL are:

  • the key turning point is at Leipzig: Napoleon's soldiers manage to capture Alexander I of Russia and Frederick Wilhelm III of Prussia--who both happen to be in the area at the time--which drives the Allies into confusion during the battle; the Allies get a Pyrrhic victory thanks to British involvement in the battle, but the war is lost to them
  • another Coalition War breaks out, though with France being the primary aggressor trying to attack every Coalition-member at once while simultaneously fighting back against Revolutionaries within their borders (eg, Napoleon's now the monarch with revolutions being sent up against him); there are no real French successes on any front in this war and it only ends when Napoleon dies. afterward, the French government arranges a peace with the Coalition for no clear victor in the war
  • the end of the war leads to a period of relative peace between France and the other European powers, which are all exhausted from the 7+ Coalition wars, though another technically breaks out: it's a cold war between France and Russia, who are each rising to the premier powers in Europe while Britain is growing more influential abroad. keep in mind that the Ottoman Empire is also falling into decline at this time and most of the Balkans are starting to gain independence

this map largely demonstrates what the French hegemony looks like ITTL, though there are some changes due to butterflies (Egypt, for instance, is also a French client)
First_French_Empire_1812.svg
 
They are going to lose Catalonia, Spanish rebels there were bad enough even without directly annexing parts of Spain.

I can't imagine them keeping the Netherlands for very long either.

Whats the fate of the Dutch far east if the Netherlands has been annexed by France?
 
Taiwan would probably eventually fall under Japanese control, assuming that Japan becomes expansionist. the Dutch East Indies are a little tricky: i could see them falling under either British or French influence, perhaps as a protectorate (though what i'd written originally was that they became independent, basically a Dutch government in exile, though that's probably more likely for a part of South Africa; retrospectively, considering the huge population and differences of culture in Indonesia, it's probably more likely that they become a protectorate, or several protectorates under France and its allies)
 
How does any of your POD's deal with Britain and Spain? Britain may become tired enough to accept French hegemony over continental europe, maybe. But they will keep everything overseas they have taken in that event, and no one else in Europe will have an overseas empire if they are affiliated with France. And France will not own Egypt. Not a chance. Can't support it, can't reinforce it, and the Ottomans want it back.
 
How does any of your POD's deal with Britain and Spain? Britain may become tired enough to accept French hegemony over continental europe, maybe. But they will keep everything overseas they have taken in that event, and no one else in Europe will have an overseas empire if they are affiliated with France. And France will not own Egypt. Not a chance. Can't support it, can't reinforce it, and the Ottomans want it back.
that's pretty much what i'm trying to figure out: what happens to France and the world around it after Napoleon dies and a weaker ruler/administration takes over? taking over French overseas possessions at that time would probably come to pass, but France didn't have many overseas possessions at the time; the Napoleonic Empire was mostly in Europe itself. for Egypt, remember that it's a client-state here; as France weakens, the client states will be reforming themselves and becoming more independent of France, including Egypt. even if they fall into the Ottoman sphere of influence again or are conquered, their identity has changed
 
DPFAR: how does everyone think the French hegemony would affect industrialization in continental Europe?
 
that's pretty much what i'm trying to figure out: what happens to France and the world around it after Napoleon dies and a weaker ruler/administration takes over? taking over French overseas possessions at that time would probably come to pass, but France didn't have many overseas possessions at the time; the Napoleonic Empire was mostly in Europe itself. for Egypt, remember that it's a client-state here; as France weakens, the client states will be reforming themselves and becoming more independent of France, including Egypt. even if they fall into the Ottoman sphere of influence again or are conquered, their identity has changed

What i mean is that the French did have possessions in the Caribbean, held by Britain, and the Dutch and the Spanish had large empires, loyal to the "government's in exile". I think the British might have accepted peace with France around 1811, if they had gotten out of Spain and Holland.
It didn't look like any of the continental powers were coming back to play, no matter how much money Britain waved around, and they were getting tired of war.

But post Russia, even if Napoleon wins at Leipzig, Spain is won by Wellington at that point, and France is exhausted in terms of manpower. Even with Alexander in tow, France cannot impose any terms on Russia that will last, so French hegemony in 1813 is going to be limited by definition. No Spain, peace with Russia maybe, and to get peace with Britain, they will have to give things up. If they keep Holland the British will get Holland's empire.

Also, how does a client state of France last in Egypt from Napoleon's invasion til 1813? Who is running it since he destroyed the mamelukes, the sea lanes are controlled by Britain, and the Ottomans are right there with a hundred thousand men? Plus the French never had the support of the Egyptians and faced constant revolt that had to be suppressed by the sword.
 
What i mean is that the French did have possessions in the Caribbean, held by Britain, and the Dutch and the Spanish had large empires, loyal to the "government's in exile". I think the British might have accepted peace with France around 1811, if they had gotten out of Spain and Holland.
It didn't look like any of the continental powers were coming back to play, no matter how much money Britain waved around, and they were getting tired of war.

But post Russia, even if Napoleon wins at Leipzig, Spain is won by Wellington at that point, and France is exhausted in terms of manpower. Even with Alexander in tow, France cannot impose any terms on Russia that will last, so French hegemony in 1813 is going to be limited by definition. No Spain, peace with Russia maybe, and to get peace with Britain, they will have to give things up. If they keep Holland the British will get Holland's empire.

Also, how does a client state of France last in Egypt from Napoleon's invasion til 1813? Who is running it since he destroyed the mamelukes, the sea lanes are controlled by Britain, and the Ottomans are right there with a hundred thousand men? Plus the French never had the support of the Egyptians and faced constant revolt that had to be suppressed by the sword.

butterflies, mainly; just for the purposes of this thread, ASSUME that anything that Napoleonic France would have had to do to establish a hegemony over western Europe and Egypt at least during Napoleon's lifetime DOES take place. NOW, what happens after Napoleon dies?
 
Butterflies can't tote boulders with those tiny wings.


But ok, Diadochi wars financed by Britain, and French hegemony explodes into the natural national divisions of europe.
 

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If Napoleon managed to win the war of 1813/14 (I wonder how it would be called in this world), he would do what he missed before: Break up Prussia and Austria. Unless the latter were smart enough to change sides, and he would forgive them.

In this case, several new nations (satellites of France) would keep the Germans in check.

This actually reminds me of France's post-WWI dreams of European hegemony.
 
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