France doesn't declare war on Austria in 1792, does Europe still go to war?

[TerranGames]

Admittedly, I don't know that much about this period, but as I understand it, the War of the First Coalition broke out because the Legislative Assembly, fearing invasion from Prussia and Austria after the declaration of Pillnitz, voted to preemptively declare war, even though, as I understand it, the Declaration was an empty threat because it would only go into effect if every major power in Europe, including Britain, declared war on France, and Leopold II only made it to satisfy the French Emigres who had fled the country (and made it, knowing that William Pitt, the British PM, did not support going to war with France.) It kinda takes the wind out of the sails of the whole "glorious revolution defending itself against reaction" narrative I've seen in a lot of historical and fantasy fiction set in this time period, because it was the revolutionaries who started the war. But was it really justified?

To put some wind back in those sails, say hypothetically, (because I know it's complicated, and there were many different political actors involved,) somehow, cooler heads prevail, and the Assembly doesn't vote to declare war on Austria, and despite all the internal politicking (I don't know how), they manage to avoid starting a war with anyone else, but the revolution continues to radicalize, the republic is proclaimed, and King Louis, maybe he's executed, maybe not, but my question is, does war still break out in Europe? Will the reactionary powers end up creating a coalition anyway, and try to crush France? Or does some kind of uneasy peace settle across the continent?

 

[raharris1973]

Admittedly, I don't know that much about this period, but as I understand it, the War of the First Coalition broke out because the Legislative Assembly, fearing invasion from Prussia and Austria after the declaration of Pillnitz, voted to preemptively declare war, even though, as I understand it, the Declaration was an empty threat because it would only go into effect if every major power in Europe, including Britain, declared war on France, and Leopold II only made it to satisfy the French Emigres who had fled the country (and made it, knowing that William Pitt, the British PM, did not support going to war with France.) It kinda takes the wind out of the sails of the whole "glorious revolution defending itself against reaction" narrative I've seen in a lot of historical and fantasy fiction set in this time period, because it was the revolutionaries who started the war. But was it really justified?

To put some wind back in those sails, say hypothetically, (because I know it's complicated, and there were many different political actors involved,) somehow, cooler heads prevail, and the Assembly doesn't vote to declare war on Austria, and despite all the internal politicking (I don't know how), they manage to avoid starting a war with anyone else, but the revolution continues to radicalize, the republic is proclaimed, and King Louis, maybe he's executed, maybe not, but my question is, does war still break out in Europe? Will the reactionary powers end up creating a coalition anyway, and try to crush France? Or does some kind of uneasy peace settle across the continent?

Great question.

Easy, lazy answer is French revolutionary politics would never allow this to happen. I still call it too easy and lazy, even if also most plausible and likely to be true! I would be interested in seeing the prompt honestly played out and then seeing the reactions of the various powers of Europe, how they act toward France and whether it can avoid exceed the boundaries of revolutionary France's patience, and also whether revolutionary France's internal radicalism, proclamations, propaganda, and cheerleading and practical assistance of likeminded groups and individuals abroad can avoid exceeding what the other powers of Europe can peacefully tolerate.

 

[raharris1973]

I can't believe there's been only one response to this. This is seminal European history stuff.

 

[Nivek]

I can't believe there's been only one response to this. This is seminal European history stuff.

People don't know enough of the topic to answer. or that all other question will lead to the lazy answer that Austria will declare war instead giving france a just causes bellis?

 

[Onkel Willie]

I admittedly only have basic knowledge about this part of history. Would Austria leave revolutionary France alone if Louis XVI and Marie Antoinette don't get amputated from the neck down?

 

[SlyDessertFox]

To put some wind back in those sails, say hypothetically, (because I know it's complicated, and there were many different political actors involved,) somehow, cooler heads prevail, and the Assembly doesn't vote to declare war on Austria, and despite all the internal politicking (I don't know how), they manage to avoid starting a war with anyone else, but the revolution continues to radicalize, the republic is proclaimed, and King Louis, maybe he's executed, maybe not, but my question is, does war still break out in Europe? Will the reactionary powers end up creating a coalition anyway, and try to crush France? Or does some kind of uneasy peace settle across the continent?

I think the answer depends entirely on if Louis XVI is executed. If he is executed, Austria and Prussia might feel compelled to act, but if he is not I can see them foregoing war.

 

[Comte de Geneve]

After Varennes, Louis was certainly going to be executed and probably M-A as well. Austria and Prussia are not going to tolerate the existence of a regicide republic. That means war. If they do escape, there will probably be a war to reinstate them, especially after Leopold dies and Franz becomes Emperor. The very existence of a militantly Republican France was intolerable to Louis' brother monarchs.

 

[Insane Ranter]

My understanding is that this period in Europe was the old conservative monarchies feeling threatened by the liberal revolutions (France mainly) in Europe possibly popping up and removing them from power. Austria, Prussia, and Russia, I think England was wary but they were more of a monarchy tied with a parliament and George at least was ok with a Constitutional Monarchy. If I remember as well Austria and Prussia had put down revolutions of their own shortly after the French Revolution. You also had things like Leopold was concerned about his sister Marie Antoinette.

Is there war with France? Probably at some point especially when the French are wandering off into bordering states and taking them over like Comtat Venaissin. My understanding is the French Revolution was a major turning point of the entrance of more liberal ideas into a very conservative monarchies of old.

 

[HIM Dogson]

My understanding is that this period in Europe was the old conservative monarchies feeling threatened by the liberal revolutions (France mainly) in Europe possibly popping up and removing them from power. Austria, Prussia, and Russia, I think England was wary but they were more of a monarchy tied with a parliament and George at least was ok with a Constitutional Monarchy. If I remember as well Austria and Prussia had put down revolutions of their own shortly after the French Revolution. You also had things like Leopold was concerned about his sister Marie Antoinette.

Is there war with France? Probably at some point especially when the French are wandering off into bordering states and taking them over like Comtat Venaissin. My understanding is the French Revolution was a major turning point of the entrance of more liberal ideas into a very conservative monarchies of old.

I don't believe there were attempts at revolution in Austria or Prussia so soon after the French Revolution.

Forgive me for going against the premise of the question, but had France not gone to war the radicalization of the Revolution would have at the very least not played out in the same way. Military defeat played a huge role in radicalization so I don't know that you'd even get something like August 10 in the same way without the war. Really hard to know how the Austrians or Prussians would react without a firmer handle on what would be going on in France.

 

[Insane Ranter]

I don't believe there were attempts at revolution in Austria or Prussia so soon after the French Revolution.

Forgive me for going against the premise of the question, but had France not gone to war the radicalization of the Revolution would have at the very least not played out in the same way. Military defeat played a huge role in radicalization so I don't know that you'd even get something like August 10 in the same way without the war. Really hard to know how the Austrians or Prussians would react without a firmer handle on what would be going on in France.

I guess I was referring to the revolutions of 1848. This isn't my area of expertise. So I was trying to go on memory and got things mixed up!! My apologies!

 

[unprincipled peter]

Louis XIV

it is Louis XVI

XIV was the Sun King a century earlier.

 

[SlyDessertFox]

it is Louis XVI

XIV was the Sun King a century earlier.

That's what I get for posting while tired.

 

[unprincipled peter]

It's a tough question to answer. Most general level web sources simply put it as the French revolutionaries looking to solidify their hold by channeling French attention to an external war, coupled with them seeing the Pillnitz Declaration as evidence that war was coming, so they got out in front of it.

As commented above, we need to see if butterflies alter XVI's fate. IF he is still executed on schedule, I would guess that there will be severe reactions by other nations. I'd put my money on war still happening.