France backs USA in War of 1812

What would the outcome be if Napoleonic France backs the United States instead of heading to Russia? Could France and it's allies get Force's to support the US? The purpose of Napoleon helping the US was to cause the UK to place a bigger Garrison force in Canada after the war to lower their involvement in Europe.(have UK focus on NA)
Without the Russian fiasco would the collapse of Napoleonic France be as fast? How would Europe and the world change?
 

Md139115

Banned
How? France has no navy, so it can't send an army to North America even if it wanted to, and it isn't as though it could have seriously tied down British forces on the Continent any more than what it was doing in Spain. Really, there is no feasible way that Napoleon could help the US more than what it was doing already, and it is worth noting that Napoleon seriously thought that attacking Britain's biggest trade partner that he could reach (Russia) was the best possible way he could hurt them.
 
How? France has no navy, so it can't send an army to North America even if it wanted to, and it isn't as though it could have seriously tied down British forces on the Continent any more than what it was doing in Spain. Really, there is no feasible way that Napoleon could help the US more than what it was doing already, and it is worth noting that Napoleon seriously thought that attacking Britain's biggest trade partner that he could reach (Russia) was the best possible way he could hurt them.

One possible way would be Napoleon personally heading down with a detachment of the Grand Armee into Spain in order to harshly pursue the Peninsular Campaign. If you force the British to focus in on protecting Portugal from a French invasion and maintaining a foothold on the Continent (As well as keep the Ulser bleeding to help convince Eastern Europe that there's a chance of winning if they turn on Nappy) than they can't afford to send resources to the New World. Though, in that case the bigger POD is the change from the 19th century equivilent of Barbarossa to a Med. Strategy.
 
How? France has no navy, so it can't send an army to North America even if it wanted to, and it isn't as though it could have seriously tied down British forces on the Continent any more than what it was doing in Spain. Really, there is no feasible way that Napoleon could help the US more than what it was doing already, and it is worth noting that Napoleon seriously thought that attacking Britain's biggest trade partner that he could reach (Russia) was the best possible way he could hurt them.
Could Napoleon maybe promise Russia parts of Canada to try and apeaes Russia? Maybe give Russia parts of the Duchy of Warsaw? The purpose was mainly to bide time to get good terms for France. The troops marked to Russia could be used for Spain. By allying with the US it hopes to get troops sent away from it's front lines. It might even temporary limits the trade of the UK with another nation. The hopes of Napoleon would be to make Russia happy enough in the short term to focus on Spain. Napoleon could settle for a kingdom of Navarre buffer state between them and Spain.(maybe ask for Gibraltar for Spain)
 
The problem isn't the amount of troops in France, it's the lack of food for them. Napoleon and logistics didn't exactly have the best relationship and something like the Grand Army in Spain would have been in dire straits. Really, you can't get Napoleon doing much more than OTL. And he isn't going to give over parts of his Duchy of Warsaw to Russia for love nor money.
 
In theory, a good idea, in practice, a very very bad one. Had France (for whatever reason) decided to, say, send a squadron to the US to stymie the British and it actually got there and the Americans accepted it, there would be hell to pay.

Simply put, rather than seeing the war as side show, the British would now be committed to smashing the USN and its French friends, as well as stomping the US hard wherever it could. More resources to the Great Lakes, more troops spared from Spain and elsewhere (maybe earlier) and the campaigns of 1814 are pursued hard. The treaty of Ghent from OTL? Nope, even the Russians might balk at giving diplomatic cover to the US if they've allied themselves to the man who had begun invading their country.

It would be a waste of French resources, and a diplomatic disaster which gave neither nation a major benefit.
 
Could Napoleon maybe promise Russia parts of Canada to try and apeaes Russia? Maybe give Russia parts of the Duchy of Warsaw? The purpose was mainly to bide time to get good terms for France. The troops marked to Russia could be used for Spain. By allying with the US it hopes to get troops sent away from it's front lines. It might even temporary limits the trade of the UK with another nation. The hopes of Napoleon would be to make Russia happy enough in the short term to focus on Spain. Napoleon could settle for a kingdom of Navarre buffer state between them and Spain.(maybe ask for Gibraltar for Spain)

Russia would not be interested in getting a piece of Canada because at that time it did not have too much use even of Alaska. Duchy of Warsaw would seems not quite realistic because Nappy wanted the Polish troops but an idea is interesting.

How about not insisting upon Russian adherence to the Continental System and not invading Russia? This would remove one of the underlying tension points and put Russia into unfavorable strategic situation for attack because Russian army was not ready for a big scale offensive war in 1812 and Nappy could get enough time to deal with the Brits in Spain and Portugal by using only a part of the forces engaged in OTL Russian campaign while leaving the rest in Prussia and Poland under command of Davout to guard against possible Russian attack (for which they would have something like 200 - 250K).
 
Top