For All Time AMA
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>2009: American Confederation, currently under Libertarian management.
Can we get this elaborated upon?
Can we get this elaborated upon?
@gentboss This is my dream! (I'm the guy who's writing the wiki about For All Time. That's still on, by the way! Here's a link if you want to check it out.)
1. Enoch Powell is mentioned as Prime Minister of the United Kingdom post-English Secession, but Powell was an Englishman and would therefore likely be more at home in the sovereign England. Did he score this position due to his associations with Ulster later on in his career?
2. Were there a lot of rumblings about an African man being put in charge of Metropolitan France in the 1960s? (With the much, much more turbulent French experience in the mid-twentieth century, I doubt the FaTL French people had very tolerant racial views at the time).
3. What happened to Eisenhower ITTL? He's mentioned once as being involved in the Manhattan Project, and is never heard from again. Did he simply fade into obscurity?
4. How did Chikatilo get into a position where he could ascend to power? Was he in charge of the KGB or something like that?
5. Whatever happened to the Collective Security Organization and the United Peacekeeping Council after the McGovern Presidency? Did they still function or did they just kind of fade away without their main patron?
And now for some less-technical questions:
5. What motivated you to write For All Time? Did you intend for the world to devolve into the hellhole that is FaT circa 1980, or did you start out with the expectation that things would just kind of be shoddier and worse in the 20th century following FDR's death?
6. Was it tough to research? I have a hard time now writing alternate history in the information age. I can't imagine what it must have been like to try and research relatively obscure figures like Lazar Kaganovich, Delgado Chalbaud and Joe Foss in the days when Wikipedia was in its infancy.
Can't wait to hear back from you. And a thousand congratulations on sending a book to the publisher! I've always thought biographies are some of the most interesting books out there, incredibly cool you were able to "Wright" one.
1. Enoch Powell is mentioned as Prime Minister of the United Kingdom post-English Secession, but Powell was an Englishman and would therefore likely be more at home in the sovereign England. Did he score this position due to his associations with Ulster later on in his career?
2. Were there a lot of rumblings about an African man being put in charge of Metropolitan France in the 1960s? (With the much, much more turbulent French experience in the mid-twentieth century, I doubt the FaTL French people had very tolerant racial views at the time).
3. What happened to Eisenhower ITTL? He's mentioned once as being involved in the Manhattan Project, and is never heard from again. Did he simply fade into obscurity?
4. How did Chikatilo get into a position where he could ascend to power? Was he in charge of the KGB or something like that?
5. Whatever happened to the Collective Security Organization and the United Peacekeeping Council after the McGovern Presidency? Did they still function or did they just kind of fade away without their main patron?
And now for some less-technical questions:
5. What motivated you to write For All Time? Did you intend for the world to devolve into the hellhole that is FaT circa 1980, or did you start out with the expectation that things would just kind of be shoddier and worse in the 20th century following FDR's death?
6. Was it tough to research? I have a hard time now writing alternate history in the information age. I can't imagine what it must have been like to try and research relatively obscure figures like Lazar Kaganovich, Delgado Chalbaud and Joe Foss in the days when Wikipedia was in its infancy.
Can't wait to hear back from you. And a thousand congratulations on sending a book to the publisher! I've always thought biographies are some of the most interesting books out there, incredibly cool you were able to "Wright" one.
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I can take this one.
Henry Wallace/Vacant (Democratic) 1941—45
Robert Taft/George Aiken [1945—49], Thomas Dewey [1949—50] (Republican) 1945—50
1944 def. Alben Barkley/Sheridan Downey (Democratic), Henry Wallace/Jay Hormel (Progressive)
1948 def. Paul McNutt/Pat McCarran (Democratic)
Thomas Dewey/Vacant (Republican) 1950—53
Joseph Kennedy, Jr./Lyndon B. Johnson [1953—61], Robert La Follette, Jr. [1961—62] (Democratic) 1953—Jan. 1962
1952 def. Thomas Dewey/John Bricker (Republican), 1956 def. John Bricker/Earl Warren (Republican), 1960 def. Harold Stassen/Prescott Bush (Republican)
Robert La Follette, Jr./Clark Gable (Democratic) Jan. 1962—Dec. 1962
Clark Gable/Matthew Ridgway (Democratic/Independent) Dec. 1962—65
Barry Goldwater/William Scranton (Republican) 1965—69
1964 def. Lyndon B. Johnson/Ed Brown (Democratic)
Joe Foss/Hal Warren* (Republican) 1969—73
1968 def. Alan Cranston/William Brennan (Democratic)
George McGovern/??? (Democratic) 1973—77
1972 def. ???/??? (Charles Percy, Rock Hudson, Jim Rhodes, Hal Warren?) (Republican)
Jim Jones/Daniel Patrick Moynihan [1977—78], ??? [1978—80] (Democratic) 1977—80
1976 def. Charles Manson/??? (Republican), 1980 def. Charles Manson/Lyndon LaRouche (Republican) John Anderson/Eugene McCarthy (Independent)
Al Haig/??? (Republican [?]) 1980—90
1984 def. ???, 1988 def. ???
Slade Gorton/??? [1990—97], Robert Torricelli [1997—2001] (Republican/Democratic) 1990—2001
1992 def. ???, 1996 def. ???
Russ Feingold/Pat Buchanan (Republican) 2001—
2000 def. ???
*This guy.
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I think Jones basically killed the Dems, coupled with a 10-year military government by Haig. Probably everyone who wanted to get anywhere had to be a Republican.
1. So, what happened with Norman Borlaug ttl? I'm guessing his dying young is another of FAT's Problems? Would fit the whole "world circling the drain and getting worse until early-mid 21st century" theme you have going.
2. So, how do you think ttl's global warming and oil/coal peak situations compare to OTL? asking since you mentioned this.
3. Overall tech level of FAT compared to OTL? I imagine several decades behind due to effort being put into ah ratholes/flashy but useless tech(dynasoar)
This isn't FAT-related directly but I figure since you're one of the bigger names in online AH, if anyone has a shot at this it's you: If you know someone or even just know someone close to someone working in google, preferably related to google groups could you see if you could get a complete copy of soc.history.what-if's messages/threads for us and upload it to google drive/megaupload please? Since google blocked access to SHWI back in april because of spam we've lost all access too pre-mid 2003 messages for it.
2. So, how do you think ttl's global warming and oil/coal peak situations compare to OTL? asking since you mentioned this.
3. Overall tech level of FAT compared to OTL? I imagine several decades behind due to effort being put into ah ratholes/flashy but useless tech(dynasoar)
This isn't FAT-related directly but I figure since you're one of the bigger names in online AH, if anyone has a shot at this it's you: If you know someone or even just know someone close to someone working in google, preferably related to google groups could you see if you could get a complete copy of soc.history.what-if's messages/threads for us and upload it to google drive/megaupload please? Since google blocked access to SHWI back in april because of spam we've lost all access too pre-mid 2003 messages for it.
if you can do this, please do the same for both alt.history.what-if and alt.history.future
1. Mm! Never gave Borlaug any thought. I'd put him somewhere in Mexico, breeding a better strain of wheat. It might never occur to the people of the world to go international with it, since it's a nastier, colder sort of place.
2. Environmental damage - well there's more in the ground, I guess, but things still aren't great. The world's economic development was notably slowed.
3. Tech levels are notably behind ours - I would guess it would feel like the early 90s if you looked at it now.
Buchanan and Feingold wound up in the same party in the political realignment post-Haig, yeah. Both were (as far as my political understanding of the day when I wrote FAT) radical outsiders on the edge of contemporary politics. By 'now' they've probably had a falling-out.
I have nothing but praise for the maps; while I might not agree with all the borders, somebody worked hard doing art and I am not one to gainsay them.
1. Enoch Powell is mentioned as Prime Minister - look I'll be honest with you, when I wrote the thing I was a college undergraduate and didn't always do a lot of research. The Ulster connection makes a lot of sense, though.
2. Were there a lot of rumblings about an African man - you bet! Bokassa had ways of dealing with his critics, though.
3. What happened to Eisenhower - just a minor staff officer in the ATL who then retired. The 'force' just wasn't with him.
4. How did Chikatilo - I don't recall! I'd have to go back and look.
5. Whatever happened to the Collective Security Organization - hard to turn them off once they were established (collective security agencies are super-useful), but they've probably had periods where they didn't matter at all.
5. What motivated you to write For All Time? - originally it was just to replace a good President with a bad one, then it was the result of an effort to see how plausibly bad I could make the 20th century. That's why there was no WWIII, despite the occasional small nuclear war - just a nuclear war would be too easy!
6. Was it tough to research? - yes it was! This is why I tell my students that they don't know how lucky they have it now.
2. Environmental damage - well there's more in the ground, I guess, but things still aren't great. The world's economic development was notably slowed.
3. Tech levels are notably behind ours - I would guess it would feel like the early 90s if you looked at it now.
Buchanan and Feingold wound up in the same party in the political realignment post-Haig, yeah. Both were (as far as my political understanding of the day when I wrote FAT) radical outsiders on the edge of contemporary politics. By 'now' they've probably had a falling-out.
I have nothing but praise for the maps; while I might not agree with all the borders, somebody worked hard doing art and I am not one to gainsay them.
1. Enoch Powell is mentioned as Prime Minister - look I'll be honest with you, when I wrote the thing I was a college undergraduate and didn't always do a lot of research. The Ulster connection makes a lot of sense, though.
2. Were there a lot of rumblings about an African man - you bet! Bokassa had ways of dealing with his critics, though.
3. What happened to Eisenhower - just a minor staff officer in the ATL who then retired. The 'force' just wasn't with him.
4. How did Chikatilo - I don't recall! I'd have to go back and look.
5. Whatever happened to the Collective Security Organization - hard to turn them off once they were established (collective security agencies are super-useful), but they've probably had periods where they didn't matter at all.
5. What motivated you to write For All Time? - originally it was just to replace a good President with a bad one, then it was the result of an effort to see how plausibly bad I could make the 20th century. That's why there was no WWIII, despite the occasional small nuclear war - just a nuclear war would be too easy!
6. Was it tough to research? - yes it was! This is why I tell my students that they don't know how lucky they have it now.
I would think there wouldn't be a Libertarian movement in the ATL, since the Kochs could just buy their way into friendship with the Haig junta rather than funding a pet political party. But I've written enough fanfic that I don't want to wreck anybody's head canon.
As for the 21st century, yeah, well, I won't get too political but let's just say the last few years would fit in pretty nicely. Though I doubt I'd have put the current administration in FaT - too unrealistic!
Religion - all sorts of interesting cults in the ATL! Some of them might not even be evil. Modern science has proven itself pretty evil.
As for the 21st century, yeah, well, I won't get too political but let's just say the last few years would fit in pretty nicely. Though I doubt I'd have put the current administration in FaT - too unrealistic!
Religion - all sorts of interesting cults in the ATL! Some of them might not even be evil. Modern science has proven itself pretty evil.
So, what happens with the reputation of eugenics in ttl? More of germany occupied by the reds in ttl, so no americans seeing the camps so i imagine eugenics would be more respectable.
I would think there wouldn't be a Libertarian movement in the ATL, since the Kochs could just buy their way into friendship with the Haig junta rather than funding a pet political party. But I've written enough fanfic that I don't want to wreck anybody's head canon.
The libertarian movement IOTL wasn’t all that reliant on the Kochs. Yeah their money helped fund Cato and early LP but there were plenty of elements of the movement outside their sphere. Hell the paleolibertarian subset is outright hostile to the Kochs.
What do you teach? I assume it's history-related. Have any of your students had an interest in AH and found out that you wrote For All Time?
By the way, what happened to George Wallace ITTL? I don't recall him ever being mentioned.
RousseauX
Donor
what does the democratic-republican ideological alignment look like around 2000 FAT?
where is bernie sanders?
Gentboss may contradict this, but from what I've gathered the Republican Party around 2000 is a very big tent, including arch-conservatives such as Buchanan, libertarians like L. Neil Smith, and outright liberals/progressives like Feingold and Robert Reich. The Democratic Party, on the other hand, seems to be decidedly conservative: David Souter, Jacques Chirac and alt-Bill Clinton are seen as leading contenders for the Presidential nomination in 2004, and Robert Torricelli is seen as "pretty liberal for a Democrat".
The epilogue makes mention of President Feingold's "Attorney General Sanders" in 2000. Not explicitly confirmed that it's Bernie, but I'd say it's a good guess.
@gentboss are you still interested in continuing this thread? If so I have a couple more questions:
- By the “present” in the FaTL, Australia is governed by a (fictional) fellow named Charles Yu, whose government is “firm but fair”. Is it authoritarian, but relatively benevolent to its people, like, say, Mexico IOTL from the 1940s to the 1980s?
- What’s the status of Tibet ITTL? I assume they were conquered by the CCP in the early ‘50s as OTL. Did they gain a sort of autonomy after the Chinese government fell amid the nuclear hellfire?
- How exactly did the Soviet Civil War go? After Chikatilo was exposed as the maniac he was, did half the army suddenly find out about it and, horrified, abscond with much of the Soviet nuclear arsenal and launch it all across the Soviet bloc once it was clear that Chikatilo’s factions were still in support of him (somehow)?
- By the “present” in the FaTL, Australia is governed by a (fictional) fellow named Charles Yu, whose government is “firm but fair”. Is it authoritarian, but relatively benevolent to its people, like, say, Mexico IOTL from the 1940s to the 1980s?
- What’s the status of Tibet ITTL? I assume they were conquered by the CCP in the early ‘50s as OTL. Did they gain a sort of autonomy after the Chinese government fell amid the nuclear hellfire?
- How exactly did the Soviet Civil War go? After Chikatilo was exposed as the maniac he was, did half the army suddenly find out about it and, horrified, abscond with much of the Soviet nuclear arsenal and launch it all across the Soviet bloc once it was clear that Chikatilo’s factions were still in support of him (somehow)?