With a POD after 1901, when, how, and where would the fall of the US government be the most plausible? This is for a Tl I plan to do in a few months. I thought that it might be good during the Hoover years, or during some other Depression president. Anyone else have ideas?
Fall of the US government after 1901?
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Well, the problem i could see with that scenario might be that the US is very isolated by the conflict. Even if it lost, the US is still intact and unoccupied.
Delvestius
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I think an interesting POD would be if William Jennings Bryan had been elected president in 1896 and implemented the policy of Free Silver he ran on. This may have created an economic collapse, as the United States, especially the farmers of the Midwest, was still reeling from the Great Panic of 1893. It's shaky at best, and a collapse probably won't happen until the first decade of the twentieth century, but it's possible I suppose.
It's really not.
Before WWI, the demonization of the left and the later Red Scares Socialism was not viewed as a nearly universal bad thing, the Socialist Party of America had two members of Congress (later ones were unconstitutionally barred from serving), dozens of mayors and many members of state legislators, something no other third party has ever managed.
Eugene Debbs also received 6% of the vote in the 1912 Presidential elections and (while reduced) won 3.4% of the 1920 elections depsite widespread demonization and their unpopular opposition to WWI.
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How would the Socialists take power? I need help with the POD, as that's the main reason why my TLs haven't worked out.
Well the first step is the WWI issue.
The SPA opposed America's entry into it, having viewed it as 'a war between Imperialists' that America, as a country valugin liberty, democracy and equality should have nothing to do with.
Now, by the time it was clear that the Entente was going to win the public had shifted to support, while the SPA continued its position, so either get the American public to continue their oposition to it or have the SPA change their position early on, perhaps under the idea that 'through winning this war we can kill Imperialism and Free the World'.
Another related thing was that that the Congress pased the Espionage and Sedition Acts, which basically (at the time) made it illegal for a group or a politican to question or oppose the war while the United States was involved in it and generally massively limited freedom of speech, so you'd have to find a way around that as well.
Now, if you can find solutions to the above than with the SPA remaining a force in politics, it will inevitably become popular during the Great Depression., even if, as per OTL FDR steals their ideas and implements weakened versions to try and make them less popular.
6% is very far away from 45%-60% of the popular vote, mate.
As for OT: I thought at first you meant having an American party lose power and a new coalition would have to be formed but then I realised that the US isn't a Parliamentary system.
p)Free silver or the Great Depression are your main tickets I'm thinking.
6% is very far away from 45%-60% of the popular vote, mate.
The SPA was only founded in 1901.
I doubt their are more than a dozen parties throughout history anywhere in the world (that were'nt older parties just rebranded) that have ever been that popular by that point in established democracies.
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6% was their peak if I am not mistaken, so I don't see how they are relevant.
That was their highest in a Presidential election, it was'nt their electoral peak.
But that aside, as I said, the government basically did everything it could to make sure they could never become a major power, ranging from the immoral, but technicaly legal to the outright unconstitutional (and ignoring the SCOTUS even after it told them to stop).
Do you guys think that maybe the Hoovervilles could explode into rebellion? Or maybe the Ludlow Massacre goes too far?
6% isn't bad when you're going against the Republicans, Democrats, and Teddy Roosevelt in the same election.
American governments can't "fall". They can be overthrown in a Revolution or coup (both of which are so unlikely as to require at least some sort of divine intervention) but they can't, like a Parliamentary government, fall.
There is no such thing as "no confidence" or "calling for early elections" in U.S. law. You vote every two years and live with the result until the next election which WILL occur in two years (once an election is held in the middle of an all out Civil War things are fairly well established).
There is no such thing as "no confidence" or "calling for early elections" in U.S. law. You vote every two years and live with the result until the next election which WILL occur in two years (once an election is held in the middle of an all out Civil War things are fairly well established).
Well, I didn't mean it in the sense of a "vote of no confidence" kind of fall, but more of a "burning in anarchy and destruction" kind of fall. I'm American, and i had no idea that British governments use the word "fall" when they receive a vote of no cofidence, but there you have it.
I'm not totally sure, but I think all the Parliamentary countries use the term 'fall', or a word similar to it in their respective languages.
The Republicans were founded in 1854 and ran John Fremont in 1856 and came in second and won the election in 1860 with Abe Lincoln. That is a LOT higher than 6%.