Failed Columbus - Effects on Europe?

I am aware that a failed Columbus expedition and its effects on the Americas has been done to death, but I'm not certain the immediate effects on Europe have been fully explored.

I ask because of a recent interest in a map made by Mumby recently and a desire to explore a similar scenario. So, in the event that Columbus doesn't come back from the West Indies with tales of 'India', and the Americas are discovered instead by Giovanni Cabotto or a Portuguese reaching Brazil, what happens in Europe? I mean, the Americas were a huge source of bounty for Spain. It is likely they may still yet recieve this bounty, but for the sake of this scenario, let's suppose that the Portuguese, rather than bumping into Brazil a decade after the OTL reaching of the Americas, bump into the West Indies and encounter the Amerindians there themselves.

So if Portugal is recieving the wealth of gold and sugar from the Americas, how does this affect Spain, and Europe as a whole?

Forgive me, but I won't be able to revisit this thread until tomorrow, so if anyone has any questions about the plausibility of my idea, please bear with it and if anything is glaringly implausible, I ask that you might look past that and explore the butterflies (for instance, when one supposes how Sealion victory might have actually looked rather than whether Sealion could be victorious or not).
 
I am aware that a failed Columbus expedition and its effects on the Americas has been done to death, but I'm not certain the immediate effects on Europe have been fully explored.

I ask because of a recent interest in a map made by Mumby recently and a desire to explore a similar scenario. So, in the event that Columbus doesn't come back from the West Indies with tales of 'India', and the Americas are discovered instead by Giovanni Cabotto or a Portuguese reaching Brazil, what happens in Europe? I mean, the Americas were a huge source of bounty for Spain. It is likely they may still yet recieve this bounty, but for the sake of this scenario, let's suppose that the Portuguese, rather than bumping into Brazil a decade after the OTL reaching of the Americas, bump into the West Indies and encounter the Amerindians there themselves.

So if Portugal is recieving the wealth of gold and sugar from the Americas, how does this affect Spain, and Europe as a whole?

Forgive me, but I won't be able to revisit this thread until tomorrow, so if anyone has any questions about the plausibility of my idea, please bear with it and if anything is glaringly implausible, I ask that you might look past that and explore the butterflies (for instance, when one supposes how Sealion victory might have actually looked rather than whether Sealion could be victorious or not).

I had Spain put its energies into the Mediterranean and establish a not unsuccessful empire there, beating the Ottomans to the Barbary States in a sort of prolonged Reconquista.
 

mowque

Banned
Portugal claims a bunch and....Spain invades Portugal? Crazy but maybe it might make sense. Easier then trying to go all the way over to the other side of the world to dispute the claims, maybe just just twist some arms back home?
 
Portugal claims a bunch and....Spain invades Portugal? Crazy but maybe it might make sense. Easier then trying to go all the way over to the other side of the world to dispute the claims, maybe just just twist some arms back home?
Or Portugal claims the Crown of Aragon and Crown of Castile since they are powerful and the Habsburgs are far away.
 
I had Spain put its energies into the Mediterranean and establish a not unsuccessful empire there, beating the Ottomans to the Barbary States in a sort of prolonged Reconquista.

How far might Spain go? Is there a chance they may try to become a sort of revived Rome and maybe claim the Papacy?

Portugal claims a bunch and....Spain invades Portugal? Crazy but maybe it might make sense. Easier then trying to go all the way over to the other side of the world to dispute the claims, maybe just just twist some arms back home?

Perhaps, but I suspect Portugal isn't going to make their findings known until they have a strong base in the Americas. And assuming Spain takes a more Mediterranean approach as Mumby suggests, will they truly bother with Portugal?

Or Portugal claims the Crown of Aragon and Crown of Castile since they are powerful and the Habsburgs are far away.

What is the basis of Portugal's claims?
 
but I suspect Portugal isn't going to make their findings known until they have a strong base in the Americas.
In OTL French pirates robbed Portugal's lands (and ships) from about 1504.
What is the basis of Portugal's claims?
By Peace of Alcáçovas-Toledo, of 4.09.1479:
Castile saw recognized its rights over the Canary islands while Portugal won the exclusive right of navigating, conquering and trading in all the Atlantic ocean south of the Canary islands.

I tried to write a detailed TL (POD: Columb sunk, when he returned in 1493), but I was unsuccessful, because not good in this time and didn't understand effects well.
I can write my thoughts, if you interested.
 

Hnau

Banned
We've discussed this a bit a few months ago in this thread detailing a failed Columbian expedition.

Butterflies in the Italian Wars are the first things to really matter in Europe. No syphilis outbreak means the French are able to pull their army back relatively unscathed which is huge. It also means the Italian city-states aren't decimated. Of course, syphilis will still sweep cross Europe when the Portuguese start exploring around Brazil, but it will be delayed by some years (we said a decade).

Aztec gold and Incan silver didn't really start enriching the Spanish until the 1520s and 1530s. The Portuguese may never see those riches, after all, even if they discover the Americas it doesn't mean they'll be able to topple both of those empires. But the Spanish will certainly be poorer, which means a less impressive performance in the Italian Wars. Interestingly enough, they might do slightly better in the Italian Wars before the 1520s because they'll have thousands of more soldiers that would've been in the Caribbean otherwise. I don't know if that'd be enough to make a difference but it might.

The introduction of the potato will be delayed, and as such the demographic surge that followed its European adoption will be delayed.
 
How far might Spain go? Is there a chance they may try to become a sort of revived Rome and maybe claim the Papacy?

I don't see them getting that far, and I should imagine they will run out of steam not long after getting past Tunisia. The condescending view of Moors by the Spanish may result in several kingdoms as vassals to Spain in North Africa under loyal generals. While successes in the Italian wars as mentioned above may help solidify Spanish rule over the region, a lot of energy will be absorbed by holding down the Muslim population. After all, they can't exactly deport them.
 
Regarding Sea-Lion,

My thoughts on this would be that Adolpho Hitler, first Minister to the Hapsburg Emperor would still wish to mount a seabourne invasion of the United Crowns of England, Ireland and France, but this time probably from the Faroe & Scilly Islands. He would of course utilise their time honed seamen skills to outfox the defenders, no doubt bloated like fattened lambs fresh from the trough of Incan gold.
 
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