Europea Empire

I was reading "Girl Genius" Yesterday, and it was talking about the Baron Forming His Empire out of "Simple Bloody Refusal to face the difficulty".
I got to thinking - ?Was there anyway a country in Europe had the Resources & Ability to Conquer and set up a European Empire in the post Napoleon 1800's?
 

archaeogeek

Banned
I was reading "Girl Genius" Yesterday, and it was talking about the Baron Forming His Empire out of "Simple Bloody Refusal to face the difficulty".
I got to thinking - ?Was there anyway a country in Europe had the Resources & Ability to Conquer and set up a European Empire in the post Napoleon 1800's?

No, there wasn't.
No, not even Britain, britwankers
 
Britain surrenders in the second world war.
In the year 1946 the USSR is the undisputed master of most of Europe.
 
nazi germany almost did. suppose they hadnt declared war on the USA and left Japan to handle them alone, they might have been able to pull it off.

and then there is the USSR, but I think that's mostly just cold war scare
 

archaeogeek

Banned
nazi germany almost did. suppose they hadnt declared war on the USA and left Japan to handle them alone, they might have been able to pull it off.

Yeah, if only the Russians had kindly surrendered like the untermenschen they were :rolleyes:
Germany didn't come "close to pulling it off", it was stopped dead in its tracks in front of Moscow.
 
AAH Fellows --This is the PRE 1900 Forum.
I was kinda thinking - one of the 1848 revolutions goes "French Revolution", and throws up a Napoleonic figure to lead his country to Empire.
 
AAH Fellows --This is the PRE 1900 Forum.
I was kinda thinking - one of the 1848 revolutions goes "French Revolution", and throws up a Napoleonic figure to lead his country to Empire.

You need more than one Rev for that, maybe a more liberal king of Prussia accepts the Imperial crown in the Revolution and allies with a republican France? ...
 
Yeah, if only the Russians had kindly surrendered like the untermenschen they were :rolleyes:
Germany didn't come "close to pulling it off", it was stopped dead in its tracks in front of Moscow.

i did forget about stalingrad, didn't i... but there are several instances where, had certain mistakes been reversed or avoided altogether, the nazis could have defeated the russians
 

Eurofed

Banned
I was reading "Girl Genius" Yesterday, and it was talking about the Baron Forming His Empire out of "Simple Bloody Refusal to face the difficulty".
I got to thinking - ?Was there anyway a country in Europe had the Resources & Ability to Conquer and set up a European Empire in the post Napoleon 1800's?

The Habsburg grow a brain in 1848, and decide to throw their support behind the national revolutions in Germany and Italy, creating a federal union of Greater Germany, Italy, and Hungary.
 

archaeogeek

Banned
The Habsburg grow a brain in 1848, and decide to throw their support behind the national revolutions in Germany and Italy, creating a federal union of Greater Germany, Italy, and Hungary.

Which then proceed to alienate each other because the they',re all laying claims on everyone else. :rolleyes:
 

Eurofed

Banned
Which then proceed to alienate each other because the they',re all laying claims on everyone else. :rolleyes:

If they are all within the same federal polity, workarounds and compromises for really contested areas can be arranged, such as making Trieste its own city-state.
 
If they are all within the same federal polity, workarounds and compromises for really contested areas can be arranged, such as making Trieste its own city-state.

In 1848 Italians basically did not care much about Trieste. It was "Germany" (Habsburg land) since the 15th century and it had a majority Slovenian hinterland. Ah, and it was a free city within the Austrian Empire yet, as it was Fiume/Rijeka.
The big problem in a Great Habsburg Federation would be the Slavic nations, especially the Czechs and Croats, and to a lesser extent the Poles. Such a league would be German-dominated, with Italians as the second partner. Magyars may be unhappy with that but still accept this: that's sheer demographics, and provided they are given the third "rank" they would settle with it, contenting themselves with oppressing Slovaks, Rusyninans and Vendians a little. They would have to compromise with Croats like they did OTL post 1867, of course. This leaves the Czechs as the major thorn in side of any Habsburg German-Italian dominated combine, with Slovenians as side ally. Like OTL, again.
My point is that if the Habsburg dynasty chooses to ride the tiger of nationalism, it would be even more embroiled in the contrasting claims nationalisms are bound to do (especially in an area historically and ethnically unfit to host nationalists of any sort). In the long term, they cannot support national claims from Germans, Italians, Hungarians and probably Poles and dismiss the ones of the Czechs. And there is no unbloody way to settle German and Czech nationalisms together once they have become mass movements. OTL the solution was forced expulsion of almost all German-speaking people from historical Bohemia and Moravia in 1945, after the Nazis had tried the other way (destroy the Czech as a people and enslave what's left).
 
Not a chance. Europe has quite a lot of national identities for a region its size.

Of course, it's easier if you keep Europe under a single confession.
 
The Habsburg grow a brain in 1848, and decide to throw their support behind the national revolutions in Germany and Italy, creating a federal union of Greater Germany, Italy, and Hungary.

National revolutions leading to a confederacy of mutual nationalistic entities?

I really can't follow the logic, since the Habsburg realms that became Austria-Hungary weren't the most stable of states on their own. Add more Germans and Italians? They won't want to subsidize the Hungarians and the other Slavic peoples.

How do you propose overcoming that hurdle?

Of course, all that assumes that a monarchy wants to support a group that is generally apathetic or hostile towards it.
 
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nazi germany almost did. suppose they hadnt declared war on the USA and left Japan to handle them alone, they might have been able to pull it off.

This remark always amuses me. What people mean when they "almost all of Europe" is "all of Europe except for its biggest country and its most industrialised country", which puts the matter in a different light.

The Habsburg grow a brain in 1848, and decide to throw their support behind the national revolutions in Germany and Italy, creating a federal union of Greater Germany, Italy, and Hungary.

This kind of PoD annoys me: "If a certain influential person had done the exact opposite of what every reason of upbringing and origin led to do in OTL, it would be easy!"

Imagine a thread asking how to make democratic socialism the most influential ideology in the world in which I posted "Stalin gains a sense of morality and transforms the USSR into a federal regime of peace and love"; that's basically what you habitually do.
 
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The Habsburg grow a brain in 1848, and decide to throw their support behind the national revolutions in Germany and Italy, creating a federal union of Greater Germany, Italy, and Hungary.

Good try. Pity there are a few problems:
  • The Austrian empire is well defined by its name: it's an empire and its governed by Austrians. All the other lands (don't call them nationalities because the empire does not recognise them as such) have to accept this
  • in any case going in a single step from an ancient regime Metternichian absolutism supported by the Russian bear to a federation of free people who love each other and strive for the common good would be quite surprising (to use the kindest adjective which came to my mind).
  • I have not even taken yet into account the personality and the qualities of Franz Joseph, the newly anointed emperor. Who can mostly lay claim to three achievements: his reign was quite long, he had a very impressive mustache and he deftly managed during his reign to squander away the heritage of a few centuries of dinastic history
  • who's going to explain to the other powers that the Habsburg emperor had an epyphany and is now dedicated to bring together everything and everyone in Europe from the French border to the Russian one? and, btw, he's doing that by revolution :eek:
 

Typo

Banned
If they are all within the same federal polity, workarounds and compromises for really contested areas can be arranged, such as making Trieste its own city-state.
Why do they find workarounds and comprimises just because they are within the same federal polity, instead of breaking apart on such issues?
 
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