Embrace the SUCK: Skallagrim's Unexpurgated Colour Key
- Thread starter Skallagrim
- Start date
Skallagrim
Banned
So. It's been a while. So long that I have to click past the necro warning -- I think for the first time ever. Thankfully, it's my own thread, and I'm continuing my own work.
Because yes, I am continuing my work. The fact that someone asked me a question about SUCK strikes me as a good enough prompt to mention that I've been working on v4. I'm well aware that nobody expected to ever hear about it again, but I have actually kept up tinkering with it. Version 4, which I intend to be the final version, will take into account a lot of the detailed feedback I've received in this thread. It will also aim to present the various options associated with each colour in a more orderly fashion.
Below, a comparison of Western Europe, v3 and v4. Note that several countries are left without colour, because I'll only distribute new colours once everything else is done. Yes, v4 takes up a lot more space, but it's also less chaotic and cluttered. It should be easier for people to find precisely what they're looking for, and it should likewise be easier to spot anything that's still missing.
As can be seen, I've switched around colours in some places, and added various options across the board.
Because yes, I am continuing my work. The fact that someone asked me a question about SUCK strikes me as a good enough prompt to mention that I've been working on v4. I'm well aware that nobody expected to ever hear about it again, but I have actually kept up tinkering with it. Version 4, which I intend to be the final version, will take into account a lot of the detailed feedback I've received in this thread. It will also aim to present the various options associated with each colour in a more orderly fashion.
Below, a comparison of Western Europe, v3 and v4. Note that several countries are left without colour, because I'll only distribute new colours once everything else is done. Yes, v4 takes up a lot more space, but it's also less chaotic and cluttered. It should be easier for people to find precisely what they're looking for, and it should likewise be easier to spot anything that's still missing.
As can be seen, I've switched around colours in some places, and added various options across the board.
One suggestion I have is to assign each Chinese province its own colour, that would be shared with an ancient state (e.g., Shanxi would have the same colour as Jin, Shaanxi would have the same colour as Qin, Hebei/Zhili would have the same colour as Ji, Shandong would have the same colour as Lu, Guangdong would have the same colour as Yue, etc.)
This is because in the 1618-1681 and 1911-1949 periods, Chinese regional polities were usually associated with a specific province, like the Pingxi feudatory, the Shanxi Clique, etc.
Also, you should rename the "Northern warlords" and "Southern warlords" into generic North and South China colours, since that's what they were. Also, the Jurchen and Manchu should have the same colour. I suggest having it be yellow or blue, since green has no connection to the Manchu or Jurchen at all.
This is because in the 1618-1681 and 1911-1949 periods, Chinese regional polities were usually associated with a specific province, like the Pingxi feudatory, the Shanxi Clique, etc.
Also, you should rename the "Northern warlords" and "Southern warlords" into generic North and South China colours, since that's what they were. Also, the Jurchen and Manchu should have the same colour. I suggest having it be yellow or blue, since green has no connection to the Manchu or Jurchen at all.
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Skallagrim
Banned
China definitely needs work. Overhauling the whole situation to properly include the warlords is probably the most daunting thing about making a v4. I can't really excuse not going all the way there. Problem is: I'm not all that familiar with the warlord era. I'll have to set up an overview of province/region - ancient state - warlord faction. This would allow me to just do away with the "Northern warlords" and "Southern warlords" (I already have generic North and South China colours). Combining Jurchen and Manchu should be possible, although the Manchu colour is also the Qing colour, which is -- for some reason -- bright green in AH.com tradition. (Well, maybe it's time to change that?)
Oh shit, is someone actually going to attempt to do a wuxing colouration for the chinese dynasties?
I've never understood why the Qing are bright green, it doesn't really make any sense. In my maps I've always coloured them as yellow.
My personal suggestion is this:
The best way would be to assign each region of China (North, South, West, and East) a colour, and then assign each province (except Xinjiang, Qinghai, Tibet, Hainan, the Manchurian provinces, Inner Mongolia, and Ningxia) a number of colours, and have enough colours per province to identify each with a state from the Spring and Autumn period, or a prefecture from that province if there aren't enough states. Then you could go through and assign later ancient states, dynasties, and warlord regimes that can be equated with a specific Spring and Autumn state that state's colour.
This issue, as I see it, is that the number of small warring states is so great that you would need dozens of colours for each province. This obviously isn't practical, so I suggest omitting the smallest states, which would mean you could work with just 7 colours per province. This would allow you to represent all Chinese dynasties, and all non-insignificant states, and warlords without having half of the colours in your colour scheme be Chinese polities (although it would still have 130 colours)
Weren't the Qing elementally wood in chinese mythology?
Shit, you've finally made me understand how the fuck wuxing works. Thanks!
Edit: Kolchak, I was this close to actually getting a map finished and published. Now you've revived the colour scheme i scrapped a while ago. Thanks!
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How much work would you say a Map generally takes to make and color in? Also what would your preffered colors be for most ASB/Fiction works?
Skallagrim
Banned
-- Depends very much on the map. There is no clear answer to this.
-- For ASB and fictional settings, I say use whatever colour you like, unless countries in the setting are clear expies of real countries; then, using those countries' colours may help visually reinforce the theme. In any event, SUCK is not designed for ASB.
Sorry if I was unclear there, Im just dipping my toes in this buissness right now, so I'll probably come off with some dumb questions... I guess I'll just wait for more.
Skallagrim
Banned
Questions are rarely dumb. This one simply doesn't have a universal answer. Some people make maps in hours that would take me weeks, and I make some make some maps in hours that would take others weeks. And sometimes a map takes me very long, and sometimes it goes in a flash. There can simply be loads of work involved. Observe, as a pretty useful example, my very rough sketch for a "reastic Planetos". That's just the first step of making the idea into a map, but by this point, I've already done all the research into tectonic plates, I know where the mountain ranges go, etc. etc.
Yeah, i guess it depends on multiple factors like what your aiming for (Detailed as realistic or just a overview), what time you have available and of course the writers touch (something I need to work on, as I find that while I get the ideas actually writing them out comes hard)...
And may I say that first draft is pretty damn good. Certainly good at illustrating the regions and all the things which would stick out, Definitely subscribed on how that goes.
