Effects of German authorization of the HeS30 jet engine

By 1940/1941 the Heinkel group had a jet engine that weighed less, was more fuel efficient, and more advanced than the BMW 003 or Jumo 004. What effects result from German investment into this jet engine instead of the plagued BMW (and/or Jumo) engine?
 

gaijin

Banned
I predict that Wiking will claim that this will allow Germany to build plenty jet fighters allowing it to decisively defeat the allied airforces.

This in turn will allow the Nazi's to send thousands of 88MM guns to the eastern front and stop those pesky Soviets and their unfashionable uniforms in their tract. I mean really what we're they thinking?? No black boots or skull decorated caps, but drab brown uniforms?? . That look simply doesn't work in time lines.

Then people (Obsessednuker, Im looking at you) will explain that jet engines alone don't win airways, especially if you take in account fuel shortages, lack of the alloys needed to make them, and the lack of enough trained pilots.

Wiking will then proceed to deny these logistical facts.

People will counter.

Rinse and repeat. :p
 

GarethC

Donor
By 1940/1941 the Heinkel group had a jet engine that weighed less, was more fuel efficient, and more advanced than the BMW 003 or Jumo 004. What effects result from German investment into this jet engine instead of the plagued BMW (and/or Jumo) engine?
Why was it so much better than the Jumo 004?
 

Deleted member 1487

I predict that Wiking will claim that this will allow Germany to build plenty jet fighters allowing it to decisively defeat the allied airforces.

This in turn will allow the Nazi's to send thousands of 88MM guns to the eastern front and stop those pesky Soviets and their unfashionable uniforms in their tract. I mean really what we're they thinking?? No black boots or skull decorated caps, but drab brown uniforms?? . That look simply doesn't work in time lines.

Then people (Obsessednuker, Im looking at you) will explain that jet engines alone don't win airways, especially if you take in account fuel shortages, lack of the alloys needed to make them, and the lack of enough trained pilots.

Wiking will then proceed to deny these logistical facts.

People will counter.

Rinse and repeat. :p
Sorry, you don't know me that well. The HeS30 depended on materials that Germany wouldn't spare AFAIK, while the bigger engines depended on being designed around parts that didn't need them. The HeS30 never was. Plus it had a host of other issues. A fine engine if you had the materials to mass produce it around, but then so were the early versions of the Jumo and BMW that weren't designed around material restrictions. AFAIK those restrictions were never placed on the HeS30 before it was cancelled, so it was a non-starter for that reason unless the Germans had some stockpile of necessary metals I don't know about.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heinkel_HeS_30
 
As a non-engineer..

How important is a long engine-life under wartime conditions? If an aircraft is only going to survive an average of a dozen missions before it is lost in combat does it matter that much if parts need replacing every 50-100 flying hours. If the aircraft survives long enough for the engine to wear out, put a new engine in it.
 

Deleted member 1487

As a non-engineer..

How important is a long engine-life under wartime conditions? If an aircraft is only going to survive an average of a dozen missions before it is lost in combat does it matter that much if parts need replacing every 50-100 flying hours. If the aircraft survives long enough for the engine to wear out, put a new engine in it.
Soviet philosophy.
 

Deleted member 1487

Which seems to have worked 1941-45.

IIRC from Green and Fricker 2,000 German aircraft on the Eastern Front at the start of 1944 faced 8,800 Soviet aeroplanes.
http://chris-intel-corner.blogspot.com/2012/04/eastern-front-aircraft-strength-and.html
And the Soviets lost over 9700 in 1944. TBF the Germans also lost 2900. That only covers combat losses, noncombat nearly doubled the number for 1944, which not just a function of pilot issues, but the declining quality of construction on both sides. In 1941 the Soviets actually lost more to non-combat causes than combat.
 
http://chris-intel-corner.blogspot.com/2012/04/eastern-front-aircraft-strength-and.html
And the Soviets lost over 9700 in 1944. TBF the Germans also lost 2900. That only covers combat losses, noncombat nearly doubled the number for 1944, which not just a function of pilot issues, but the declining quality of construction on both sides. In 1941 the Soviets actually lost more to non-combat causes than combat.
And they still won. Quantity has a quality of its own.
 

Deleted member 1487

And they still won. Quantity has a quality of its own.
Not on their own. That strategy only works if you can goon your opponent and absorb the losses, it was won with British Intelligence, American Industry, and Soviet Blood. In the end it was the combination of three great empires that won the war, Soviet philosophy works only if backed by American industry, the British blockade, and the Wallied air war and other fronts. One on one it is just a way to wipe yourself out by throwing away the flower of your youth in shitty equipment.

Of course the same could be said of Hitler by picking a fight with the entire world and dooming his nation to destruction and the wiping out of the flower of their youth.

You could had said, "Yes it does," and then explained why.
That was the design philosophy for the Jumo 004.
 
As a non-engineer..

How important is a long engine-life under wartime conditions? If an aircraft is only going to survive an average of a dozen missions before it is lost in combat does it matter that much if parts need replacing every 50-100 flying hours. If the aircraft survives long enough for the engine to wear out, put a new engine in it.

Given the US, British and Germans didn't subscribe to the Soviet production philosophy of 80 aircraft or 500 tank hours a jet engine running life of 25 hours is a major operational drawback. Early axial jet engines were notorious for not lasting nearly as long as the aircraft especially given the quoted 25 hour life also included ground runs, taxiing, idling etc, many an otherwise serviceable Me 262 was stuck on the ground for engine changes.
........................................

As for the overall question on the Hs30, I think Germany doesn't need another 1st gen axial flow jet, I think only a centrifugal jet will drastically alter the German jet development timeline and maybe impact on the war.
 
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