Effects of a islamic greece

assuming that the turks can manage to convert the majority of greece to islam how will this effect euroupean history as a whole
 
So, it's important to understand that Greece had a very significant Muslim minority when it was in the Ottoman Empire. And a majority Muslim Greece would still have a significant Christian minority, especially in rural areas. So, it would probably, at least at a denominational level, look like a more Christian Bosnia. As for effects, you'd probably see less of a romanticizing of Greece in the West and Greek independence probably wouldn't have been such a cause celebre in the West. So, you'd probably delay Greek independence by quite a bit, which would strengthen the Ottomans by a lot and possibly delay their collapse. But I think that Greek nationalism would still develop, eventually. It would just be more secular than OTL
 
So, it's important to understand that Greece had a very significant Muslim minority when it was in the Ottoman Empire. And a majority Muslim Greece would still have a significant Christian minority, especially in rural areas. So, it would probably, at least at a denominational level, look like a more Christian Bosnia. As for effects, you'd probably see less of a romanticizing of Greece in the West and Greek independence probably wouldn't have been such a cause celebre in the West. So, you'd probably delay Greek independence by quite a bit, which would strengthen the Ottomans by a lot and possibly delay their collapse. But I think that Greek nationalism would still develop, eventually. It would just be more secular than OTL

I wonder if this would effect the greek debate with constnationple
 
I concur with demonkangaroo; there would be a lot less sympathy in the West for the Greeks, if there's a similar independence movement which I doubt. I think the Greek attitude, if they are a predominately Muslim people, would be more favorable and sympathetic to the Ottoman Empire. In creating a national mythos, I can certainly forsee the Greeks downplaying the fall of the Byzantine Empire and treating the Ottomans as another dynasty seizing power and taking up the mantle of Roman Emperor - there would be an emphasis that the Ottomans themselves were more Greek than Turkish by intermarriage. :p

Maybe less of a want for independence and more for seizing control of the Empire and monopolizing control in their own hands? Not that it would work.
 
I concur with demonkangaroo; there would be a lot less sympathy in the West for the Greeks, if there's a similar independence movement which I doubt. I think the Greek attitude, if they are a predominately Muslim people, would be more favorable and sympathetic to the Ottoman Empire. In creating a national mythos, I can certainly forsee the Greeks downplaying the fall of the Byzantine Empire and treating the Ottomans as another dynasty seizing power and taking up the mantle of Roman Emperor - there would be an emphasis that the Ottomans themselves were more Greek than Turkish by intermarriage. :p

Maybe less of a want for independence and more for seizing control of the Empire and monopolizing control in their own hands? Not that it would work.

My first thought was that the West might still intervene (Byron said that modern Greeks were hardly like ancient Greeks, yet he still fought for them out of idealism) but that the Russians would be far more apathetic.
 
There will always be some kind of Greek Orthodox identity as long as there's a Patriach in the cultural heart of the Greek world - Constantinople. There's no easy way to avoid that, just look at the Copts.

Also, considering the differences between Greece and Egypt, the best scenario for Islamic Greece is to decrease the Christian population to about 30-40%.
 
I concur with demonkangaroo; there would be a lot less sympathy in the West for the Greeks, if there's a similar independence movement which I doubt. I think the Greek attitude, if they are a predominately Muslim people, would be more favorable and sympathetic to the Ottoman Empire. In creating a national mythos, I can certainly forsee the Greeks downplaying the fall of the Byzantine Empire and treating the Ottomans as another dynasty seizing power and taking up the mantle of Roman Emperor - there would be an emphasis that the Ottomans themselves were more Greek than Turkish by intermarriage. :p

Maybe less of a want for independence and more for seizing control of the Empire and monopolizing control in their own hands? Not that it would work.

I don't think we'd really see (Muslim) Greek Nationalism taking root unless the Ottomans are in an Albania-like situation where they're unable to protect Greece from encroaching powers. If Greeks were majority Muslims then I'd imagine they'd absolutely dominate the Ottoman government in all likelihood, and we'd probably see a stronger mercantile class in the Empire who's concerns would actually be addressed, and maybe less emphasis on piracy. Maybe even having Ottoman commercial links to Europe being stronger, especially if they can trade with the Italian states more freely.

Maybe a stronger Greek contingent can convince the Ottomans to not concede the Indian Ocean to the Portuguese due to being undercut in trade profits?
 
Maybe a stronger Greek contingent can convince the Ottomans to not concede the Indian Ocean to the Portuguese due to being undercut in trade profits?

They never did? The Ottoman and Portuguese Indian Ocean empires declined at around the same time and there was an absolutely enormous amount of trade going through Egypt in the 16th century (IIRC more than had been normal in Mamluk times).
 
assuming that the turks can manage to convert the majority of greece to islam how will this effect euroupean history as a whole

If that is the case, the history of Greece would be similar to Spain. Someone would be determined to reconquer Greece again and inquisition would be happening in east.
 
I don't think we'd really see (Muslim) Greek Nationalism taking root unless the Ottomans are in an Albania-like situation where they're unable to protect Greece from encroaching powers. If Greeks were majority Muslims then I'd imagine they'd absolutely dominate the Ottoman government in all likelihood, and we'd probably see a stronger mercantile class in the Empire who's concerns would actually be addressed, and maybe less emphasis on piracy. Maybe even having Ottoman commercial links to Europe being stronger, especially if they can trade with the Italian states more freely.

Maybe a stronger Greek contingent can convince the Ottomans to not concede the Indian Ocean to the Portuguese due to being undercut in trade profits?
Why do you think Greeks would dominate the Ottoman government?
 
Why do you think Greeks would dominate the Ottoman government?

Mostly because of the trade links that the Greeks held; their value in the Ottoman court will rise, presenting a 'Greek' facade for diplomacy will help ease off the diplomatic isolation of the Ottomans with the rest of Europe, etc. Basically a better PR and trade front for the Ottomans, even if they too are Muslims. Not to mention, Greeks were already a well-represented group in Ottoman administration IOTL. More Muslim Greeks means that we're likely to see even more Greeks in power.

Not to mention, my current head-canon for this happening is an earlier fall of Constantinople that avoids the Ottoman interregnum and as such the Greeks hold a slightly higher degree of political prestige.
 
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