Edward I of England dies before he takes the throne

He went on a crusade before he became King. Say he dies during the crusade. What effect does this have on the British Isles?
 
He went on a crusade before he became King. Say he dies during the crusade. What effect does this have on the British Isles?

He arrived at the Holy Land in May 1271. His eldest son John died in August that same year, and probably it would still happen ITTL. So the king now is his son Henry, who was only 3 years old. IOTL he died in 1274, so the doubt here is if he could remain alive or not. If Henry dies as IOTL, would his sister Eleanor be recognised as Queen, or the throne would go to Edward's brother Edmund?

Also, Edmund went on the Crusade with Edward. If he dies there too, who would claim the throne?
 
Edward I was on a crusade from 1271 to 1274. If he dies during that periode in the crusade, then depending on the date, we have different possible successors.

Here is the order of succession of Edward I, taking the possible period of his death into account. I went up to the first male descendant of John Lackland.

1.Henry, Prince of England - The eldest living son of Edward I in 1271. He is only 3 and died in 1274 OTL. So, short reign under regency...

2.Alphonso, Prince of England - A son born to Edward I in 1273. If Edward I doesn't die before his birth, Alphonso will succeed is brother Henry, under a regency that is. Still, Alphonso died in 1284 OTL... So, a longer reign but a regency all the way.

3.Eleanor, Princess of England - Edward I's eldest living daughter who was born in 1269. At Henry's death, she is 5, which places her for ten years under Regency. At Alphonso's, she would be 15, making her major.
The fact she is a girl will be a disadvantage for her, but I believe she can take the crown. After all, she is the daughter of Edward I, who is a great grandson of Henry II who got the rights to the English crown from his mother Empress Mathidla, daughter of King Henry I.

4.Joan, Princess of England - A daughter born to Edward I in 1272. She has practically no chance of getting the crown though...

5.Edmund Crouchback - Edward I's only brother who is 26 in 1271. However, Edmund has no children yet at the time. He did sire 4 children OTL, but the eldest was born in 1278. Edmund can pretend to the crown or the Regency if he doesn't die in the Crusade.

6.Margaret, Queen of Scotland - Henry III's eldest daughter and a sister to Edward I. She is a 31 year old woman, married to King Alexander III of Scotland with whom she had three children.

7.Alexander, prince of Scotland - Margaret's eldest son. He is 8 but he died in 1283.

8.David, prince of Scotland - Magaret's second son. He was born in 1272 but died in 1281.

9.Margaret, Princess of Scotland - The only daughter of Margaret and Alexander III of Scotland. She was born in 1260 and married King Eirik II of Norway but died in 1283.

10.Beatrice de Dreux - Henry III's second daughter. She is a 29 year old woman married to John II, Duke of Brittany.

11.Arthur II, Duke of Brittany - Eldest son of Beatrice de Dreux. He is 9 in 1271.

12.John of Britanny, Earl of Richmond - Second son of Beatrice de Dreux. He is 5 in 1271.

13.Pierre, Viscount de Leon - Third son of Beatrice de Dreux. He is 2 in 1271.

14.Marie of Britanny - Eldest daughter of Beatrice de Dreux. She is 3 in 1271.

15.Blanche of Britanny - Second daughter of Beatrice de Dreux who was born in 1271.

16.Eleonore of Britanny - Third daughter of Beatrice de Dreux, born in 1274.

17.Richard, 1st Earl of Cornwall - Edward I's uncle as he is Henry III's brother. He is 62 in 1271 and died in 1272 OTL. He has two sons to suceed him.

18.Edmund, 2nd Earl of Cornwall - The eldest son of Richard of Cornwall. He is 22 in 1271 but died without children in 1300.

19.Richard of Cornwall - Second son of Richard, Earl of Cornwall. He is 19 in 1271, died in 1296 OTL but had children.
 
Alfonso wasn't born until November 1273, after Edward's return to England, so if Edward dies on crusade he never exists.

Henry III dies in 1272, so Eleanor is only three, not five. I wouldn't give much for her chances, and suspect that she ends up either in a convent or married off to Edmund's son, when he has one.

Unless Edmund is butterflied away by some accident, he seems the likeliest, but either a Scottish or a Breton succession would be interesting. Given Edward's OTL career, it would be ironic if a Scots king inherited England, rather than vice versa.
 
Edward I

Would the French take advantage of this situation and attempt to recover Gascony? Especially if there is a possibility of a long minority in England?
 
Mikestone8 said:
Alfonso wasn't born until November 1273, after Edward's return to England, so if Edward dies on crusade he never exists.

I had read Edward only returned to England in 1274... Probably an error on my part.

Mikestone8 said:
Henry III dies in 1272, so Eleanor is only three, not five.

I should have been clearer on which Henry I was talking... I was not meaning Henry III but the first son of Edward I who is also called Henry.

Mikestone8 said:
I wouldn't give much for her chances, and suspect that she ends up either in a convent or married off to Edmund's son, when he has one.

It's true that her being a girl AND a kid is not to her advantage... Yet again, the Plantagenets inherited the English crown through female line (Henry II was the son of Empress Mathilda. Sure he succeeded Stephen of Blois, but Mathilda should have been the heiress of Henry I not Stephen).
And there is no doubt Henry III and Edward I as well as their direct relatives are Plantagenets.

However, I think the Barons are likely to go for someone like Edmund rather than Eleanor because Edmund is a man and an adult.

Unless Edmund is butterflied away by some accident, he seems the likeliest, but either a Scottish or a Breton succession would be interesting. Given Edward's OTL career, it would be ironic if a Scots king inherited England, rather than vice versa.

The English Barons could also go for someone else to guaranty their independance... The Earl of Cornwalls descend from Henry III.
In any case, that succession seems very interesting.

Would the French take advantage of this situation and attempt to recover Gascony? Especially if there is a possibility of a long minority in England?

I think it's very likely. There is still competitions between the Capetians and the Plantagenets. Besides, Guyenne was a rich Duchy and the French have a lot of interest into acquiring it.

There are two possiblity for the French to acquire the Duchy : War or by placing someone they can keep under control on the English throne.

In the latter case, I could see King Philipp III going for Eleanor to be crowned as Queen of England and marrying one of his sons to her later.
He could also favor another candidate loyal to the French crown... In which case the Scottish kings (France often allied with Scotland against England) or the Dukes of Britanny could get a strong backing from the French King.
 
I had read Edward only returned to England in 1274... Probably an error on my part.[/quote}

I've just checked and you are right on that, so if Edward dies on his way back to England, Alfonso could still be born. OTOH, the likeliest POD would seem to be the attempt on his life in June 1272, which if successful would certainly eliminate Alfonso's birth.



It's true that her being a girl AND a kid is not to her advantage... Yet again, the Plantagenets inherited the English crown through female line (Henry II was the son of Empress Mathilda. Sure he succeeded Stephen of Blois, but Mathilda should have been the heiress of Henry I not Stephen).

Actually, technically they didn't. Henry II was "adopted" as Stephen's heir in a political deal. So the throne officially came to him through Stephen and not through Matilda.

Also, with the death of Henry I in 1135, the male line from WtC became extinct. Stephen and Henry II were both descended through their mothers. In 1274, however, a male line descendant would have existed. If he gets it, of course, that establishes the Salic Law in England, which could have all sorts of consequences later.
 
Okay, let's have Edward die in 1272 and Edmund die of dysentary shortly afterward, just to make things interesting.
I noticed that Philippe III of France's sons are quite close in age to Eleanor. I can see Philippe supporting Eleanor to the throne just for the option of marrying his son to her and bringing England into the Capetian sphere.
 
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Okay, let's have Edward die in 1272 and Edmund die of dysentary shortly afterward, just to make things interesting.
I noticed that Philippe III of France's sons are quite close in age to Eleanor. I can see Philippe supporting Eleanor to the throne just for the option of marrying his son to her and bringing England into the Capetian sphere.

So Richard of Cornwall would be the last male to male descendent of the Plantagenets in this case, and probably would have a great support for his claim. He went with Edward and Edmund to the Crusade, and could probably have the loyalty of the nobles and troops who fought with them.

Could Alexander III try to claim the throne in name of his wife or his son? And who in England would be interested in supporting the claim of the young Eleanor?
 
Alfonso wasn't born until November 1273, after Edward's return to England, so if Edward dies on crusade he never exists.
Eleanor, Edward's wife, accompanied him on crusade. Joan was born in Acre, and Alphonso in Gascony, before the couple returned to England. If the PoD is after Alphonso's conception in ?March? of '73, then Alphonso still exists.
 
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