East Indies as Dutch "Dominion"?

Could Netherlands give its colony in East Indies a significant freedom of government ala British Empire's Dominion system?
If possible, when is the most plausible time of the application of this system?

Thanks in advance!
 
Could Netherlands give its colony in East Indies a significant freedom of government ala British Empire's Dominion system?
If possible, when is the most plausible time of the application of this system?

Thanks in advance!

Well the Dutch actually had a good chance of enacting such a system.

IOTL this was ruined by two things:

De Ethische Politiek: An honest attempt to improve the lives of the natives, basing itself on education and improving the material wealth (abolishing the situation of being a wingewest aka existing only for profit). This system while honest from the Netherlands itself suffered for lack of funding and lack of enthusiasm by the local authorities. All it actually achieved was allowing Indonesian Nationalism to develop.

Japanese Occupation: The Japanese used the emerging Indonesian Nationalist movement as a way to controll the DEI, Raising local militia's and causing the Nationalists to hope for Independance. Though the Japanese soon ruined whatever goodwill they had built up among the natives, the Nationalist movement had gotten a solid boost from the initial occupation.

America: The Americans allowed Japanese soldiers to surrender to the Nationalist forces, enabling them to build up strength for when the Dutch returned. The Americans also pressured the Dutch into accepting the loss of all of the DEI, forcing them to throw various loyalist ethnic groups (Such as Malukkans) to the lions.

So how could the Dutch have prevented Indonesian independence?

well this is in the proper forum as a 19th century POD is best. The best bet would be something similar to the Ethische Politiek being implemented far earlier. Perhaps durign the Revolutions of 1848 when he changed from Conservative to Liberal in one night he could also start and ambitious overhaul of the colonial system. It will be hard and borderline ASB but its the only way. If the Ethische Politiek or something similar was introduced then their would be a bigger educated middle class, earlier nationalism and perhaps instead of starting the Ethische Politiek at the start of the 20th Century the Dutch might be able to turn at least Java into a dominion. Though it might be possible that such a shift in focus (from profit to integration) might hinder the growth of the DEI as we know it resulting in a smaller Dominion of Indonesia lead from Java.
 
Hrm. I guess one reason I'm skeptical is that so little of Dutch culture remains in the East Indies. Compare the British presence in India to this day; it's a common tongue, it influences its legal system, hell, Indians still play British games.

What remains of the Dutch in Indonesia?
 
Hrm. I guess one reason I'm skeptical is that so little of Dutch culture remains in the East Indies. Compare the British presence in India to this day; it's a common tongue, it influences its legal system, hell, Indians still play British games.

What remains of the Dutch in Indonesia?

I do know that Dutch is still being used in legal documents in Indonesia though they started to phase it out a couple years back, I think at least. Most of what I know of Indonesia comes from the stories my grandfather told me from when he fought in the Indonesian war for Independence (he was a Dutch conscript) and from my parents when they visited Java with my grandparents.
 
have to agree to keep the whole as a dominion will be hard, but i could see that a part of it would stay with the netherlands.
Java is likely to go its own way and maybe Sumatra to, the rest could very well become a dominion, and don't think you would need that much changes for that.
The reason for this is that the other parts always felt dominated by java, and when java is removed from the equation it might be simpler to keep it together,
 
@wietze

It would seem a break-up would work better certainly, if one wanted some sort of more Dutch friendly entity post independence.

How would that work though? I imagine the Dutch were like most other colonial powers and rather interested in cheap and easy administration, hence big groupings or federations. Breaking DEI up into smaller units would really have to occur well before WW2, if the post WW2 order is not to just overturn them all
 
De Ethische Politiek: An honest attempt to improve the lives of the natives, basing itself on education and improving the material wealth (abolishing the situation of being a wingewest aka existing only for profit).
Is there anything the Dutch could be using Indonesia for in this era where an educated workforce could be seen as a way to increase profits?
 
Is there anything the Dutch could be using Indonesia for in this era where an educated workforce could be seen as a way to increase profits?

I have no idea, As i have been able to found out so far is that the first reform in the Dutch East Indies happened in 1870, but this just saw the goverment controll over trade broken and the DEI opened to private enterprise. This policy was then overturned in 1901 by the Ethische Politiek.

also managed to find the goals of the Ethische Politiek:

Economical: Improvement of Irrigation systems, Making banking services availlable to natives and subsidising native industry.

Transmigration: the movement of poor landless natives from over populated islands to the less populated islands (similar practises had been going on since the early 19th century)

Education: Opening of European schools to Indonesian natives (by 1900 only 1500 natives had finished primary education, by 1928 75000 natives had finished primar education)

Part of why the Ethical policy was implemented was the growing outrage caused by the book Max Havelaar which shows the horrible situation the natives are in. This book is published in 1860, and already had some parliamentary support during the 1860s, but the Authors idea after the first edition sold out rapidly in the first year(1300 books) to have a massive cheap second edition failed. If his wish was carried out by his publisher then the pressure would have been growing rapidly since 1860 and perhaps the reforms of 1870 would have seen a sort of Ethische Politiek implemented. Then maybe at the coronation of Queen Whilhelmina she might have been able to ensure something like a Dominion of Java encompassing only Java and slowly turning the other islands in dominions.

Even if she does not carry out such a reform the growing market in the East Indies due to the growing middle class would boost the Dutch Industry and thus economy.

though as i said i'm not really an expert on any of these things
 
As far as I see it, several things could have been put into practice:

- force the local nobility to become 'Dutch' by marriage, make those families marry Dutch nationals and having that offspring take over.

- force the local nobility to swear allegiance to the Dutch 'King' or possibly 'Keizer van het Rijk der Insulinde'

- keep the colony like it was supposed to be: The Moluccas being a different colony then Java. The Dutch Goeverneur-Generaal was actually Goeverneur-Generaal of two colonies, but this distinction was slowly lost.

- offer benefits to local leaders to Christianize, this would lead to a larger Christian population and as such less trouble from the idea that they cannot be governed by Infidels.

- start supporting the use of the Dutch language

- start making extensive use of propaganda

- make sure the KNIL actually FIGHTS when attacked

- increase the effectiveness(= ruthlessness) of the PID (political investigative service or official" Politieke Inlichtingendienst)(in terms of punishment and investigation)

- stimulate immigration towards Indië with the excuse that Dutch people can get more profit out of the colonies (!!! plural !!!) Also a large group of Dutch natives that identify with the Netherlands instead of the locals could allow land in the east to be maintained. I once read a theory about how Batavia en Ommelanden could have in 1940 be generally ethnically Dutch and turned into something like a Hertogdom Batavia as an irremovable part of the Netherlands proper.


a combination of ideas like these would in my opinion be best.
 
The one thing British dominions all had in common is that they were ruled by white English speaking settlers. South Africa was somewhat the exception because of its large African population. The dominions of India and Pakistan only really happened because it was a convenient halfway house to full independence from the Empire.

Since the Dutch East Indies isn't populated by majority of Dutch settlers, a dominion scenario isn't going to happen. Once you start moving the Dutch East Indies towards any kind of local rule, the Indonesians are going to become independent fairly fast.

The only thing I can really see happening is if the Dutch create a whole bunch of separate dominions in the DEI - a Javanese state, an Aceh state, a Borneo state, etc. - that Amsterdam can politically dominate and control through a policy of divide and conquer. You also need to really build up native loyalty to the Dutch government by having them rule better than the local elites once did, but also giving the new native elites a real stake in the continuation of the Dutch empire.

In the end, the Dutch have to be comfortable with the India of non-whites being the boss of whites in the DEI. That is going to be a very, very hard sell for Europeans in the 18th to 20th centuries.
 
I think we need both a better colonial management (which may come from a stronger and richer Netherlands by retaining Belgium, but who knows) and no disruption of colonial rule like Japanese occupation did during WW2. The later radicalized political atmosphere in Indonesia. Previously, most native politicians pursued independence through cooperative route. But Japanese occupation brought to Indonesia anti-western nationalist agitation, devastation to local political and economic structure mostly due to post-invasion management, militarization of the youth, Java-favoritism, and the chance for PKI to rebound.

I've been curious about how would the retaining of Belgium would've influenced Dutch colonial policy. Obviously, they would've had more money to fund Etische Politiek, but then again, there still was the lack of enthusiasm among the local administration. Then again, arguably the lost of Belgium may have played crucial role in shaping the Netherlands' economic policy throughout the 19th century. Don't think it will prevent Kultuurstelsel, but maybe less dependence on it and thus, less harsh version of it ? I'm not sure though, but still, more money to spend to build the colony will do something...
 
weren't Britains dominions there successful white colonies, granted autonomy?

Man i love the dutch and I really wish they would have colonized there overseas territories.
 
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