DWI: What if the Great and Most Fortunate Armada had failed?

You all know the story. In 1588, Philip the Great of Spain sent this Armada to crush the English, abolishing forever the brief Brittanic heresy and put Mary of the Scots to the throne of England, thus creating Great Britain as we know it. What would have happened to the British Isles had it failed, due to bad weather for example? Would Brittanism have spread to Ireland and Scottland and overseas? Or was it doomed to be destroyed by the French or the Austrians? What are your thoughts?
 
Queen Elizabeth would have gotten pretty angry and built a fleet to rival the late Armada. Eventually she would die and there might be a civil war or something as everyone tries to raise a claimant. Provided England survives, that fleet is going to do a lot of damage. Probably a massive blockade against France or something.

- BNC
 
Well, the British culture would certainly be different without William Shake-spear. His family were ardent Catholics who felt that Philip's intervention was a God-sent liberation, and would certainly have been persecuted under Elizabeth Tudor.

Imagine a world without the classic plays MacBeth, Twelfth Night, Sal-Addin and The Cid.
 
Queen Elizabeth would have gotten pretty angry and built a fleet to rival the late Armada. Eventually she would die and there might be a civil war or something as everyone tries to raise a claimant. Provided England survives, that fleet is going to do a lot of damage. Probably a massive blockade against France or something.

- BNC
There's no way little England could have ever built a fleet that could rival the Armada.It has no where near the amount of resources Spain possessed.
 
You need to have some ASB hurricane to have the Great and Most Fortunate Armada weakened enough to be defeated by the English Royal Navy. Just like that Tsunami during the Mongol invasion of Japan. Otherwise it seems unlikely.
 
Well most likely is that England is able to exists as a separate entity rather than merging with Scotland. Which would certainly cause a great deal of instability on the island given how often the two of them were at war before the invasion. As for Brittanism spreading much. The Tudor embrace of heresy was mostly just an excuse for their own tyrannical inclinations. While England had many actual Protestants most followed Luther and in fact say Henry's actions as just a naked power grab. Ultimately it would likely only exist on the island and even then only exist by decree.
 
The Spanish would just send another armada a few years later; their ability to keep borrowing and remain profitable to loan to was one of the great strengths of the Spanish Monarchy, and with the world's strongest land army, it would just be a manner of time before Philip reclaimed his English dominions and crushed the heretic rebels in the seventeen provinces.
 
The Spanish would just send another armada a few years later; their ability to keep borrowing and remain profitable to loan to was one of the great strengths of the Spanish Monarchy, and with the world's strongest land army, it would just be a manner of time before Philip reclaimed his English dominions and crushed the heretic rebels in the seventeen provinces.

OOC: Umm...you didn't read the OP and that bit about Mary Queen of Scots, didn't you?
 
Well, the British culture would certainly be different without William Shake-spear. His family were ardent Catholics who felt that Philip's intervention was a God-sent liberation, and would certainly have been persecuted under Elizabeth Tudor.

Imagine a world without the classic plays MacBeth, Twelfth Night, Sal-Addin and The Cid.
There most likely wouldn't be a play called 'Henry the Accursed' either,which was about the tyranny of Henry VIII.
 
There were some very advanced English naval vessels with faster firing guns. If the English had chosen to produce those ships instead of more traditional and cheaper designs,The English could have engaged the Spanish vessels at will and retreated before they were overwhelmed. That could have wrecked havoc with the invasion fleet.Not destroying it but seriously screwing up their timetable.
 
There's no way little England could have ever built a fleet that could rival the Armada.It has no where near the amount of resources Spain possessed.
Wales had a lot of forest and stuff at this time. Also, the process would probably take quite a while. However, England is an island, and so having a navy that can defeat the other European powers means that it probably wouldn't need a large army to defend itself with. France is always to the north of Spain, and an angry king could send an army down.

- BNC
 
Long term? Not much changes. Yes, Britain gets a short reprieve, but the weight of history is against them. If one invasion fails there will be another in the next decade. And again, if needed. And the Catholic forces only have to win once. Consider the immense wealth of the Spanish Empire. And that's just Spain.

OOC: Yes, I'm mocking this forum's tendency for determinism.
 
I suspect an English queen might still take over all of the isles, but this time instead of a more equitable (though if we were honest it was still shite for the Celts) we have a nationalistic component. I wonder if the Irish would have been forced to convert by the English. OTL Irish Catholicism and British Catholicism are two very different cultural beasts, as the Irish church was often a form of resistance (that happened to get protection) and the British version was more of the tool of the oppressor.
My guess is that the English being "protestant" try to forcible disband Catholicism on the Emerald Island and make Irish the Moors of England. being of the "right religion" only when the English look their way.
 
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