Dutch colonies after WWI

I am thinking of writing a minitimeline (or whatever) in which the Netherlands is attacked by Germany during WWI, just like Belgium was and the consequences. The rest of the war ends roughly like it did OTL. Germany still loses. I am wondering what colonies the Netherlands could realistically gain in the peace treaty. I assume the Netherlands is not interested in African colonies, but just in colonies near the Dutch East Indies. The Obvious problem is that both Japan, as well as Britain (and Australia) would also be interested in those colonies. So what German colonies are likely to be gained by the Netherlands?
 

HJ Tulp

Donor
I am thinking of writing a minitimeline (or whatever) in which the Netherlands is attacked by Germany during WWI, just like Belgium was and the consequences. The rest of the war ends roughly like it did OTL. Germany still loses. I am wondering what colonies the Netherlands could realistically gain in the peace treaty. I assume the Netherlands is not interested in African colonies, but just in colonies near the Dutch East Indies. The Obvious problem is that both Japan, as well as Britain (and Australia) would also be interested in those colonies. So what German colonies are likely to be gained by the Netherlands?

The attack is right at the start of the conflict? The only thing I can see is some movement into German New Guinea. It would be usefull if the Netherlands could get some Pacific islands, if only because that would mean that Japan wouldn't get them. It's questionable if the KNIL/KM would be able to execute such an operation though.
 
Nederland's grens kome aan de Wezer(The border of the Netherlands be at the Weser)

The post WW2 Bakker-Schut plan could be a basis for compensation.
upload_2019-4-12_20-57-58.png
 

HJ Tulp

Donor
How does the Netherlands perform in this *WWI? Are they overrun almost immediately or valiantly fight to the last man in a rearguard action as a “DEF” escapes to France for example? Their image during the War will affect how loudly they can claim compensation from the CP.

I can imagine that the Dutch Army holds the Germans at bay at the Water Line. Most likely outcome actually. Big question is if the need to cover the Dutch is ouweighted by the German advance being helped by moving through Limburg.
 
Of course not. Bakker-Schut was a megalomanic idea. The Netherlands will just get East-Frisia in Europe. Maybe some small border corrections. But nothing as big as Bakker Schut.
Doesn't seem particularly megalomanic, the densely populated parts of Germany are at other places, there's very few people in the north of the area. It's more like another Sudetenland, pretty much forgotten about afterwards.

 
I can imagine that the Dutch Army holds the Germans at bay at the Water Line. Most likely outcome actually. Big question is if the need to cover the Dutch is ouweighted by the German advance being helped by moving through Limburg.
Yeah, that is basicly the idea. There are some small advantages for the Germans moving through the Netherlands, but they do not outweigh the disadvantages (larger area to occupy, frontline troops needed for the waterline front and a lack of a neutral Dutch trading partner).
 

Deleted member 94680

I can imagine that the Dutch Army holds the Germans at bay at the Water Line. Most likely outcome actually. Big question is if the need to cover the Dutch is ouweighted by the German advance being helped by moving through Limburg.

An extended Western Front, new avenues of attack for the WAllies and a more effective blockade as the Dutch will block off German access. Sounds like a pretty major contribution.

I imagine in this scenario, anything the Dutch can take colonies wise, they’ll hold after the war. Japan probably loses out.
 
Doesn't seem particularly megalomanic, the densely populated parts of Germany are at other places, there's very few people in the north of the area. It's more like another Sudetenland, pretty much forgotten about afterwards.
Compare East-Frisia with the land Belgium got after WWI and I think it is comparable.

The thing is, the Netherlands had barely any reasonable claim to any areas of Germany, besides East-Frisia (which had been part of kingdom of Holland) and some parts that used to be part of Gueldres. So i think the Netherlands will not get any other parts of Germany.
 
The attack is right at the start of the conflict? The only thing I can see is some movement into German New Guinea. It would be usefull if the Netherlands could get some Pacific islands, if only because that would mean that Japan wouldn't get them. It's questionable if the KNIL/KM would be able to execute such an operation though.
So, how about this? The Dutch get the north, the Australians the south and Neu Pommeren and Neu Mecklenburg.
proposal.png


The rest of the colonies are divided like OTL
 
I choose just northern Papau New Guinea and East frisia as gains for the Netherlands after WWI to compare it with the Belgian gains OTL. They only got Eupen-Malmedy and Rwanda-Burundi. I think these areas are comparable. The only doubt I have is that I take area away from Australian gains and they might not like it.
 
I assume the Netherlands is not interested in African colonies
Given the Dutch history in South Africa, I cannot agree with the assumption that the Netherlands would not be interested in African colonies.

If they had possessed the opportunity, the Dutch would surely have wanted Namibia (German South West Africa) for one – it lay next to South Africa and closely tied to its economically and culturally. It’s even remotely possible that Namibia would have been much more fully incorporated into South Africa than actually occurred during the apartheid era.

Even German East Africa (Tanganyika, and present-day Burundi and Rwanda) would not have been out of the question for the Netherlands, although it is much more remote from the Boer settlements.
 
If the Dutch took it after WW1, would northern Papua New Guinea eventually be part of Indonesia?
Almost certainly. Moreover, there might be a temptation for Indonesia to try and get the rich copper and gold resources of the Fly River Basin after becoming independent. On the other hand, secessionists in New Guinea’s extremely fragmented society might have demanded independence on some scale.
 
Given the Dutch history in South Africa, I cannot agree with the assumption that the Netherlands would not be interested in African colonies.

If they had possessed the opportunity, the Dutch would surely have wanted Namibia (German South West Africa) for one – it lay next to South Africa and closely tied to its economically and culturally. It’s even remotely possible that Namibia would have been much more fully incorporated into South Africa than actually occurred during the apartheid era.

Even German East Africa (Tanganyika, and present-day Burundi and Rwanda) would not have been out of the question for the Netherlands, although it is much more remote from the Boer settlements.
The reason why I don't believe the Netherlands is interested in African colonies is because the Dutch sold their Gold Coast colonies to Britain in 1871 and did not try to gain any African colonies during the Berlin Conference. It focused almost completely on the Dutch East Indies (trying to conquer Aceh, Bali etc). That is why I believe the Netherlands would not care for African colonies.
 
The reason why I don't believe the Netherlands is interested in African colonies is because the Dutch sold their Gold Coast colonies to Britain in 1871 and did not try to gain any African colonies during the Berlin Conference. It focused almost completely on the Dutch East Indies (trying to conquer Aceh, Bali etc). That is why I believe the Netherlands would not care for African colonies.
That does seem surprising given the closeness of South West Africa to the Boer Republics. However, it is certainly possible that they would have viewed the region as wholly inhospitable and too explensive to maintain with its extreme aridity and lack of water. It is also possible that, if the region’s mineral resources were better known by 1914, that the resource-impoverished Dutch would have seen much more reason to have South West Africa than in 1884.
 
That does seem surprising given the closeness of South West Africa to the Boer Republics. However, it is certainly possible that they would have viewed the region as wholly inhospitable and too explensive to maintain with its extreme aridity and lack of water. It is also possible that, if the region’s mineral resources were better known by 1914, that the resource-impoverished Dutch would have seen much more reason to have South West Africa than in 1884.
Lets assume the Dutch are interested in South West Africa. The heavy lifting in conquering it would most likely be done by British and South African troops. South Africa wanted that territory. Would they be willing to give it up to the Dutch?
 
looking on Maps
I think that Netherlands would take piece out German main land and Colonies
East Friesland would be one option
the Other would be Germans coal deposits near Netherlands borders, like area of town Aachen, Eschweiler and Erkelenz
This give the Netherland more Coal for Industrial use
536px-AachenerRevierKarte1.jpg


On Colonies
So, how about this? The Dutch get the north, the Australians the south and Neu Pommeren and Neu Mecklenburg.
I think in similar lines with option Guinea but also with today The Federated States of Micronesia and Palau (former German Colony)
 
Lets assume the Dutch are interested in South West Africa. The heavy lifting in conquering it would most likely be done by British and South African troops. South Africa wanted that territory. Would they be willing to give it up to the Dutch?
I think it would be unacceptable for the British (and probably the South African) because the policy of the time was to heal the wounds between the boers and the English. A to close presence of theNetherlands would be seen as a disturbing force in this process. The war was too recent and the Netherlands were too sympathic to the boers in that war (and after).
 
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