The one thing that may be butterflied by the British success in Belgium is the Austro-German offensive at Caporetto. Without Caporetto the collapse of Austria Hungary is more likely. It sounds like the situation in Macedonia is more like 1918 than 1917 IOTL so whilst the Germans could repeat the Kaiserslacht they would risk the collapse of Austria-Hungary and consequently Bulgaria a in the Spring as well.

The other option would be to shore up the Southern states with Eastern front troops but that would only delay the inevitable.

Going to be a question of who breaks and when. Russia and Austria are equally battered and whilst it's true that Russia is more important to the allies in terms of manpower, Austria Hungary and the troops facing it are far more threatening to the Germans in the event of a collapse than the Russians are to the Entente. It's not for nothing that the Kaiser said that "....62,000 Serbs had decided the war"
 
So, with von Scheer refusing to send his fleet on a death ride into the Channel, that should butterfly the Willhelmshaven mutiny. And with that gone, will that butterfly the broader German Revolution? In OTL, the mutiny was seen as the spark to set off the revolution. With that gone, will the Kaiser retain his throne?
There will be no mutiny at Wilhelmshaven...
...but don't underestimate Silly Billy.
 
Philip Kerr? Someone else? Or a nameless character never to be seen again?
It wouldn't be him, it's a nameless ambitious parlimentarian, a PPS to this chap: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Stanley,_17th_Earl_of_Derby
and who no doubt has an eye on his next promotion.
I don't name anyone, partly because I don't really like putting words into the mouths of real historical figures - it's very easy to miss some aspect of their personality or viewpoint.

I reasonably satisfied with the way I've done it with Scheer (and it shouldn't be too hard to guess who 'the General' is likely to be), but even so I was second-guessing myself here and there.
 
Of course Scheer might not get the choice of refusing to send the HSF to battle once it has been patched up because it he won't do it in all likelihood the army will try to get the Kaiser to relieve him and find someone who will
 
The one thing that may be butterflied by the British success in Belgium is the Austro-German offensive at Caporetto. Without Caporetto the collapse of Austria Hungary is more likely. It sounds like the situation in Macedonia is more like 1918 than 1917 IOTL so whilst the Germans could repeat the Kaiserslacht they would risk the collapse of Austria-Hungary and consequently Bulgaria a in the Spring as well.
The other option would be to shore up the Southern states with Eastern front troops but that would only delay the inevitable.

Yes, Caporetto is moot. The Italians have been rather more successful in the 11th Battle of the Isonzo, and are currently menacing Trieste.
Spot on in Macedonia.
In both cases, I'm assuming the Austrians have reached the end of their tether earlier, while the Germans have already had to prop them up in the East (against the Kerensky offensive) and are therefore unable to commit resources to the Italian front.

Dreams of the Kaiserschlacht still seem just barely out of reach ... if only the Russians knew they were beaten...
As you say, it might be too late by then anyway.

Going to be a question of who breaks and when. Russia and Austria are equally battered and whilst it's true that Russia is more important to the allies in terms of manpower, Austria Hungary and the troops facing it are far more threatening to the Germans in the event of a collapse than the Russians are to the Entente. It's not for nothing that the Kaiser said that "....62,000 Serbs had decided the war"
Absolutely, and perhaps who thinks what and when.
 
Of course Scheer might not get the choice of refusing to send the HSF to battle once it has been patched up because it he won't do it in all likelihood the army will try to get the Kaiser to relieve him and find someone who will
In due course, his hand will be forced, although in which direction remains to be seen.

The gloomy chairman of the German meeting in that instalment isn't necessarily a naval officer....
(having read it once again, I can see that perhaps isn't very clear).
 
The Rumour is Mightier than the Sword
The Rumour is Mightier than the Sword

Despite the great hopes that followed the British breakthough, in the early weeks of September the front in Belgium showed signs of bogging down once again, as weather and manpower limited the British Army’s ability to keep their troops on the offensive.
New defenses were developing between Antwerp and Brussels, where the German defenders were comparatively well served by their internal railway system, while supplies for the Allied front lines were still being hindered by damage the Germans had done prior to their withdrawal. The German Army was still withdrawing in the south, evacuating parts of France and almost half of Belgium. Nevertheless, they had not been routed, and every step back shortened both the Front and their supply lines.

In the East, recent German advances were even greater than those of the British and French, but had been temporarily halted by a combination of their own success and the urgent need to send reserves to the West. The Russians were in headlong retreat, but the German Army had reached the limits of its own increasingly meagre supply lines.
The Imperial Navy’s support in the capture of Baltic islands and the coastal states themselves had come at a cost. The battleships Thuringen and Baden had been mined, and with other ships still in dock following the abortive operation off Zeebrugge, the Navy had only 15 operational battleships and three battlecruisers. Across the North Sea, the Grand Fleet typically had 30 battleships and 10 battlecruisers operational at any given time.

For some time, the German government had been becoming less united, as the civil leadership began to see that the war was nearing its inevitable end. Even many of the military men had lost the enthusiasm they had at the start of 1917, when they had determined to continue the war by effectively deposing the Chancellor.
In the late summer, quietly and informally, a faction had formed consisting of men who sought a prompt end to the war. It would be wrong to call them traitors or even defeatists, as the group included members of the High Command who continued to direct the fighting, while keeping their close friends and colleagues advised of their progress in finding out what the Allies might accept.
Meanwhile, other members of the leadership were prepared to keep quiet, on the basis that a failed peace attempt would leave them in charge.

On the 9th September, a proposal was made for peace negotiations, via representatives in The Hague. If agreed, a request for a ceasefire was to be followed by peace negotiations with the Western Allies.
However, leaders in both London and Paris had a taste of victory, while the German proposal was far from unconditional. It included a suggestion of a negotiated withdrawal, but it wasn’t entirely clear who was making the offer. Was it an official representative of the German government, or some group within it?
At such a sensitive time there should have been secret talks and back-room agreements, but that was not what happened. Exactly how the news ever made its way out was never discovered, but suspicions fell on either a deliberate German leak, or some indiscretion by the groups of Dutch diplomats who repeatedly crossed into both the Allied and German territory that surround their country.

On the 15th, British soldiers in the lines near Antwerp were abuzz with rumours of a German offer to evacuate Belgium and end the war. Newspapermen in London knew about it too, but the government brought pressure to bear to prevent the story from being published. That didn’t stop word-of mouth, and by the 18th, the word was out on the streets of London, and it was clear that many of the troops in France were well aware of the supposed German offer and the prospect of peace.

German soldiers and sailors knew about it too, and although the rumour didn’t stop the fighting, the malaise that had gripped the German Army since the middle of August only deepened, as each man began to consider just what he was being asked to risk when the war might nearly be over.
The High Command in Berlin became increasingly alarmed at the prospect of losing control of the situation, and plans were put in place for a series of minor operations to ‘put the spirit’ back into the Kaiser’s fighting men. In addition, it was hoped that a few decisive, if minor, victories might help to pressure the Allies into accepting a more Germanic interpretation of what peace should look like.

Ideas for modest offensive action were derailed by the Kaiser himself. Wilhelm II had lost some of his bluster in recent months, but the stabilisation of the lines near Antwerp and the advances in the East had temporarily restored his bravado. He was infuriated to find out that schemes for peace had been started without his knowledge and demanded that the war should continue. He ordered Admiral Scheer to send the Fleet back into the North Sea and launch a new series of raids against the English, while Field-Marshal Hindenburg drew on reserves from the East to throw the Allies back.

Neither man regarded the Kaiser’s demands as realistic, but while the prospect of a negotiated peace with the Allies remained uncertain, they knew it was their duty to continue the war. Scheer therefore prepared fresh plans to bring the enemy to battle through a raid on the Norwegian convoys. A feint would be made to the south, using the hastily patched-up Moltke, Seydlitz and Kronprinz, which were all still at Wilhelmshaven and not in prime fighting condition. Their role was to be spotted to the west of Texel, distracting the British from the High Seas Fleet’s move north.
The rest of the fleet would stay together as it sailed out of the Baltic through the Skaggerak, with Hipper’s three fully operational battlecruisers acting as both close scouts and as a strike force against any convoys that might be encountered. In the event any part of the British Fleet was found, it would be engaged, before seeking a withdrawal either South or East. The action would also cover a mass sailing of U-Boats into the Atlantic, to attempt a shock attack on American troop convoys to France.

Admiral Scheer knew the plan was, at best, of little military value; and at worst, it was hopeless. As he had predicted and feared, the sailors of the fleet proved hostile to what they could all see was a futile and risky operation, particularly given the recent rumours of a peace deal. A few hotheads attempted outright mutiny, but on most ships, calmer heads prevailed. The men would not obey their new orders to attack the British, but they were still proud Germans. To avoid the outright disgrace and dishonour of refusing to fight, the sailors’ committees agreed to resume operations in the Baltic. Scheer was therefore obliged to issue orders that the Fleet remain at Kiel, while preparations were made for a bombardment mission in support of the Army.
With the Fleet now only a partially effective war machine, on the evening of the 17th September, Scheer returned to Berlin to inform the Kaiser that, ‘I cannot command your Majesty’s Navy’.
For once, the pompous, blustering autocrat had nothing to say. The Admiral offered his resignation on the spot, and would later claim in his memoirs that he intended to return to his quarters and take the honourable way out.

However, fate intervened in the shape of Field-Marshal Hindenburg, who choose this moment of crisis to tell the Kaiser that defeat in the West was now practically unavoidable. The front between Antwerp and Brussels had been relatively quiet in recent days, but the British Army was clearly resupplying and would clearly soon resume the offensive. The French Army, once believed to have been almost broken, now appeared to have recovered its fighting spirit, and was clearly being aided by the unexpectedly early arrival of American troops. This trickle of American forces in 1917 would clearly become a flood in 1918, more than replacing any losses the Allies might suffer over the winter.

Meanwhile the German Army and the German nation would only become weaker.
 
Very nicely done. It relates to Churchill's fear in the crisis of 1940 - that any hint of being prepared to talk would destroy the ability to continue fighting via the expectancy of peace. Hence the refusal to engage the Italians as intermediaries.

Here, an earlier generation didn't grasp that - or did, if the leak was deliberate. But the point remains that even those internal discussions of a potential deal became self-fulfilling.
 
I imagine the German Troops will at least continue to defend their own lines... For the moment, at least.

The home front may collapse, however. How is German Socialist ITTL?
 
A Very Orderly Revolution
A Very Orderly Revolution

By the middle of September 1917, Germany was in a weakened but stable position. Short of a miracle, there would be no improvement, but the period of stability might last a few weeks or even months; time enough to come to terms.

At Kiel, Admiral Hipper had replaced Admiral Scheer, but his position was little stronger than that of his former chief. Hipper’s only advantage was that he hadn’t personally ordered the ‘final sortie’ that had triggered the breakdown of discipline. He therefore tried to maintain control by making efforts to ensure that conflicts aboard all ships were avoided. Arrests were made and courts-martial scheduled, but in many cases it was a question of transferring revolutionary hotheads ashore, or to inactive ships (for instance the damaged battleship Thuringen received large numbers of new crewmen, despite the fact that she was still in dock).
Like his predecessor, the new C-in-C could see little value in sacrificing the Fleet in a pointless battle; the Royal Navy itself was stronger than it had been at Stavanger, and it was now known to be backed by an American squadron of at least six battleships.
However, he was not so convinced of the merits of an immediate peace, and therefore pushed hard for a resumption of Baltic operations. The less fervent mutineers (despite his forbearance, Hipper never regarded them as anything else) were willing to fight there, and there were valid military objectives in such action. Consequently, his contempt for the mutineers was held in check by the prospect of regaining undisputed control of the Fleet. An easy victory over Russian gunboats, or a few simple bombardment missions might help to restore the fighting spirit of the men.

In Berlin, the situation was developing faster than at the front. On 18th September, amid furious speculation over the possible end to the war, members of a radical left-wing group attempted to assassinate the Kaiser, while calling for an immediate revolution. Political and paramilitary factions were multiplying across Germany, but by far the strongest contained many of the military leaders, alongside Centrist and moderate Leftist elements in the Reichstag.
Uninjured, but clearly shocked, and never at his best in a crisis, Wilhelm decried the attempted revolution, and attempted to take direct control ‘for the good of the German people’. The trouble was, most of his people could see that he had no future as their leader.

Some thought that the time had now come to replace Wilhelm with his son, or even with Prince Ruprecht of Bavaria. However, as both men were military leaders and neither was committed to an immediate peace, there was resistance from those who wanted to see the war ended. It did not help that this monarchist faction couldn’t agree among themselves which man they wanted.
Other factions were better organised, and on the 22nd, Kaiser Wilhelm II was toppled in a bloodless coup. Senior military officers and Reichstag delegates marched on the palace, backed by thousands of sailors and troops bearing both the German flag and the red flag of revolution.

The next day, the Kaiser's abdication was formally announced. A democratic socialist government had taken over control of the war and of the new German Republic. Their first message to the nation struck a tone that was bombastic, while also warning of the troubles that lay ahead.
‘The German Socialist Government desires only peace among nations. The German people have thrown off past autocracies and inequalities and have embraced democracy with vigour. To secure a glorious future for the Fatherland and for all Germans, we must now be prepared to make terms of peace with our enemies. We shall do so undefeated, thanks to the bravery of German Soldiers and Sailors and the industry of German Workers. Long Live the Fatherland!’

It is one of history’s ironies that the success of these German ‘revolutionaries’ helped to energise groups in Russia who sought to topple their own government. The nominally socialist, but in fact thoroughly bourgeois, German revolution and the subsequent end of the war may have finally triggered what Germany had long sought to engineer; a revolution in Russia.

Following the various leaks in earlier peace discussions, both sides now chose to regard the Dutch with some suspicion. The Allies were suspicious that the Dutch were acting as agents from the Germans, rather than honest brokers, and it suited the new German government to distance themselves from any such suggestion.
On the 23rd September, the German Ambassador in Stockholm was instructed to approach the Swedish government to ask them to broker peace talks with the western Allies.
To the relief of the German provisional government, the Allies were ready to talk.
 
I've always wondered about a WW1 where Peace Talks collapse, and the fighting restarts.

OTL, that was the Eastern Front. both before & after the German defeat in the west. Then there was a two decade 'half-time' before the second half aka Big Mistake II kicked off.
 
I've always wondered about a WW1 where Peace Talks collapse, and the fighting restarts.
I suspect that all parties involved with the possible exception of the Americans (due to their only brief involvement thus far) would face mutinies on the level of the French Army in 1917. Nobody wants to die but especially not because some politicians and diplomats couldn't do their jobs right.
 
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