Did the 'Ratte' tank have ANY useful function?

[The Tai-Pan]

Oh they had plans for absurdly oversized 'cruise-ship-on-land' trains as well, don't you worry.

Breitspurbahn - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Ah yes, the train that had a reading room, sauna and literal slave room.

 

[marathag]

They just didn't have the metallurgy back then

Bucyrus-Erie and Marion Company made huger Walking dragline machine, over 1000 tons after WWII

The tech really hasn't changed much in the past 100 years for these

6000 tons of slow walking fun
Replace dragline and crane with armor and naval rifle

 

[Blue cat]

No, it's fine, it was a weird Hitlerian fantasy, it's okay not to know everything about it.

I'm just thinking that, from the notional dimensions and weight, there's no way it could be moved under anything but its own power, and if you were going to make it a part of a coastal fortification system, you'd create fighting positions for it that it could move to and from as a kind of semi-mobile bunker, and its so absurdly huge that it would surely ruin any normal road it was driven over, so you'd want there to be paths for it to follow from one fighting position to the next.

Yep.. I was sort of envisioning several of them shuttling between a series of prepared positions (probably with strong concrete overhead cover or maybe dug into hill sides or ?) Your comments make sense.

 

[nbcman]

No, it's fine, it was a weird Hitlerian fantasy, it's okay not to know everything about it.

I'm just thinking that, from the notional dimensions and weight, there's no way it could be moved under anything but its own power, and if you were going to make it a part of a coastal fortification system, you'd create fighting positions for it that it could move to and from as a kind of semi-mobile bunker, and its so absurdly huge that it would surely ruin any normal road it was driven over, so you'd want there to be paths for it to follow from one fighting position to the next.

Even the AANW Nazis never built Ratte tanks. The Author did describe a battle against a group of Maus tanks where the Maus tanks' performance proved to be quite lacking.

 

[Roches]

Oh they had plans for absurdly oversized 'cruise-ship-on-land' trains as well, don't you worry.

They have four classes, just like the pre-WW1 ocean liners. That may have, in some sense, prefigured the notion that the Germans were more classist than the British. Also, cruise ships are fun. Even Nazi KdF cruise ships gave everybody ONE cooked egg at breakfast, provided you woke up at 5:00 or 5:30 am for Frühsport, or mandatory morning exercises. 480 seats in a car does not sound fun. It sounds worse than Greyhound.

Just one thing. Multiple 20 mm anti-aircraft guns? If anybody at all is going to be dive-bombing your trains, you shouldn't have trains with 480 slave-laborers to a car, let alone 48 Reichsdeutsche Bauer-Soldaten (farmer-soldiers) with SS ranks on their way to claim their 16 hectares of the Ukraine.

 

[bsmart]

I just dug this little thing out from an old thread about the P.1000 Ratte...
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He sat on the rock and stared at the horizon. Somewhere artillery was thundering away. Tommies, by the sound of it, with those damned belt-fed 25-lbers again. Then he looked up again. No Jabos. Not yet, anyway.

Hearing the sound of swearing diminish a little he walked over to the side of the Landkreuzer and then peered into the hatch. “Well?”

“Sorry sir, the engine should be repaired in a moment or two.” The sergeant wiped his hands on a bit of rag and then looked at him worriedly. “They haven’t changed their minds about taking the flak guns off the top of this thing have they?”

“No.”

“Damn it.” He sighed. “Right. We’re ready sir.”

He nodded wearily and then walked around to the front of the wretched thing. “Start him up Kranz.”

“Yes sir.” A giant red button was pushed and after a moment the huge engine roared into life. “It’s working sir!”

“Get him into gear!”

“Um… yes sir.” There was a groaning noise and then the Landkreuzer crept forward three inches, before there was an almighty bang underneath.

“Damn it, what now?” He walked back to the hatch and then peered in. The sergeant could be seen opening an inspection hatch on the floor. He looked in, swore violently and then closed it again. “It’s buggered sir. Clutch exploded again.”

“What again?”

“Yes sir.”

“How long to repair it?”

“Two days at the factory.”

“Right.” He sighed and then walked to the other end of the Landkreuzer, where a bored looking man was standing with a clipboard. “We’re returning this thing to the factory.”

The man sighed. “You signed for it earlier, you can’t send it back again.”

“I signed for a functioning vehicle. We’ve travelled six feet in six days, during which time we’ve blown two clutches, a drive shaft and three sets of tracks. All to go six feet. And it’s not left the bloody factory.”

“The front of the vehicle is outside the doors, so you’re out of the factory!”

“No it’s not, it’s still in!”

“Strictly speaking it's out, as-”

“Oh shut up and repair it again.” He paused and sniffed. Smoke was pouring out of one of the hatches and he saw the sergeant hurriedly get out of the Landcreuzer. “What’s wrong now?”

“It’s on fire again sir.”

“Bugger – well, put it out again. That’s the third time today.”

“Yes sir.”

He looked back at the man with the clipboard. “Well?”

“Well what?”

“It keeps breaking down and catching fire!”

“Yes, but it’s a war-winning weapon. Have the Amis got anything like it? Have the Reds?”

“No, but it’s useless if it doesn’t bloody work!”

“We’ll patch it up, you’ll be in Paris in a week!”

“It took us a week to get the nose of the damn thing out the door!”

He rubbed at the bridge of his nose for a long moment. At which point there was a ‘schonk’ noise and something groaned inside the giant vehicle. “What now?”

“Secondary backup main gun just fell off again sir.”

“Well, stick it back on again.”

“Can’t, we’ve run out of string sir.”

He looked up at the heavens. And then he sighed and finally gave up. He turned and trudged over to the knot of fascinated men in khaki who had been there all morning. “Alright. I give up. We surrender.”

“Are you sure? We could give you a little more time,” said the British Major.

“No, you’ve been more than fair. It was a bloody silly idea from the start anyway. Takes hours to load the main gun for a start. And as it’s currently pointing towards Hamburg there’s no point in firing it even if it was loaded. You have to turn the entire bloody thing to aim it.” He paused. “What are you going to do with it?”

“I think that someone said that there’s a plan to drop it on Tokyo and end the war.”

He thought about it. “Yes, that should probably do the job.”

You should issue a SPEW alert before putting something like that out. I was drinking a diet soda and now have to clean my keyboard and screen!!! very good!

 

[Dorknought]

No match for giant saw thingy:

 

[Prince Daemon Targaryen]

A post-war Maus tank as a sort of M1 Abrams type supertank against mass produced American tank hordes would make sense, but there's nothing the Ratte could do that a battery of motorized rocket artillery couldn't do better

 

[SealTheRealDeal]

presuppositions:
1) This couldn't be built under wartime conditions, thus requiring a Nazi victory
2) the ASBs that help the Nazis win are an unknown quantity that may turn on Hitler at any moment

The Ratte would be indispensable for the defence of the moon, where its weight wouldn't be a problem, and where the lack of water means there'd be no other way to have mobile large calibre naval rifles.

 

[The Undead Martyr]

In WWI it might not be a complete white elephant due to relative infancy of air power (artillery is another matter). In WWII? Nothing but target practice.

 

[WaterproofPotatoes]

Thinking about this a bit more.. It might have had some marginal usefulness as a mobile heavy gun emplacement that was helping to defend a vital coastal area. Being able to move under its own power might have small degree of usefulness in that type of setting. I doubt however it would have made sense to build them for that application, but if an ASB provided one or more for "free" coastal defence might be a good role ?

Reasonsably well armoured, mobile heavy guns that were moved by the defenders on a random basis might complicate a large scale amphibious attack, although I suspect the allies could have countered them. Still having allied battleships engaging a force of such weapon systems might mean they were not being used to disrupt attacks by conventional Panzer forces.

For that, you can have a railway gun for cheaper, and Krupp traditionally did not accept payment for the first gun!

Krupp K5 11.1"/L76:

You can even use old guns from the last war and put them on railway mountings:

Schwere Bruno 11.1"/L42

 

[Georgepatton]

They have four classes, just like the pre-WW1 ocean liners. That may have, in some sense, prefigured the notion that the Germans were more classist than the British. Also, cruise ships are fun. Even Nazi KdF cruise ships gave everybody ONE cooked egg at breakfast, provided you woke up at 5:00 or 5:30 am for Frühsport, or mandatory morning exercises. 480 seats in a car does not sound fun. It sounds worse than Greyhound.

Just one thing. Multiple 20 mm anti-aircraft guns? If anybody at all is going to be dive-bombing your trains, you shouldn't have trains with 480 slave-laborers to a car, let alone 48 Reichsdeutsche Bauer-Soldaten (farmer-soldiers) with SS ranks on their way to claim their 16 hectares of the Ukraine.

I have to assume that anyone who wanted Hitler to look at something they'd designed needed to put a pile of guns on it to get him to take it seriously?

 

[longtimelurkerinMD]

It's interesting to note how one of the Gniesenaus turrets was installed and is still there today near Trondheim, Norway. It's set up like a giant PAK 40 to take rear shots at ships heading into Trondheim Harbor. It seems like it was put in place with the idea "if you can see the world, the world can see you" and the understanding that that turret was one well placed salvo from the Warspite away from oblivion. Put the Ratte anywhere near a coast and its mince meat for any BB in the area with good spotting. If it isn't taken out by air power, since its basically a stationary target even when it's moving, and it's not like it can hide anywhere if it's stopped either.

 

[M79]

Even the AANW Nazis never built Ratte tanks. The Author did describe a battle against a group of Maus tanks where the Maus tanks' performance proved to be quite lacking.

Not surprising given it weighed over 3x an M1A1 Abrams tank with less horsepower.

 

[Captain Seafort]

I just dug this little thing out from an old thread about the P.1000 Ratte...
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

He sat on the rock and stared at the horizon. Somewhere artillery was thundering away. Tommies, by the sound of it, with those damned belt-fed 25-lbers again. Then he looked up again. No Jabos. Not yet, anyway.

Did anyone else read this and think it was the tank's thoughts? The thing does bear a passing resemblance to a Bolo.

 

[Veiovis]

...really nobody mentioned yet that Ratte wasn't actually a design that even could habe been build with its original specifications? Like how 1000 tons was a laughably to low estimate of its weight, yet even that fantasy weight made it a immobile bunker with tracks only as asthetic bonus?

 

[Impirius]

It does stand as a very good representation of the stupidity of the nazi regime.
Also its a really good meme and it inspired Super heavy tanks in fiction like the Baneblade in warhammer.

 

[USS_Ward]

I just dug this little thing out from an old thread about the P.1000 Ratte...
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

He sat on the rock and stared at the horizon. Somewhere artillery was thundering away. Tommies, by the sound of it, with those damned belt-fed 25-lbers again. Then he looked up again. No Jabos. Not yet, anyway.

Hearing the sound of swearing diminish a little he walked over to the side of the Landkreuzer and then peered into the hatch. “Well?”

“Sorry sir, the engine should be repaired in a moment or two.” The sergeant wiped his hands on a bit of rag and then looked at him worriedly. “They haven’t changed their minds about taking the flak guns off the top of this thing have they?”

“No.”

“Damn it.” He sighed. “Right. We’re ready sir.”

He nodded wearily and then walked around to the front of the wretched thing. “Start him up Kranz.”

“Yes sir.” A giant red button was pushed and after a moment the huge engine roared into life. “It’s working sir!”

“Get him into gear!”

“Um… yes sir.” There was a groaning noise and then the Landkreuzer crept forward three inches, before there was an almighty bang underneath.

“Damn it, what now?” He walked back to the hatch and then peered in. The sergeant could be seen opening an inspection hatch on the floor. He looked in, swore violently and then closed it again. “It’s buggered sir. Clutch exploded again.”

“What again?”

“Yes sir.”

“How long to repair it?”

“Two days at the factory.”

“Right.” He sighed and then walked to the other end of the Landkreuzer, where a bored looking man was standing with a clipboard. “We’re returning this thing to the factory.”

The man sighed. “You signed for it earlier, you can’t send it back again.”

“I signed for a functioning vehicle. We’ve travelled six feet in six days, during which time we’ve blown two clutches, a drive shaft and three sets of tracks. All to go six feet. And it’s not left the bloody factory.”

“The front of the vehicle is outside the doors, so you’re out of the factory!”

“No it’s not, it’s still in!”

“Strictly speaking it's out, as-”

“Oh shut up and repair it again.” He paused and sniffed. Smoke was pouring out of one of the hatches and he saw the sergeant hurriedly get out of the Landcreuzer. “What’s wrong now?”

“It’s on fire again sir.”

“Bugger – well, put it out again. That’s the third time today.”

“Yes sir.”

He looked back at the man with the clipboard. “Well?”

“Well what?”

“It keeps breaking down and catching fire!”

“Yes, but it’s a war-winning weapon. Have the Amis got anything like it? Have the Reds?”

“No, but it’s useless if it doesn’t bloody work!”

“We’ll patch it up, you’ll be in Paris in a week!”

“It took us a week to get the nose of the damn thing out the door!”

He rubbed at the bridge of his nose for a long moment. At which point there was a ‘schonk’ noise and something groaned inside the giant vehicle. “What now?”

“Secondary backup main gun just fell off again sir.”

“Well, stick it back on again.”

“Can’t, we’ve run out of string sir.”

He looked up at the heavens. And then he sighed and finally gave up. He turned and trudged over to the knot of fascinated men in khaki who had been there all morning. “Alright. I give up. We surrender.”

“Are you sure? We could give you a little more time,” said the British Major.

“No, you’ve been more than fair. It was a bloody silly idea from the start anyway. Takes hours to load the main gun for a start. And as it’s currently pointing towards Hamburg there’s no point in firing it even if it was loaded. You have to turn the entire bloody thing to aim it.” He paused. “What are you going to do with it?”

“I think that someone said that there’s a plan to drop it on Tokyo and end the war.”

He thought about it. “Yes, that should probably do the job.”

Oh man, i got a hell of a good laugh outta that

 

[NHBL]

I got a GREAT laugh out of the Ratte story!
It's not een a good place to store surplus 11" turrets from the Twins. The Ratte has two gun turrets, the ships have THREE gun turrets. There is something the Ratte is too small to do.

 

[MrHaakwood]

It used up design, research, resources, materiel and personnel. It was useful.

In helping end the War sooner and defeating the Nazis.

So one piece of paper, two bottles of schnaps & two engineers having a hangover? Thank the lord! Germany might have won, if Schmidt & Müller had not decided to get drunk after work!