While reading What country do you think deserves a wank? I (as born and raised Amsterdammer) immediately thought about a Amsterdam-wank. Musing on this I realised that to wank Amsterdam you don't need the Netherlands to have MORE land (as that would diminish the relative power and influence of Amsterdam) but possibly LESS land or territory. Then I remembered reading a comic serie on Dutch History (called From Zero Till Now (Van Nul tot Nu) and one sentence in particular: "Johan de Witt even wanted to sell the eastern provinces to the Emperor and just trade away behind the Waterline (a system of fortifications and inundations protecting the Provinces of Holland, Utrecht and Zeeland). I've tried to find a good source on this and what I found what a book called "Interest van Holland" written by Peter de la Court with probably a lot of involvement from Johan de Witt. The book can be seen as a machivillian book on Dutch politics and economics of that age.
Reading (parts) of the Interest van Holland gave me inspiration for a Amsterdam-Wank. As said before a Amsterdam-wank needs to get rid of the eastern provinces of Friesland, Groningen, Overijssel, Drenthe and Gelre/Gelderland and the territories of Staats-Brabant, Staats-Opper-Gelre and Staats-Overmaas (Limburg). The reasons for that I'll explain in more detail now:
- The Eastern Provinces have always been Orangist. A Amsterdam-wank cannot succeed with a Stadholder in charge. The Stadholder would always want himself to rule and we want Amsterdam (or it's burghers atleast) to rule here!
-As the Disaster Year of 1672 showed a system of inundations and fortifications can stop a invading army without to much trouble. The Waterline was a stop gap measure in 1672 imagine what a fully prepared Waterline could give in terms of security. It would give this Greater Amsterdam (as I will call the Republic of Holland, Utrecht and Zeeland) a bit of the security Great Britain had being a island. If Greater Amsterdam needs to defend the Eastern Provinces it will have to fight more wars for less profit and more debt.
- If Greater Amsterdam needs to defend the Eastern Provinces it will have to fight more wars for less profit and more debt.
- If Protestant territories in the east get conquered by a Catholic power it could lead to an exodus of the protestants which could in turn give Amsterdam a population boost or a influx of colonists for overseas.
So we need to get Greater Amsterdam out of the Republic or the other way around. For that I have found a couple PODs. Note that there are no PODs from before the Dutch Revolt or after the Disaster Year of 1672. This is because I think that one before the Revolt would change the Amsterdam we all love to much and after 1672 the power of the Stadholder was to big and the chances for economic and geo-political succes to small. I like my Wanks with a dash of realism.
1 - The assasination attempt on William of Orange by Juan de Jáuregui in 1582 succeeds. At this point Duke of Anjou had been invited to become Souvereign of the Netherlands but was unpopular and there were a lot of people who suspected him of ordering the assasination attempt on William. The death of William would give the Duke of Anjou a chance to get more power in more subtle ways then the French Fury. The personality of the Duke of Anjou would make for a pretty unstable political situation. This could lead to the right conditions for our Amsterdam-Wank either through partly occupation by France or by the Spanish. Prince Maurits of Nassau can be a wildcard here: he can suffer death from butterflies or be a way to get the Netherlands to fragment.
While reading What country do you think deserves a wank? I (as born and raised Amsterdammer) immediately thought about a Amsterdam-wank. Musing on this I realised that to wank Amsterdam you don't need the Netherlands to have MORE land (as that would diminish the relative power and influence of Amsterdam) but possibly LESS land or territory. Then I remembered reading a comic serie on Dutch History (called From Zero Till Now (Van Nul tot Nu) and one sentence in particular: "Johan de Witt even wanted to sell the eastern provinces to the Emperor and just trade away behind the Waterline (a system of fortifications and inundations protecting the Provinces of Holland, Utrecht and Zeeland). I've tried to find a good source on this and what I found what a book called "Interest van Holland" written by Peter de la Court with probably a lot of involvement from Johan de Witt. The book can be seen as a machivillian book on Dutch politics and economics of that age.
Reading (parts) of the Interest van Holland gave me inspiration for a Amsterdam-Wank. As said before a Amsterdam-wank needs to get rid of the eastern provinces of Friesland, Groningen, Overijssel, Drenthe and Gelre/Gelderland and the territories of Staats-Brabant, Staats-Opper-Gelre and Staats-Overmaas (Limburg). The reasons for that I'll explain in more detail now:
- The Eastern Provinces have always been Orangist. A Amsterdam-wank cannot succeed with a Stadholder in charge. The Stadholder would always want himself to rule and we want Amsterdam (or it's burghers atleast) to rule here!
-As the Disaster Year of 1672 showed a system of inundations and fortifications can stop a invading army without to much trouble. The Waterline was a stop gap measure in 1672 imagine what a fully prepared Waterline could give in terms of security. It would give this Greater Amsterdam (as I will call the Republic of Holland, Utrecht and Zeeland) a bit of the security Great Britain had being a island. If Greater Amsterdam needs to defend the Eastern Provinces it will have to fight more wars for less profit and more debt.
- If Greater Amsterdam needs to defend the Eastern Provinces it will have to fight more wars for less profit and more debt.
- If Protestant territories in the east get conquered by a Catholic power it could lead to an exodus of the protestants which could in turn give Amsterdam a population boost or a influx of colonists for overseas.
So we need to get Greater Amsterdam out of the Republic or the other way around. For that I have found a couple PODs. Note that there are no PODs from before the Dutch Revolt or after the Disaster Year of 1672. This is because I think that one before the Revolt would change the Amsterdam we all love to much and after 1672 the power of the Stadholder was to big and the chances for economic and geo-political succes to small. I like my Wanks with a dash of realism.
1 - The assasination attempt on William of Orange by Juan de Jáuregui in 1582 succeeds. At this point Duke of Anjou had been invited to become Souvereign of the Netherlands but was unpopular and there were a lot of people who suspected him of ordering the assasination attempt on William. The death of William would give the Duke of Anjou a chance to get more power in more subtle ways then the French Fury. The personality of the Duke of Anjou would make for a pretty unstable political situation. This could lead to the right conditions for our Amsterdam-Wank either through partly occupation by France or by the Spanish. Prince Maurits of Nassau can be a wildcard here: he can suffer death from butterflies or be a way to get the Netherlands to fragment.
2: Destruction of the Dutch army at the Battle of Nieuwpoort thus killing Stadholder Maurits and his successor Frederik Hendrik. Now this would partly discredit the Estates-General and Johan van Oldenbarneveldt in particular but the burghers (or 'Regenten' from now on) do not really rely on a single figurehead as the Orangists do and there will probably not be any good candidate to take on the Orangist cause. There is Willem-Lodewijk Count of Nassau who was the uncle of Maurits and Stadholder of Friesland, Groningen and Drenthe but even though he was a brilliant general I don't think he ever had the ambition to be the top dog of the Republic. The scenario could very well lead to a Great Amsterdam with Spanish conquest of the South and maybe parts of Gelre and Willem Lodewijk taking the rest of the East and the North.
2b - A less obvious POD could be Archduke Albert failing to raise an army to confront Maurits at Nieuwpoort and the Estates-Army succesfully besieging Dunkirk. Politically the Dunkirk-campaign was a total win-win situation for the Stadholder. The Estates were discredited for pushing such a reckless enterprise and the Stadholders star rose because of his victory over the Archduke. The conquest of the pirate nest of Dunkirk would be very beneficial for especially the city of Amsterdam (more merchants make it through and no need for a constant blockade) and could provide a base for actions against France or English interest later on. This would also make a stronger hand for the Estates and Johan van Oldenbarneveldt during the Arminian Question.
3 - The Arminian Question gives plenty of PODs from which we can embark on our quest to Wank Amsterdam.
a - The waardgelders (mercenaries/soldiers in the service of the seperate Estates) do not demobilize on the orders of the Stadholder and (un)civil war ensues. The problem is that Maurits has the Army of the Estates General which is mostly loyal to their commander. The Estates of Zeeland, Utrecht and Holland (and especially the city of Amsterdam) are the ones paying them though so Maurits doesn't have long until his coffers are empty.
b - Maurits dies in the period after he supported the contra-remonstrants and the Estates of Holland, Zeeland and Utrecht refuse to install Frederik Hendrik as Stadholder because of that. Civil War stil ensues.
4 - Willem II, Prince of Orange and son of Stadholder Frederik Hendrik fails to ambush the Spanish Army at Bergen op Zoom in 1643. This makes him much more insecure and eager to grab power by force. When he tries to capture Amsterdam in 1650 his cousin Willem-Frederik of Nassau-Dietz is ordered to storm the city immediately. As per OTL the army gets lost on it's way to Amsterdam and the city is prepared when the army arrives and begins it's attack immediately. The attack fails and things take a more or less OTL route with the coup seemingly succeeding. When Willem II dies later that year however Willem Frederik is universally hated in Holland and especially Amsterdam. This sets the stage for a possible Civil War and break up of the Republic as Greater Amsterdam tries to evict Willem Frederik from his positions in the Northern Provinces.
These are my ideas for the begin point for a Amsterdam-wank. I don't think I've ever made a post or a thread with so much research and length so I'd really appreciate any feedback
Reading (parts) of the Interest van Holland gave me inspiration for a Amsterdam-Wank. As said before a Amsterdam-wank needs to get rid of the eastern provinces of Friesland, Groningen, Overijssel, Drenthe and Gelre/Gelderland and the territories of Staats-Brabant, Staats-Opper-Gelre and Staats-Overmaas (Limburg). The reasons for that I'll explain in more detail now:
- The Eastern Provinces have always been Orangist. A Amsterdam-wank cannot succeed with a Stadholder in charge. The Stadholder would always want himself to rule and we want Amsterdam (or it's burghers atleast) to rule here!
-As the Disaster Year of 1672 showed a system of inundations and fortifications can stop a invading army without to much trouble. The Waterline was a stop gap measure in 1672 imagine what a fully prepared Waterline could give in terms of security. It would give this Greater Amsterdam (as I will call the Republic of Holland, Utrecht and Zeeland) a bit of the security Great Britain had being a island. If Greater Amsterdam needs to defend the Eastern Provinces it will have to fight more wars for less profit and more debt.
- If Greater Amsterdam needs to defend the Eastern Provinces it will have to fight more wars for less profit and more debt.
- If Protestant territories in the east get conquered by a Catholic power it could lead to an exodus of the protestants which could in turn give Amsterdam a population boost or a influx of colonists for overseas.
So we need to get Greater Amsterdam out of the Republic or the other way around. For that I have found a couple PODs. Note that there are no PODs from before the Dutch Revolt or after the Disaster Year of 1672. This is because I think that one before the Revolt would change the Amsterdam we all love to much and after 1672 the power of the Stadholder was to big and the chances for economic and geo-political succes to small. I like my Wanks with a dash of realism.
1 - The assasination attempt on William of Orange by Juan de Jáuregui in 1582 succeeds. At this point Duke of Anjou had been invited to become Souvereign of the Netherlands but was unpopular and there were a lot of people who suspected him of ordering the assasination attempt on William. The death of William would give the Duke of Anjou a chance to get more power in more subtle ways then the French Fury. The personality of the Duke of Anjou would make for a pretty unstable political situation. This could lead to the right conditions for our Amsterdam-Wank either through partly occupation by France or by the Spanish. Prince Maurits of Nassau can be a wildcard here: he can suffer death from butterflies or be a way to get the Netherlands to fragment.
While reading What country do you think deserves a wank? I (as born and raised Amsterdammer) immediately thought about a Amsterdam-wank. Musing on this I realised that to wank Amsterdam you don't need the Netherlands to have MORE land (as that would diminish the relative power and influence of Amsterdam) but possibly LESS land or territory. Then I remembered reading a comic serie on Dutch History (called From Zero Till Now (Van Nul tot Nu) and one sentence in particular: "Johan de Witt even wanted to sell the eastern provinces to the Emperor and just trade away behind the Waterline (a system of fortifications and inundations protecting the Provinces of Holland, Utrecht and Zeeland). I've tried to find a good source on this and what I found what a book called "Interest van Holland" written by Peter de la Court with probably a lot of involvement from Johan de Witt. The book can be seen as a machivillian book on Dutch politics and economics of that age.
Reading (parts) of the Interest van Holland gave me inspiration for a Amsterdam-Wank. As said before a Amsterdam-wank needs to get rid of the eastern provinces of Friesland, Groningen, Overijssel, Drenthe and Gelre/Gelderland and the territories of Staats-Brabant, Staats-Opper-Gelre and Staats-Overmaas (Limburg). The reasons for that I'll explain in more detail now:
- The Eastern Provinces have always been Orangist. A Amsterdam-wank cannot succeed with a Stadholder in charge. The Stadholder would always want himself to rule and we want Amsterdam (or it's burghers atleast) to rule here!
-As the Disaster Year of 1672 showed a system of inundations and fortifications can stop a invading army without to much trouble. The Waterline was a stop gap measure in 1672 imagine what a fully prepared Waterline could give in terms of security. It would give this Greater Amsterdam (as I will call the Republic of Holland, Utrecht and Zeeland) a bit of the security Great Britain had being a island. If Greater Amsterdam needs to defend the Eastern Provinces it will have to fight more wars for less profit and more debt.
- If Greater Amsterdam needs to defend the Eastern Provinces it will have to fight more wars for less profit and more debt.
- If Protestant territories in the east get conquered by a Catholic power it could lead to an exodus of the protestants which could in turn give Amsterdam a population boost or a influx of colonists for overseas.
So we need to get Greater Amsterdam out of the Republic or the other way around. For that I have found a couple PODs. Note that there are no PODs from before the Dutch Revolt or after the Disaster Year of 1672. This is because I think that one before the Revolt would change the Amsterdam we all love to much and after 1672 the power of the Stadholder was to big and the chances for economic and geo-political succes to small. I like my Wanks with a dash of realism.
1 - The assasination attempt on William of Orange by Juan de Jáuregui in 1582 succeeds. At this point Duke of Anjou had been invited to become Souvereign of the Netherlands but was unpopular and there were a lot of people who suspected him of ordering the assasination attempt on William. The death of William would give the Duke of Anjou a chance to get more power in more subtle ways then the French Fury. The personality of the Duke of Anjou would make for a pretty unstable political situation. This could lead to the right conditions for our Amsterdam-Wank either through partly occupation by France or by the Spanish. Prince Maurits of Nassau can be a wildcard here: he can suffer death from butterflies or be a way to get the Netherlands to fragment.
2: Destruction of the Dutch army at the Battle of Nieuwpoort thus killing Stadholder Maurits and his successor Frederik Hendrik. Now this would partly discredit the Estates-General and Johan van Oldenbarneveldt in particular but the burghers (or 'Regenten' from now on) do not really rely on a single figurehead as the Orangists do and there will probably not be any good candidate to take on the Orangist cause. There is Willem-Lodewijk Count of Nassau who was the uncle of Maurits and Stadholder of Friesland, Groningen and Drenthe but even though he was a brilliant general I don't think he ever had the ambition to be the top dog of the Republic. The scenario could very well lead to a Great Amsterdam with Spanish conquest of the South and maybe parts of Gelre and Willem Lodewijk taking the rest of the East and the North.
2b - A less obvious POD could be Archduke Albert failing to raise an army to confront Maurits at Nieuwpoort and the Estates-Army succesfully besieging Dunkirk. Politically the Dunkirk-campaign was a total win-win situation for the Stadholder. The Estates were discredited for pushing such a reckless enterprise and the Stadholders star rose because of his victory over the Archduke. The conquest of the pirate nest of Dunkirk would be very beneficial for especially the city of Amsterdam (more merchants make it through and no need for a constant blockade) and could provide a base for actions against France or English interest later on. This would also make a stronger hand for the Estates and Johan van Oldenbarneveldt during the Arminian Question.
3 - The Arminian Question gives plenty of PODs from which we can embark on our quest to Wank Amsterdam.
a - The waardgelders (mercenaries/soldiers in the service of the seperate Estates) do not demobilize on the orders of the Stadholder and (un)civil war ensues. The problem is that Maurits has the Army of the Estates General which is mostly loyal to their commander. The Estates of Zeeland, Utrecht and Holland (and especially the city of Amsterdam) are the ones paying them though so Maurits doesn't have long until his coffers are empty.
b - Maurits dies in the period after he supported the contra-remonstrants and the Estates of Holland, Zeeland and Utrecht refuse to install Frederik Hendrik as Stadholder because of that. Civil War stil ensues.
4 - Willem II, Prince of Orange and son of Stadholder Frederik Hendrik fails to ambush the Spanish Army at Bergen op Zoom in 1643. This makes him much more insecure and eager to grab power by force. When he tries to capture Amsterdam in 1650 his cousin Willem-Frederik of Nassau-Dietz is ordered to storm the city immediately. As per OTL the army gets lost on it's way to Amsterdam and the city is prepared when the army arrives and begins it's attack immediately. The attack fails and things take a more or less OTL route with the coup seemingly succeeding. When Willem II dies later that year however Willem Frederik is universally hated in Holland and especially Amsterdam. This sets the stage for a possible Civil War and break up of the Republic as Greater Amsterdam tries to evict Willem Frederik from his positions in the Northern Provinces.
These are my ideas for the begin point for a Amsterdam-wank. I don't think I've ever made a post or a thread with so much research and length so I'd really appreciate any feedback
